Re the rear axle seals, I would strongly reccomend you order them from MACs. I thought I was in a hurry and ordered mine from the local Piston ring dealer...they ended up costing almost $60 each before taxes. Some rush....I still haven't installed one of them, and of course, have since found three NOS ones hiding in my hoarded boxes of parts.

Poor, but happy
 

I am Happy! I can understand all you packrats, I am a recovering packrat myself. When you restore a vehicle you soon realize that what is most enjoyable is not the finished product as much as the effort getting there. It is funny what some people consider enjoyable. Being covered in grease, smashing a finger, dropping a drum on your foot, hiking thru snow or mud looking for a part you don't really need, but have to have. And once your done, you can't wait to do it all over again.

Anyway. I will give Macs a try. Fortunately I will only need seals in the rear end. Still full of grease. Although, so was the brake drum. This is where you get covered in grease, hands are slippery and the drum slips out of your hands and lands on your foot(see above). :D I've come to like grease, it keeps the rust away.

Bob. In the manual the part show #2240 and on Dirk's site there is 2240-C01Q or 2240-C11Q. Or the spacer #1193, there are 8 different 1193 spacers listed on Dirk's. I will send him a message again, he hasn't replied yet.

Thanks
Phil

Better greasy than rusty...
 

Hi Phil

On the same axle one side was greasy and easy to take apart....messy but easy..... on the dry side it was a bi*** with everything rust welded...... count your blessings....

Will check the parts listings I have Thursday nite and get back to you.....

Stay warm....

Bob

Staying warm
 

If we get any warm weather from out west, I'll send it down east for you. It was a beautiful day today, sunny and no wind, even with the -22C.

The cable fitting is for the left hand side. Finally remembered to check that.

Phil

Re: Poor, but happy
 

Hi Phil,

Your parts are ready for "take off", but I'm waiting for your truck details. C11Q - C29Q - C01Q -
C118Q etc. 1193 parts are total diffirent, my question is always please sent me the right code and
numbers or what type of CMP truck you have. Thanks Phil and also you Bob for your optimistic advise !

Mvg. Dirk

http://212.79.246.244/5800/home.nsf/PartsToPhill.jpg

Dirk I sent you a PM inquiring about a couple of cmp parts and I'm just checking if you got the PM.

Max

Kayrapp........
 

...or bawlsheet.... as they would say in Texas.

Just almost finished writing a very long response to Dirk and Phil and lost my A** OL connection and lost everything....and at my age can't remember.... but it was good.....

Let try again....

Phil... I may be way over my head in this but I am trying to learn to use the books...... I will bow my head to the greater experience of Dirk.

Based on what you said Phil, you have the 4 7/8 Rzeppa....C11Q-3350A2 or XXXX 51A2

In reading my Furd Illustrated Army Parts Catalogue 1940-42 published in January 1942..... on the pull out folded page between page 58 and 59...... the 4 7/8 Rzeppa is a C11Q and the C11Q 2240 retainer should be the correct one.

The C01Q is for the smaller Rzeppa of 4 7/16 axle.......

The C29Q quoted by Dirk... I could not find....

The C118Q is the largest 6 inch Rzeppa for the, I assume, C and F 60 series.......

The part 1193 is a different part like Dirk said......
NOTE....it is not shown in the 40-42 part manual but is listed....

I searched to see where it would fit... then looking at Dirk's picture I recognized the two big spacer in the bottom RH corner.... seen them odd balls before..... you know where... inside the front axle on the very odd HUP 1945 that Rob is rebuilding...... I found a diagram of its location... appropriately enough in the MB F2 shop manual..... seem they come in various sizes from 2.060 to 2.120 in .005 increments.

Now a question for Dirk..... in the top RH corner... what is inside that big glob of grease.... bearings or the large seals for the front
axle...???

Question for Phil... do you have the two 1193 spacers in your Furd...?

Questions for our other esteemed Aussie friends who for some weird reason prefer Furds...... do all front axles in Furd have that 1193 spacer...??? and how the heck do you decide on size for adjustment...?

Thanks for your patience.... I am trying hard to learn.

Finally Phil... that rear axle brake fixture that holds the E brake is very fragile when rusted... so you have the left side and you need a right side....... will need to check what I have.. that are good... a lot of them have been brazed with bronze that I can remember.... will keep you posted.

Dirk seems to have all the goodies you need... even the New Departure #928 pivot bearings......

Now tell us your "Happy"

Phew....made it this time.

Bob

Dirk. Sorry for all the trouble I am causing. There was a big grin on my face when I saw the picture of all those parts. I have a few more parts to add to the list. I'll try to find what spacer I need.

Bob. Thanks for all the work you are doing for me.

When I took apart my axle there were no spacers (1193) in either side. Nothing to compare with.
Today I found a letter 'H' stamped in the hub and I noticed one of the spacer numbers was 1193H-C11Q.
For anyone. Is the stamped 'H' on the hub have any importance?

Here are the spacers available:
1193H-C11Q
1193(I)-C11Q
1193J-C11Q
1193G-C11Q
1193L-C29Q
1193B-C21Q
etc.
Anyone know if the letters mean different thickness or shape.

I need the brake fitting for the left hand side.

That big piece in the top RH is a crankshaft pulley. Dirk has anything you need. I keep adding to the list.

Thanks again Bob.

Phil
:) :)

This is fun.....
 

Hi Phil

When you say the hub is stamp what part are you talking about?? the egg cup ...or the cast part that pivots aorund the egg cup.....???


The 1193 G is 2.090
the 1193 H is 2.095
1193 I is 2.100
1193 J is 2.105... the letter is code for thickness....

1193 C29Q..... and C21Q I cannot find in my book......

Now I am totally confused... not unusual.... Phil you say that when you took your axle apart it did not have the large 1193 spacer....... are you sure you need one???......... if it was not there in the first place...... was the vehicle running before without it..?? any evidence the axle was taken apart by a previous owner..??? could you have a later or earlier design that did not have the 1193 spacer.??? really anxious to hear from the Australian fellas who work a lot on Ford...... my question is still... do ALL Ford front axle have that spacer.???

Why would a Chev cast axle set up for a 1945 Chev Hup have similar spacers..??? and not with RZeppa.....


...and which side brake fitting do you NEED...?

Lets keep at it.... we're not licked yet!!!

BooB

1193
 

In some blitz's you find 1193 and some you don't. I have run a FORD for years without 1193 and I just ajusted the bearings untill the wheel turned nice and sweet and then locked the nut in place
Max

Hi Bob and Max. In the photo the red H is where the 'H' was stamped. My axle looks like it has been worked on. Marked and banged up inside.

Sorry for confusing. My axle did Not have the spacers. Like you say, maybe it never originally had them. I wanted to make sure before I put it together.

Max, if you did not use one maybe mine never had one. The type of driving I will be doing, it likely doesn't need a spacer.

Bob, I need the left side brake fitting.

I was looking on Macs site for cables and found a roller for the steering sector shaft that I needed. It is a kit, comes with the roller and pin. Thanks for giving me their name.

Phil :)

what purpose does it serve.....
 

Hi Max

From my limited experience with a 1193 on Rob's HUP it seems to act as a spacer betweent he rear and front bearings of the front hub...... so they are part of what is being squeezed and preloaded on the bearings when you adjust the front wheel bearings.......

For all practical purposes the Chev as an identical(probably all Ford made) front unit from the 8 bolt flange outboard.....

which begs to be asked.... if the 1193 spacer is not in place how to the front wheel bearings get adjusted.... what squeezes them together.... what holds the cone bearings tight in place.......

I have a cutaway of the king pin front end and the driven front end of the 4x4.... I will need to study that again to see how it works.....

any other takers.....????

That's the hub....
 

will check the hubs I have for any stampings of letters....

Brake fitting left side..... got you.....

The confusing part in this hobby is we never knwo for sure what was modified by some backwood farmer/mechanic to keep them running...... who knwos what is original anymore.....

Bob

Re: That's the hub....
 

Certainly not your spelling... :D :p

Re: That's the hub....
 

I think i have some pictures of some of the farmer fixes on my truck. I'll try and find them. There was the drive shaft used as an exhaust pipe. And someone had formed a piece of angle iron to create a support for the roof and windshield. It was actually quite a work of art. One piece of iron ran from the bottom of the firewall/ doorframe up and around the top of the roof. Welded all the way. Its a real bi#%h removing it.

Phil

Very interestink.....
 

When one considers the weakness of the cab/windshield on a cab 11 this is quite an improvement and not badly done either..... not original but it doubles as a rain gutter as well.

How many cutting wheels did you use to remove it....??

How did they connect the exhaust in the transmission for the exhaust gases to flow in the drive shaft...????.......hihihi

Booob

PS... I checked 4 front brake drums and could not find any letters stamped on the inside..... maybe my truck was illeterate....ill - iterate..... sorry Jiff.....

Re: what purpose does it serve.....
 

Bob to me it seems to be a method of preloading the bearings using the shims as adjustments for the bearing clearances ,by doing this when you tighten up the nut on the end of the shafts it locked tight the centre race of the bearings so there couldn't be any movement. I've often wondered over the years with these old trucks that when the bearings were to be adjusted and whoever was doing the job had no shims for adjustment so they just left the spacers out. If you have no shims or spacer and adjusted the bearings the bearings will end up in the same position on the shaft anyway and it's a lot easier to adjust the bearings, just have to make sure the nut n the end of the shaft is well secured.

In the very first front axles that were used the cv joint didn't have a ground shoulder on the inside side and they used a spring and plunger or shimming method on the very inside ends of the axles, the only reason I can think of they would've used this method would have been to push out on the axle to hold the cv joint firm together. Never seen any of these early cv joints down under.

Does this make it any clearer or are you all even more confused? because I can easily get confused myself these days.

Max

Thanks Max....
 

........ the confusing part for me is if it worked well as a spacer to exactly preload the bearings how come it works well when you re-assemble without it........ in the Chev MB C2 they talk about adjusting the bearing using ONLY the large external big nut that holds the brake drum... they make no mention of the "1193 spacer and shims"....... it seems to me that the internal cone bearing is held in place by the center piece of the brake drum....simialrly the outside cone bearing is held against the bearing race located at the outer edge of the 6 inch projecting hub and all is held tight, with preload by the large external nut when tightening the brake drum...... almost like a front axle circa 1970..... tighten so it is stiff to turn..... back off to the nearest cotter pin hole.... pin in place and test to see if it turns freely....

Always thought it was easy until I did my front bearing on a 1971 Pontiac Bonneville...... and snapped the front axle.... bearing too tight...... at 2 am on the TransCanada outside of Moncton.... what saved me was the snow storm I was driving in allowed to skid gracefully to the side of the road with the wheel tucked inside the front fender....Yeck

Bob

Bob we just adjust the preload on the front axles without a spaceer the same way as we have adjusted the front axles on 2 wheel drive blitzes .I wonder what dodges and jeeps have in their front hubs as I haven't taken any notice.

Max

That sounds faintly disgusting, Max, been into the sauce, have we? Now be a good lad and go let Em back into the garden, there's a good chap.

:sheep:

Just discovered....
 

Max..... while looking for something else in a 1958 GM manual I stumbled ona sectio that shows the NAPCO rom wheel drive set up for Chev trucks....

Diagram shows them using a Rzeppa joint..... and... they have a spacer set up between the two bearings....... and this is 1958....

No time now but will try to scan and post....

.....always learning and no end in sight.

Boob