Crooked white star
 

On a lot of photos it shows the White Star recognition symbol (of WW2) on Canadian vehicles in Europe at a slight angle.

Was this Common practice or just on the occasional vehicle?

Also I have seen both the star and roundel used as air recognision on the roof of vehicles in Europe.

Which was more common on Canadian vehicles, the roundel or the white star?

cheers
Cliff:salute:

Re: Crooked white star
 

Cliff,

I believe this is was the Canadian soldiers way of objecting to have the "symbol of US forces" on their vehicles. Some were applied with point downwards.

No doubt the Canadians on this forum have got a fuller story on this.

Richard

Steve Guthrie found an interesting tidbit about this subject in 2002 - see the thread White Star on the old MLU forum. Here's hoping Steve can repost the drawing attached to the instructions here...

H.

http://www.mapleleafup.net/vehicles/...s/wreck_08.jpg
Source: http://www.mapleleafup.net/vehicles/.../wreck_04.html

White Star drawing..
 

Hello Hanno

Here it is

Steve

The Churchill AVRE at Bovingdon appears to have a crooked star on its turret top much as per the Canadian vehicles. Perhaps the dislike of having a US marking was shared.
Picture from Bovingdon web site enclosed

Thanks for the answers guys. I really appreciate it.

cheers
Cliff:salute:

See this interesting pic on eBay: WWII Allied STAR ID Canada Post Truck Pre-D-Day Photo Item number: 6584331830
Attachment 106536

Postal what?
 

Hi there

3rd Div postal unit had a AoS of '80' white on black, 4th Armd Dive had a '44' ditto. 2 Corps was '84'

Can someone see under the censor's mark?

It should be a formation sign, but which one?

I wonder what the date is? May 1944 jives with the 'Liberation Star' but what about the Field Service cap the squaddie is wearing?

I wonder why the US Army Signal corps took a picture of one of our trucks?

Steve

How's this for making clear who you are?!?!

I guess if I was driving a GERMAN truck through Europe in the later stages of the War, I would also have BIG recognisable Allied markings too.
I think it's an Opel Blitz.
Regards Rick

I note that the Chev has the "Inboard" clearance lights, my C60S's have the holes for both, Hmmmm.....wonder if it was to do with the fitment of the raiator condensor? Just thought of that, it's always bugged me.
Rich

It is a Steyr 1500 ?? :)

Yes, the Steyr 1500A light truck.

Canadian objection to the Liberation star?
 

Can anyone provide evidence that any Canadian, or British, soldier objected to the Liberation star because it was perceived as American?

There was annoyance among British soldiers about Yanks taking their women, but Canadians did that as well.

There were jibes about Americans being overpaid, oversexed and overhere, answered by Americans saying Brits were underpaid, undersexed and underike.

But I never heard the Liberation star being called American. The need for it was obvious, and there was no alternative, was there?

Neither were the white D-Day stripes painted on all aircraft, to my knowledge, ever described as being American.

Stars and stripes for ever? I don't think it occurred to anyone, and, if it did, no one minded.

They had bigger things on their mind - such as staying alive.

Tony

I believe the correct term for the Star, be it White, Yellow, with a circle or without is the "Allied Recognition Sign".

The first use of the circle around the star was for operation 'Husky', the invasion of Sicily in July 1943. The recommended colour of that circle was YELLOW. If yellow was not available then white, red or blue in that order.

One Dodge Weapons Carrier here in OZ, had the yellow circle and the name 'Umpire' on the hood, until the owner restored it and just put the white circle. Thus destroying it's authentic provenance.

The American Armoured Corp, did not like removing their pre-war Yellow Star if favour of the ordered White Star. This order came through in December 1942. Infact General Patton kept the Yellow Star on his Scoutcar, Halftrack and Dodge right through the war.

I have a listing of some of the order numbers for the changes to the Allied Signs through WW2, but as I am shifting house, they are boxed up and put somewhere to be re-discovered at a later time.

Hope this helps.
Regards Rick

US Star
 

I talked to a few Vets who did not like the US Star on their vehicles.

Before D-Day the Canadians and British troops used something similar to the RAF Roundal. It did not stand out as much as the Star and therefore was not as nice of a target to shoot at.

From my understanding the US Forces in Italy were the only ones to use the Star. It was also on all of their vehicles in the UK. The Vets refered to it as the US Star, not the Invasion or Allied star.

They placed the star on the angle to show that they were not US Forces. They also took every oppertunity to muddy, subdue, or paint over it once in the field.

Thanks

Eric

They also painted the circle around the star much wider (and the star much smaller) to emphasise the difference.

Most Canadian troops REALLY hated having the US insignia on their vehicles - remember that the No. 1 threat/invasion scenario (from the War of 1812, through the Fenian Raids up until the US actually entered the war in 1941) was an American invasion of Canada and to this day the quickest way to recieve a fist in the mouth is to call a Canadian soldier a 'yank'.

Nothing personal, y'unnerstand - we just aren't and don't want to be Americans.

Accents
 

That's why we listen closely to an accent before hazarding a guess about where someone is from. When in doubt it's always safer to say: 'You're from Canada aren't you?'

invasion star
 

thats all very well but technicly your both north-americans...regards malcolm :fry:

...and ONE day we'll have 50 new provinces!

then as now the adoption of an 'American' insignia was a defensive measure against 'friendly fire' incidents involving US aircraft.

invasion star
 

an old WW2 Veteran once told that when the Luftwaffe flew over they didnt bother taking cover or even the RAF...but when the USAF flew over....everybody took cover :note: :note: :note:regards malcolm

It would be funny if it wasn't usually tragic: the INFALLIBLE way to get the lads to speed up digging any defensive position is to say "Oh and by the way, we have American air support!"

They start digging like bloody badgers!

U.s. Star marks allied invasion vehicles
 

Source: http://www.surfacezero.com/g503/show...at=3020&page=2

War Diary reference
 

From the War Diary of the 27th Canadian Armoured Regiment 30 Jun 44:

Here is a nice story about the allied recognition star: "When the liberators drove into Hillegom, The Netherlands, this reportedly moved Jan Berbee very much. So when he got his own transport company back on the road, he adorned his cars with the five-pointed star for many years. As a tribute to the Americans, Canadians and Englishmen who risked their lives for the people in the Netherlands."

The photo shows some of their trucks in the 1990s, the star has been dropped from their current livery.

Attachment 111743

C8A with 2nd TAF, Normandy 1944. Notice how the white star is “squeezed” making it look thinner.

Attachment 116225

Crooked white star
 

For some years I have been under the impression, perhaps mistaken, that somewhere, sometime, there was a Canadian order that their white stars were to be painted with one point facing forward (whereas the normal for other nations was with one point facing upward). The 'point forward' placing does make it look as f the star is just a little different from the normal. But the reason could just be that there was an order for this to be done.
Chris

The first two pics support that thought...

10 days later the template was changed
 

Tim Bell posted the same document 2D/9-6-2, HQ 2 Cdn Inf Div, but dated 26 April 44. Interestingly, it has another version of the template for the white star attached.

Attachment 130612 Attachment 130613

I believe I’ve found definitive proof that the Canadians painted their stars on straight…

All Canadians, whether they have been aware of it or not, are personally acquainted with this man of many moods and misfortunes. For Herbie IS the Canadian Army. He is the ambassador-at-large who almost missed the troop train for Halifax, was less one crown and anchor board on arrival overseas, got lost in the London Underground, drunk in the Queens’s at Aldershot, failed to salute the flag car at Leatherhead, holed up with a simply delightful English family on Exercise Spartan and was unholed by the provost. He was first in the bully beef barter queue in Sicily, thrown for a loss by vino rosso, midwife at a Bambi OS birth in Italy, stubbed his toe on the Normandy beach and became D-Day’s first casualty thereby. He fought and franc’d his way through France and Belgium, fell into an Amsterdam canal, thought V2 fluid was hopped-up Calvados, was brought back to life, cautioned the postal corps to strike him off strength and came home…

Call it fact. Call it fiction. Call it Herbie

Now since Herbie’s truck had a straight painted star, there surely was no conspiracy to paint them crooked, otherwise Herbie would most definitely have been in on it.

The above was inspired by an individual on Facebook who was adamant that the Canadians always painted their star’s crooked.

Attachment 130732