When Restorers hit the wall.
 

Greetings fellow restorers,
I wish to ask the world wide MLU community for some helpful suggestions.
I am about to hit the wall and wish to soften the blow with some helpful advice.
Don’t be coy, I’ve known some of you guys for over 10 years now.

This is a situation that I know occurs across the world, I’m sure even in other Galaxies, how to talk some old bastard into parting with something you need but he wants to be buried with.

I’m sure that most restorers have had this problem at one time, that impossible to find part staring you in the face when all that stands in front of you is some Grey Haired Hoarder.

Grey Haired Hoarders are easy to identify, they say the same things, only the dialect is different;

“I’m going to do that up one day”
( Ik ga dat omhooggaande op een dag doen)

“It use to be my father’s/ uncle /brother/
(Es verwendet, Onkel /brother/ zu sein meiner Väter)

“My son is going to restore it”
(meu hovercraft está cheio das enguias)

“When I retire I’ll have more time, I’m only 87”
(var är schoolgirlsna?)

And my personal favorite… “I’ve only got nine so you can’t have it”
나는 저것을 빨기 위하여 려고 하고 있지 않다

Some people may say clever politically correct things like “well he owns it so he can do whatever he wants with it” but restorers see red when they see rust. (that’s why rust is red.)

People say money talks, not in Military Vehicle collecting my friends.
Even the Wheatcroft and Littlefields of the collecting world meet the Grey Haired Hoarder, only on a different level. Remember watching Tank Overhaul? According to these collectors the most sort after tank in the world is a Panther.
Seems all the Grey Haired Hoarders are going to do up Tiger Tanks one day.

It appears that some restorers have better negotiation methods than others.
Please share your years of experience with other collectors.
I’d like to hear how you prized that sort after part from that cold dead hand and can give me some advice when I next tackle the GHH.

PS. I need parts for a 1917 FWD Model B (US Wisconson T Head)
This has nothing to do with the above monologue what so ever.

First rule is: Stay away from Babelfish; - Some of your translations are likely to get more than you think you may be bargaining for.

And the other GHH quote you forgot is: "It's going to be worth a lot of money one day". (I was told this when inspecting a GPW with a sapling growing through a rust hole in the rear floor!)

But seriously, I know of a chap who has got good dividends by returning to a previous owner with a fresh restoration job to show that it has "Gone to a good home" and providing the PO with a ride around the Block/Paddock. Show that you have done a quality restoration, and tried to incorporate some of the owner's history into the record of the vehicle. Word of your good reputation will spread and projects will mysteriously appear at your door. Showing other owners of a particular rarity photos or other records of what you do during a restoration shows that you intend to faithfully respect the history of the vehicle, and that the time and effort you put into it means that you will never turn a quick buck on his cherished possesion. Nothing irks a Seller more than thinking that they have sold something too cheaply and someone else has made a profit from their mistake.

ford
 

In the mid 80's , I was chasing a army 1940 Ford O1Y roadster cab 1 Tonner .... in reasonable shape , it had nice straight front end panels grill and cab, but ute body on it only good as a pattern. The owner , around 60 , lived in a bungalow on his own , had never restored anything in his life , was surrounded by many 1930's and 40's trucks he had scavenged ... these were the vehicles of his youth. He left the O1Y out in the weather where it slowly disintegrated ..the ute sides fell off because the timber frame rotted away, the cab floor rusted out . As far as I know , it is still there. He had some nice CMP's there , including an amazing C60 cab 13 , in original WW2 faded paint...a very original unmolested truck. And a neat C15A ex bush fire truck that ran like a swiss watch. Don't know what became of his treasures .
Mike

Holdouts
 

This is all too true. I remember the time I spotted a GM dash jewel on a 12 cab wreck, probably the only salvageable part on it. Neither the truck nor any of it's parts was for sale. Except to the metal scrapper that got the whole lot a few weeks later. Then there was a pair of brothers with a lot of nice CMP and carrier stuff somewhere in the near north of Ontario. They never sold anything because, if they, did, the visits from prospective buyers would stop. They liked the company. The only nice thing I can say is that a lot of stuff has been saved because of these hold outs.

Its sad that there are so many people like that, many things are lost that way....

It took me 3 years of negotiations, before I could get my scammell, the only reason why I got of him, was that it was stored out side... He didnt have any more room indoor, the barn was filled with 200+ rare and old cars and trucks. the scammell was the first thing he had sold.
I also have one eksampel of: " it was my fathers, a 38 opel olympia" and one "I’m going to do that up one day, a 68 camaro" in my neighborhood.... both to far gone now sad

Collecting in not the same thing as accumulating
 

I bought a rifle from a good friend who bought it from a wily old Saskatchewan farmer. Wayne said he never saw so much junk as he saw in that guy's yard. It was like nothing he ever bought ever left the property. Wayne even joked that there might even be an old breaking blow from when the first settlers cut the first furrows for planting. The difference is not in just buying up any old junk, but having a plan or a program when choosing. But not selling stuff is often a fear of being taken advantage of.

Hey, I know that guy!
 

Yep, there's a C8A PERS-3 that I and others have looked at, as well as a C60 that need good homes, but the reply to those who have inquired is 'gonna restore it myself' (never gonna happen) or alternatively a selling price comparable to the weight of engine in gold.

There's also a C8 hulk sitting mouldering away, and the last time I checked, offering good cash money to remove what is only an eyesore to the present possessors, the reply was 'I'll have to think about it."

I was also once verbally abused by an old crank just for *looking* at a 15cwt that sitting by the road on his auto scrapyard.

Everyone has these stories.

GGH Register
 

Maybe I should start a register of known Grey Haired Hoarders...
A register could alert others restorers not to waste their time...
A register could notify of Auctions when the GHH dies...
A register could reveal how much the scrap dealer paid the wife...


Thanks for the tip Tony, I get my translations from a Hungarian Phrase Book.

I think Bruce is onto something with his theory about having company.

This weekend I'm heading north to see several fellow restorers who are, refreshingly, the opposite to the GHH. These are blokes who restore vehicles, are free with their time, advice and will swap/trade parts and are happy to see someone else get another military vehicle on the road... some of them even have grey hair.

When restorers hit the wall
 

I was and probably still am the biggest collecter in Northern Alberta from lamps to construction equipment .Try this on the won't sell guys . Get the largest dollar bills you can get .I use to get $1000 bills but now it is hard to get $500s .I play with them all the time I am talking to the guy .When the deal starts to fizzel I slowly start putting the money in my wallet .When he sees the money disappearing they might change their mind .Another one that might work is Trading . Find out what he likes and get something that he might trade for .A lot of the old fellows don't need money but might like what you could trade him . I agree alot of the old guys like" museum"buddys .Trust has alot to do with it .I had a young fellow that wanted a muscel car that I had .He begged me for a year . When I sold it to him for $1500 because that was all the money he had , I later found out he sold it for a hansome profit less than a year later .So guess what the next buyer was told . I don't bug guys much but sometime its a good idea to keep in touch as soone or later it will be sold

Originally found in 1980
 

Hello all you other grey haired hoarders. I found this truck in 1980 in a corner of a stone barn used by a haulage contractor as his truck workshop. The owner proudly told me he was going to restore it before he retired. I guess he was in his early Sixties even then.
As i could not afford to pay a big price I said if you ever decide to sell I am interested and left it at that, Many years later I was chatting to a Truck sales man who used to be an operater of heavy trucks in the same area, Talking about who we both knew and about my hobby of rerstoring old Land rovers, I mentioned the Old barn and the restoration project that I had found there years ago. I was amazed to find that 15 years later the truck was still in same place. The owner of the barn had finally retired aged 76 and had been made a substantial offer for the land that the barn was on by a building development group wanting to put up a community centre.
The following week I got a phone call from the truck sales man saying if I still wanted to bid on the Project truck and any spares that the barn held then I needed to get over in next couple of weeks and make an offer.
As the Photo indoors shows it was worth saving.For those wondering, I did not restore the Project chassis as I would have had to buy an Engine, gearbox, and build a body.
I did source many of the parts that I needed but as stated in the earlier posts, Wrecks attract wrecks and a neighbour said, Theres one of those for sale up the road and guess what, I went, I saw I thought but only Briefly and I bought a bodied vehicle [a runner no less] It needed a cab rebuild as it was rusty in to many places, See Pic of Cab As i Reverse off Street .So the project vehicle became a Donor and it has since donated its Cab and Front bumper plus many other smaller parts to the benefit of my F60S LAAT. After I had finished taking the parts off it that I needed the Rolling chassis and another used cab have know found there way into another barn,
Maybe the new GH gentleman owner will one day want to sell those bits on for further use.

I recently stumbled across an old fella that had a farm full of scrap. Farming implements, trucks and machinery were piled up everywhere. He was reluctant to discuss the sale of any of the gear and all seemed hopeless :whinge

He then called me over to a medium sized header sitting under a tree. "Can you find me a front jockey wheel for one of these" he asked. We discussed the jockey wheel and I said I will keep an eye out for him as I stumble across lots of old farming equipment. From that point on, he was very accomodating and we began talking about military stuff.

I now had a 'foot in the door' :)

:thup2:

George, it must be the air or something in Alberta because the $1,000.00 bill worked for me also. Brian Gough and I had rented a motor home and were doing the tour. We made a wrong turn in Lethbridge and ended up in a vacant lot that had a mint 1938 Chev 1 1/2 ton. It had been a Lethbridge fire truck. The guy wanted way too much and my offer was way too low. Like you I flashed the $1000.00 bill and when his wife saw it the deal was done.
The truck can now be seen here for sale....http://www.willysacres.com/.....no connection,yada, yada.
Barry