M-H Scout car for sale...
 

http://www.rrservices.co.uk/images/s1.jpg

http://www.rrservices.co.uk/index2.html

A South African Reconnaissance Car, Mark IVF, actually. No longer used Marmon-Herrington running gear but CMP F60L bits!

Here's another Mk IVF for sale.

H.

Marmon Herrington MkIV Armoured Cars
 

Does anyone have any evidence of Marmon Herrington MkIV Armoured Cars seeing any action before the end of the war.

The only pictures I have ever seen of these vehicles with units is with Polish Regiments in the middle east, just after the end of hostilities. Presumably by the time this particular Mark entered production there were far better Armoured Cars available.

Post war they saw service with various armies including Greece and Jordan, but are there any war-time photographs?

Apart from Greece and Jordan what other countries used the MH MkIV?
I've got lots of photos of Greek ones if anybody is interested.

Fyll

Re: Marmon Herrington MkIV Armoured Cars
 

According to an article in Issue # 8 of Armored Car, the Mk IVs (both Mk IV and IVF) did not arrive in time for the North African campaign. "They were however used in the Middle East and elsewhere by the British and their allies, Greek Forces, and the Arab Legion. A few were also later used in pairs for railway protection in Palestine by the British."

H.

Yes, I am!

H.

Re: Re: Marmon Herrington MkIV Armoured Cars
 

The same excellent site that hosts the Armored Car article, www.warwheels.net, recently publised an article from South African Karl Furrutter titled "A Brief History of the Marmon Herrington Range of Armoured Cars", from which I quote:
I believe with "The Mark 4 and 5 Models" Karl refers to the Mk.IV and IVF models.

This is the first time I have read the Mk.IV armoured cars were used by the UDF in Italy. Does anyone have any further information on this?

H.

Marmon Herrington MkIV Armoured Cars
 

Me too please.

Cheers
Kevin
:salute:

Re:Marmon Herrington MkIV Armoured Cars
 

Hello Hanno,

I believe that a number of the statements made in Karl Furrutter in the article in Armored Car are incorrect.
The Mark IV and IVF came into service in 1943 arrived in the Middle East to late to operate in North Africa against the German's. They were issued to the Arab Legion in large number during WWII. It must be remembered that the Allies had a huge rear depot in the Middle East stretching from Iran to the Turkish Border to Palestine and Egypt which posed an enormous security and public order problem.

It was quickly found that armoured cars were of limited utility in Italy, and that the best ones were the smallest ones. The Marmon Herrington's Mark VI's did not go to Italy.

I have never seen a picture of a Mark III there either. Because the 1st SA Armoured Division was returned to South Africa and disbanded, the older Marmon Herrington's seem to have stayed in dumps in the Middle East.

The 6th Armoured Division only arrived in Italy by April 1944, by which time it was realised that there was little call for armoured cars. I cannot find an armoured car in its order of service.

The combined Imperial Light Horse/Kimberley Regiment which had been an armoured car unit in North Africa and which came back to Italy did so not as an armoured car unit but as a Motorised Battalion. The armoured divisions as structured in 1944 were found in Italy to be too heavy, with too few infantry. I expect that there was a decision to retask the troops who would have driven armoured cars into "Infantry."

Furrutter says Marmon Herrington's that some had 4 pdr guns. I think that this is entirely wrong. There was as far as I can ascertain no 4 Pdr gun made, unless it was an expression given to a German or Italian gun refitted, but I doubt that ever happened.

The Jordanian Army in about 1950 rearmed a proportion of there Marmon Herrington Mark VI's with Six Pounder guns taken from field carriages. This was done by building a new armoured box in front of the front face of the existing turret, and by mounting the new gun on the outside face of the old turret, with a large aperture cut through it for the breech.

Marmon Herrington Mark VI's were issued in Palestine to the Poles to train on during the winter of 1944 - 45, and to the Greeks in 1945. The armoured protection and the mobility of the Marmon Herrington were lower than the Staghound and Daimlers which were the armoured cars of choice in the British units by 1945.

I believe that it was decided that the Marmon Herrington's in store in the Middle East were more appropriate for the newly emerging armies in post war Eastern Meditterean.

With the Communist Coup in Greece large numbers were issued to the anti Communist forces deployed to Greece. Many were sent to Cyprus, and the Jordanian's had most of the rest.

The Jordanian operated MH's were highly capable against the Israelis sandwich cars on the occasions that they encountered each other in 1948.

The Israelis did capture (acquire?) at least one Marmon Herrington which appears to have had an unservicable gun, or to have lost it, because they rearmed it with a French tank gun taken from a French tank, probably one of the ones operated by the Syrian's.

Mark V Marmon Herrington's only ever existed as pilot models. They never entered service, as by the time they were developed the Desert War was won and the purpose they were designed for had gone.

Regards

Nick Balmer

This Mk IVF was sold to, and restored by a Dutch collector in Polish livery.

Bought as a pair, there's a second one, (as yet?) unrestored.

See http://www.canadianalliedforces.com/ for more pictures.

Here's another survivor at the Military Museum of Macedonia, Greece. Found on the Overvalwagen forum

Hi

Took some photos same vehicle at Opp. Amherst commemoration 2007 Eelde NL.

http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/3...rst1ui6.th.jpg http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/8...rst2ea5.th.jpg

Enjoy Ronald

Totally fictitious markings I assume.

I am in the process of restoreing an early MkIV in England, bit of a sad state but i am sure i will get there in the end would love to hear from other owners or any one with information as there seems to be little out there

e mail

regards Derek

Ferret 1

Is this another ex-RR Services vehicle? I believe they imported two originally.

There is so very little information on these vehicles because the consensus is that none saw active service before the end of the war. I believe there are pictures of Polish Forces using them for training in the middle East during 1946-7.

It would be nice if you would be prepared to use your own name like 95% of the other people on this forum.

Here's a picture from the excelllent book 'Polish Armoured Forces 1939 -1945'
'Organisation and Equipment'

The lack of any markings also suggests little use.

Thanks for the picture - it is of great use as you say not much information out there any other photos about i would love to see them.

yes it is an ex RR vehicle the first one was sold to Jordon after they restored it for the museum out there

sorry the name thing is a habbit on the iinter net

lookforward to chatting with you all

Derek Gardner