'SM', 'S.M.' or 'S/M' and what it means!
 

Dave Page has asked me what 'SM', or S.M.' or 'S/M' means. I thought that it would be appropriate to remind and ask for assistance.

The abbreviation stands for 'Supply-Mechanical' which is in fact a 'Demand Supply-Mechanical' or contract placed by the Ministry of Supply and also at times the Admiralty for the Royal Navy and Air Ministry for the RAF. Well, it did until after January 1941 when acquisitions were placed in theory under the M of S for all three services, plus civilian use. Essentially these are contracts for overseas supply initially to the UK, starting with S/M 2002...though there may have been a S/M 2001 not found it yet..for CMPs in July 1940 and then rising up sequentially and then jumping to S/M 6001 at some stage bypassing S/M 3001 and up, 4001 and up and 5001 and up. However we now think that S/M 5001 and up were for spare parts whilst S/M 1001 and up were for imported hard skin vehicles such as the Staghounds. Trailers were also acquired under S/M demands as well as under 'TM' demands..'Trailer Mechanical'? Likewise motorcycles and half-tracks and oddities such as the Allis-Chalmers tractors.

Now, it is my aim to find in the National Archives the files showing the complete listing for all M of S contracts. I have had some pointers from the NA but if anyone has ever done this before please let me know!

In addition to the British deliveries the UK government purchased vehicles etc. for dominion and commonwealth countries and the same system applied for overseas deliveries to whichever country.

oddities such as....
 

Allis-Chalmers tractors?

Do tell. Not Snowtractor Seans favourite M7 surely?

A-C also made a lot of big heavy crawlers so it's probably some of them.

Gordon

A-C Gun Tractors
 

http://www.gmhistorian.btinternet.co.uk/allis.jpg

These are M6 S/M 6458..H 6164821 to 6164856 [8" MG] and H 6234965 to 6235014. The other listed A-Cs are Tractor Tracked.

Ta
 

Thanks David, just a tad heavier than Sean's M7, that is.

It's not impossible that the UK got a snowtractor or two, as they got some other stuff in small quantities for evaluation, like the amphibious Dodge Aqua-Cheetah.

That's...
 

...#103's big brother...Stan A.C.

Gordon will understand...:D

National Archives files
 

There is a possibility that the Contracts, all 411 volumes [!] are in FILE SUPP 4 in the National Archives, Kew, if anyone is interested.

After having studied the Chilwell list, I have come to this conclusion:

During the 1930’s, the T contracts were for Trailers, the C contracts were for (motor)Cycles and the V contracts were all the rest… V for Vehicles? From 1940 onwards, Trucks, Tractors and Transporters were also often classified as T contracts. When a truck is called a Lorry, it sometimes has a T contract, sometimes a V contract… Towards the end of the war, there are more and more S contracts (S for Supply? Or Softskin?). I think that the person who was responsible for the allocation of these contract numbers (and prefixes) was a blonde secretary: :D

- “What’s this contract for Sir?”
- “It’s a contract for Tillies my girl.”
- “Tillies? Doesn’t sound like a Truck or a Motorcycle, will class it as a Vehicle…”

or:

- “This is a contract for 1000 Lorries Mildred.”
- “Excuse me Sir, are Lorries Motorcycles or Vehicles?”

Who knows more about these contract code prefixes?

Jan

Contract or Demand?
 

I know that Supply Mechanical contracts were officially 'Demands'. I would suspect that 'S.' ones were from the Ministry of Supply and may also have been 'Demands'.

The series of S/M contracts (I can't call them Demands) seems to have run in series as we discussed previously:

S/M 1001 and up (e.g. Staghounds so armoured?)
S/M 2002 and up.. I have no evidence that there was a 2001 actually placed
S/M 3001 and up (possibly trailers and spare parts?)
S/M 4001 and up ??
S/M 5001 and up ??
S/M 6001 and up (overflow from 2xxx series I think)

My F15A was built under contract "CD 1513"; I have been told "CD" stood for "Contract Demand"? :confused

H.

Cd
 

Isn't that FULLY C.D.L.V., which stood for Contract Demand Land Vehicles?

To confuse the Ministry of Supply placed Demands overseas for CMPs under the S/M 2XXX series and then the actual contracts for assembly at Dagenham, and probably also other plants, had a 'V.XXXX' series one allocated. This was the domestic series. No doubt rebuilds had the same subsequently.

"contract" numbers...
 

Dave,

Indeed, we had a similar case in this thread: http://www.mapleleafup.net/forums/sh...ghlight=ec018q
But correct me if I'm wrong: I did find the S/M 2019 reference in the Chilwell list (census numbers L773980 onwards), but couldn't find the domestic V4288... :wacko:

Regards,
Jan

V. contracts
 

I never cease to be amazed at a) how I forget about previous threads and b) how some 'ferrets' seem to be able to find them and drag them up! Thanks for that one, Sir!

The answer lies in the case of Fords in the 1942 Dagenham Ford civvy and military guide booklet which had details of models (and drawings) plus details in some cases of both Demands and Contracts. I just wish I had a GM Ltd version!

This is my complete list:
S/M 2004 EC098TFS (3-ton 158" w.b. 4 x 2 ) assembled under Contract 294/V/4214
S/M 2019 EC108Q assembled under Contract 294/V/4288
S/M 2020 EC011QF assembled under Contract [294/]V/4513
S/M 2030 EC011DF assembled under Contract 294/V/4699
S/M 2037 EC018Q assembled under Contract 294/VS/4784
S/M 2046 EC098UFS (3-ton Tipping) assembled under Contract [294/]V/4596
S/M 2048 EC196TFS for Canadian Forestry Corps (3 ton 176" w.b.) assembled under Contract 294/V/4629

more mysterious prefixes...
 

David,

I've been studying the contract plates for a while and have "discovered" this:

At the beginning of the war, these contract plates were made of brass. They contained the following information: contract number (starting with the previously mentioned T or C or V prefixes) and spare parts catalogue reference number.

From somewhere around 1943, the contract plates were made of sheet steel, and from more or less the same date onwards, the contract number was preceded by an additional prefix "294/contract number". At least for the motorcycle contracts, there was also a number 23 in this prefix: "294/23/contract number". I know from contemporary documents that this 294/23 prefix has been in use since the start of the war. But does anybody know what it stands for? :confused :confused :confused

Regards,
Jan

Theory
 

I am conjecting at the moment that the War Office then Ministry of Supply had written Volumes with different contract types, If that was the case, perhaps '243' was the Volume or series for vehicles, or wheeled vehicles, then the next was a sub-series, followed by a sequential number which started probably post-Great War...it seems that by the early 1930s they had got to V.2400 or so, and they just added as each contract was let? I know that the 'V.' series ran into the 5000s, but whether the 'T.' and 'S.' series used the same numbers I have no definitive proof but the evidence that I have suggests that they were a seperate series.

prefixes also for armoured vehicles contracts?
 

David,

I agree with your theory about the separate series. If you take a look at the first pages of the Chilwell list (1933), one can only conclude that the V series started somewhere around V/2400, T started around 1000 and C around 5000.

I've also been thinking about the "243" being a "Volume" or something similar. Did the armoured vehicles also have contract plates I wonder? Would these contracts also have started with a prefix similar to "243/23/contract number"? :confused :confused :confused

For the armoured vehicles owners who would like to add something to this thread :): as explained previously, this mysterious prefix can sometimes also be found on the parts lists etc.

Regards,
Jan