MLVW sightings
 

On my way home from Peterborough today I saw 5 MLVWs loaded up on 3 tractor trailers going west between Kingston and Brockville.

I wonder if they are being transferred to another site or being sent down to Toronto for the auction block.

Did you happen to write down the CFRs?

Just for info, there are at least 3 more Dvr Wh courses on MLVW at LFCATC Meaford, so the military requirement is still there.

I didn't have time to write anything down as I was driving 110 km in the opposite direction.

:eek: . . . speeding . . . :nono:

Cheers :D

MLVW Sales
 

I have heard that no more MLVWs will be offered for sale to the public, can anyone confirm this?

The last pair I saw back in the summer were sold as scrap/salvage. They were not in horrible shape but it was made clear in the listed that they could not be registered for road use.

I'm puzzled about this apparent restriction for civilian use.

I've either driven or been an in-cab instructor for 10000s of km and not had a single brake failure, nor have I heard of any such failures, (unlike the LSVW!)

Page 9 of the Official MTO Air Brake Handbook describes air over hydraulic braking systems, which the MLVW has, so why the "illegality" of civilian use?

Pity, 'cause many farmers in this area pester me about getting one when they get released. Of course they can do what they like on their own property and that 8.2 liter fuel pincher engine would be a shame to have to scrap.

It may not simply be the vulnerability of the single master cylinder system, but rather that the trucks did not meet the regulations in effect at the time they were built. Besides the single cylinder, it seems to me that the noise level in the cabs was also above the standard. Back then they lowered this by installing the rubber mats, and later these were removed to slow down the corrosion. Seems to me the decibal rating was up around 89. There were other shortcomings as well. The lighting is not SAE certified, although there are modern replacements that are, like the LED version of the M series tail lamps.

I will be sorry if they do not sell them to the public. Even with the "no road" status I would have liked to buy my old MRT, along with a hiab truck. They would have been fine for going into the forest for firewood, and a good all around yard truck.

There were some Bombardier MLVWs sold from Shilo almost 2 decades ago. These were made on a late contract for the German Army in Shilo, and used as range fire trucks. Apparently the weight of the fire fighting systems was too much for the chassis to handle, so they were disposed of. I know the fellow who bought them, and as far as I know, they made it onto the road as farm trucks.

Sale Of MLVWs
 

From a historical point of view, not allowing this series of vehicles to go out for public purchase means that few will be saved by collectors. This will be a significant loss of our military automotive history to future generations.

I have heard that the M113 series, the M577s, AVGP series and the M109s that are being disposed of will also not be sold to the public.

I can certainly see them limiting the armour from the public as they will all be ITAR controlled. Nothing new there. The M113 lynx was not sold publicly either. But other than the M151A2, I cannot think of another wheeled 'B' vehicle that has been held away from public sale.

Technically the MLVW would fall under the controlled goods regulations as well as ITAR, and that was my understanding for why the oil coolers and starters were being removed form those sold. Controlled Goods regulations qualify a vehicle with blackout lighting as falling under their control.

Just adds validity to leaving anything connected to an M number alone and go over to the UK or europe and fill your boots with main battle tanks and down.


My 2 cents worth

R

I was speaking to the owner of Prefair in Montreal and he told me that he has been in contact in reference to buying all the MLVWs in quebec and Ontario. He has sent several letters but no replies have been received. I have spoken to a few people and they have told me that bases are putting MLs into a compound and units are cannabalizing them to keep the fleet going.
I was told by a Provincial policeman that in Quebec the SAAQ controls all VINs and I probably could have a registration as a artisanal truck, to have this I would have to change the engine, transmission and do a modification to the frame such as shortning or in my case removing an axle.
He then said he would sign a paper and the license office would issue a new VIN. What I did after I got the registration was my decision. So to get this let's buy a MLVW BOB it, shorten the frame, remove an axle etc.
Believe me, my head hurts from banging it on the wall but I am a masochist and will keep trying to find a loophole.
What we are seeing with the MLVW will probably be the fate all all Cdn MVs.
For those that don't know the Cdn M113 and AVGP family are in a compound somewhere and their fate is in the hands of a US company who is trying to sell them to other countries, I have called them to buy a M113. No Luck

Well, I can confirm that here in Gagetown exists such a compound that contains all of the old M113, M548, M577, M109 (yup), MLVW and anything else that is PCC from LFAA. You get the feeling that none of these are waiting for an auction, but something worse, and are extremely dilapidated, especially the MLVWs. Many don't have Glass and the rear Tarps and Superstructures are all caved in from ice buildup. Looks like a junk yard. Honestly, if I was really after an ML, I'd look further west. Even the ones we still have at the Unit are in very sad shape from the salt and hard winters.

The one that I have left in my Troop has either been towed or limped home the few times we've had it out lately. Hate to say it, but the Mighty ML is finally worn out. The MSVS isn't making any friends either. The MLs keep disappearing, and the new ones have spent most of their time grounded for mods.

The Canadian military usually does not treat the PCC'd vehicles as anything of value. I bought M38A1s that had sat so long the fuel pumps would not work.....got them for a song. Meanwhle if it had a tarp it would go for 2 to 3 times the price. When I saw the Germans selling their Mungas here in Manitoba, they came complete with all their tarps, and even the tools etc were all still in their place. When you buy Cdn surplus vehicles, you are usually lucky if it has batteries.

I would not be surprised to see the MLVWs wait a year or three before being sold off, if that's still the plan. The old deuces went the same way. Although prices were fairly high on them initially, they were going for only around $600 each towards the end. Many also went to ranges as targets. Even some Iltis went to the ranges here as targets. That made me happy. I did not like the Iltis.

the problem down here is that the disposal action is now put in the inital contracts. thats why there are so few hummers in civilian hands, and no more to be sold. and the US state dept now retains a small percent of ownership of nearly all military gear made, sold, given, or loaned out now.

and of some intrest i think SEACO (yes the ones with the T16s) are the ones trying to sell all the CA armor. good luck to them, if they dont sell it soon you are looking at another reaf project in the makeing.

Lynx in collectors hands
 

Hi Rob

Just to confirm my memory and identification below is (I think) a Lynx fully restored in the hands of a private collector here in the States. The unit is a regular participant at our Summer Rally. Owner hauls it close to 200 miles round trip on his own military flat bed unit usually with a second tracked unit as well.

So at-least one is surviving in running and in this case museum quality.

Cheers Phil

I'm sure that Lynx has a story behind it's escape. Apparently a bunch were scrapped at the closeout of Canada's commitment to Germany. Most had a hole cut through the side armor, which was not really up to the specs required to demil them. I believe I heard of others that were "scrapped" and managed to leave the base unscathed. While they made it onto the world market, there were questions asked, especially when satellite observation started picking out small batches of them in other parts of the world.

There is a running one in private hands out in Alberta as well. It too comes with a story of it's escape, which was not entirely done by the book on the losing unit's end.

Plenty of the lynx survive as monuments. There is 2 of them located here in Shilo, and I tarted one of a pair into UN livery back when I was in Moose Jaw. Those two grace the front yard of the armouries there.

They were a fun vehicle, kind of like an overgrown snowmobile. Compared to the old M113A1 we used at the time, a lynx had a lot of pickup.

I've seen this Lynx on the move
 

Hi Rob

I've seen this Lynx on and off road and the performance is impressive, I'll do some digging and see if I can find some video of it running around. The Lynx looks to be in factory fresh condition, and is maintained at the level. I've heard how he acquired it but I don't remember the full story.

The gentleman who owns it has some interesting vehicles. He has had some very good luck collecting unusual vehicles in extraordinary condition. Such as Tow Missile Version of the M113 in basically unused complete condition, which had been given to a water treatment plan as spare parts for some related vehicle which was being used to move sand in a filter tanks.

Cheers Phil

What I find weirdest is that you can't get a MLVW in Canada, but a Canadian can easily, as I understand it, drive down to the USA, buy an M35 or an M800, register it, import it and drive it on the roads.

but if you are in the US and want a WWII 1/2 track or US made tank from europe you cant get it back to the USA. but we can get a NEW T-72 or challanger with minimum paperwork. its crazy

Also, that you can put an armoured car or rubber-tracked tank on the road with minimal effort (Signals, mirrors and capable of safe road speeds? Good to go!), but getting an actual M-series truck, only fundamentally different from a civillian 2.5 or 5-ton truck by virtue of more drive wheels and tougher construction? Hard as all hell.

I seen someone trying to sell Leopard Powerpacks a while back. Not sure how much good they will be to anyone. I was out at the LAV Range here in Gagetown today, and low and behold, saw the better part of a dozen Leopards waiting their turn to be dragged out for hard targets. They were fairly complete with the Turrets still fitted. Shame.....

Story Behind Lynx in private hands
 

Rob Love said

"I'm sure that Lynx has a story behind it's escape. Apparently a bunch were scrapped at the closeout of Canada's commitment to Germany."

Well today I was talking to people who know the story, it came from a base in Belgium which was closed contents of the base (less any weapons) were sold as surplus, to a Dutch dealer. Among the vehicles on the base was this Lynx and at least one other. The collector in the US made arrangements import papers to import both vehicles. He decided at the time not to buy the second one (something he later regretted) because it was not in as good condition as the one he did import. Next time I see the owner I'll try and get more information.

Cheers Phil

Actually several compounds in various conditions.
http://www.smithconsultinggroup.net/

I know a guy who has a very nice Cdn MLVW, but he could not licence it..I believe the release paper said for scrap only and with that designation (in Quebec) you simply can not change it even if you create a 100 point vehicle.
To get around it he had to import the Amercan version, transfer the Cdn cab and box onto the the US frame, and then he was able to get plates for it. (probably a bit more to the story than that, but essentially thats it)

His thoughts were that the govt and-or Bombardier didnt want to be liable in the event of a civilian accident due to something like the single master cylinder or improper lights or some such thing...(no matter how remote the possibility)

As for armour, given recent provincial legislation in BC and Ontario agianst "armoured" cars (ganstas) I kinda doubt anything remotely armoured will ever be released anymore
...a sad state of affairs

actually, as I recall, the Iltis was not supposed to be released either, or at least not platable for the road... but somehow a few slipped through the cracks and then the rest were sort of allowed through..although it is a bit of a grey area.

MLVW Saga
 

Yes the guy in Montreal bought a cab & frame from a dealer in the US and did a major frame modification to the truck. :rolleyes I recently spoke to the SQ(Police) and was informed that the MLVW can be plated as an artisanal truck if
- a major modification was done to the engine and transmission i.e. change them for another pair diesel & auto to multifeul & manual, frame work done i.e. bob the truck, or in my case remove an axle. You need a minimum of 3 major changes then he will give you a paper to take to the DMV(SAAQ).
I am in the process of buying a cab and chassis with a good title from the US and we will change the frame and then remove an axle, this will qualify as an artisanal truck. It will also have a new VIN number. :D :rolleyes
Believe me I have spent a lot of time and effort in trying to get my trucks plated. :bang: :bang: As to the single cylinder brake system we have found a kit that mounts in the cab and is an auxillary reservoir that easily connects to the existing system. Takes about 2 hours to do.
I will soon be moving into Ontario and will come under a new DMV system. MTF Gilles

Gilles
I will soon be moving into Ontario
Where..Bobby's back 50 Acres..??
:drunk: :thup2: :cheers:

Moving soon
 

Don't worry Alex, it will not be on Bob's back 50. I will let you guys know when the deal is done. But I can say it has a big barn. It has and will have a lot of winter storage space for MVs MTF Gilles

Good Deal
 

Good deal Gilles..
Can't wait for the barn warming party..!!
:note: :drunk::remember :salute:

Gilles buys the barn
 

Hi Guys Got good news tonight, we are moving to Kemptville this summer. We are buying a small farm with a big barn and lots of outbuildings to store our trucks. Lots of work coming up but, finally the fleet will be in the back yard. Carolle and I are really happy, we will have to come up with a name for the place. This Barn will be for postwar vehicles. Pictures follow. Gilles