Knockers

[Les Freathy]

I wish i wish, but no its the name given to the AEC Militant 6x4 and 6x6 used in large numbers by the British army from 1950 into the 1980s untill replaced by the Bedford TM 6x6. the name came from its slow knock generated from the 6 cyl dieselengine also familier in the Matador, again plenty of scope in this thread as it had a number of various bodies in army use and some in to civilian life. Strange thing is in terms of old military vehicles theyshould be available for presevation but there seems to be few takers, granted they are large but so are many others
Les

[Les Freathy]

Photo 1 the artillery tractor version a early chassis and scowl F V 11002

[Les Freathy]

photo 2 early prototype note the rear mudguards beneath the body

[Les Freathy]

photo3 Again a early model on trials now with the standard shape rear mudguards

[Snowtractor]

Originally posted by Les Freathy
I Strange thing is in terms of old military vehicles theyshould be available for presevation but there seems to be few takers, granted they are large but so are many others
Les

Hey Les,
if there was one round here I would be all over it , but the cost of moving one to the middle of canada would be far more than the purchase price. Gotta love those big beasties.
Sean

[Les Freathy]

A couple more knockers this time the LWB general service both with fitted Atlas cranes. what i find unusual about these two is that one has the nomal long body and crane the other a short body with the crane frame mounted between the cab and body, prehaps Richard can come up with a awnser as he used to work on these in his REME fitting days as to how the lond body crane was mounted
Les

[Richard Farrant]

Originally posted by Les Freathy
A couple more knockers this time the LWB general service both with fitted Atlas cranes. what i find unusual about these two is that one has the nomal long body and crane the other a short body with the crane frame mounted between the cab and body, prehaps Richard can come up with a awnser as he used to work on these in his REME fitting days as to how the lond body crane was mounted
Les

Les,

The upper photo looks like the normal CALM, with shorter drop side at the front end of the body. You can see the stabiliser legs, which are part of the crane's main frame.

Now the lower pic, is unusual, I must say, because there do not appear to be stabilisers on it. The crane cannot be mounted in the body, it would defeat the object, by reducing load capacity. I do note that the spare wheel carrier is further to the outside of the vehicle, so think the crane must be between body and cab. As it is not a version I recollect, it is pure guesswork, but it is possible that this lower one has a particular role handling light loads, which is why no stabilisers. The Stalwart was another such example, the ammo carrier crane payload was different to the REME fitters one.

My introduction to these AEC 10 tonners was firstly on the Coles crane version, around 25 tons gross and the first truck that I ever drove. Once you mastered the gearbox on these, you could handle anything!

There was another oddball AEC 10 tonner that came in the workshops occasionally, it had a Brimec slideoff tipping platform body for transporting plant vehicles, etc.

Richard

[Les Freathy]

Thanks for the info Richard thought you might come up with something, now cat amongst the pigeon time its not agood photo but it shows the long front body with crane and stabilizers that seem to slide out from under the front body runner does this help with your assesment

[Les Freathy]

second a Jones crane carrier is this the one you mentioned or was it the Coles

[Richard Farrant]

Originally posted by Les Freathy
not a good photo but it shows the long front body with crane and stabilizers that seem to slide out from under the front body runner does this help with your assesment

Les,
We are going back a long while now, but there do seem to be some variations between your pics. I am not sure the crane on "**EP**" is the same as "**ER**", the latter one I would say is an Atlas, but something in the back of my mind tells me another make was fitted on earlier ones.

second a Jones crane carrier is this the one you mentioned or was it the Coles

Never had those Jones cranes in, think they had been disposed of earlier and Coles was the main one in use. They are recognised by the jib pivot being above the crane cab.

Richard

[Gord Falk]

Hi Sean,

You were saying that if there was a Militant in the middle of Canada you would buy it. Next time you stop by the see me we can look at one about 10 miles from me. A local fellow imported several large British trucks one being a Militant Mk1.

He also has a very nice Daf Ya 126 Weapons carrier.

Gord Falk
Manitoba

[Les Freathy]

Richard, missing Brimec Militant
Les

Originally posted by Richard Farrant
Les,

The Stalwart was another such example, the ammo carrier crane payload was different to the REME fitters one.

That's always been a puzzle.

There are pictures of one with swing-up stabiliser legs but the owners with data plated 624's do not have the legs or even any sign of the mountings.

All the official manuals give the crane ratings as identical 623/624 and the only defined difference being the 624 control valving for finer control and a better max spec sink rate.

R.

[Les Freathy]

This is not really the place for Stalwarts but as the crane and stabilizers have come in to it ,two shots of one with legs are they fold up or telescopic? and one without.
Time for some one to start a Stalwart thread do you not think
Les

[Les Freathy]

2nd

Originally posted by Les Freathy
This is not really the place for Stalwarts but as the crane and stabilizers have come in to it ,two shots of one with legs are they fold up or telescopic? and one without.
Time for some one to start a Stalwart thread do you not think

Interesting, I too have a different picture of 00SP75, this is the only one with those legs that appear to swing forward and up to stow. Someone might know but isn't "SP" an unusual Army reg number? Trials or special purpose; as far as we know this doesn't fit with any "production" vehicles at all.

The second picture is interesting too, this would seem to be a Mk.1 which were never produced or issued with cranes and as best as I can see it has neither the standard FOMOCO crane as specified by the Swedes or the Atlas 3001/6, maybe another trials vehicle?

Interesting stuff.

R.

[Richard Farrant]

Originally posted by FV623
Someone might know but isn't "SP" an unusual Army reg number?

SP is Special Project, usually on vehicles under trial and tests by FVRDE, MVEE, or whatever they were called at the particular time.

Incidentally, the crane on the Swedish Stalwarts is not Fomoco, that was the name of Ford spare parts. It is FOCO, which was the trade name of Fabriks AB Forslund & Co., Sweden. Later they merged with HIAB, this was in 1967, so maybe after the Swedish ones were delivered?

Richard

[Neil Ashley]

Talking about 10 tonners in general, I was always amazed how the army kept large quantities of the war-time Leyland Hippo in service decades after its replacemnent the AEC had entered service.

They were certainly still with units into the 1970's and the last ones were not released untill the 1980's. A MVT member recalled recently how he had visited an ABRO workshop during the 1980's and found a line set up on the shop floor repairing Hippo's prior to their dispatch to Aschurch to be disposed.

When I joimed 155 Transport Regiment RCT at Southampton during the late 1980's, we still had two AEC's in the yard for driving training. I drove one round the yard once and that was quite enough for me.

[Richard Farrant]

Originally posted by Neil Ashley
I was always amazed how the army kept large quantities of the war-time Leyland Hippo in service decades after its replacemnent the AEC had entered service.

They were certainly still with units into the 1970's and the last ones were not released untill the 1980's. A MVT member recalled recently how he had visited an ABRO workshop during the 1980's and found a line set up on the shop floor repairing Hippo's prior to their dispatch to Ashchurch to be disposed.

Neil,

It was around the mid 1970's that Hippos came back into service at the local TMP after being in storage at Antwerp Vehicle Depot. They were a stop gap, while waiting for Foden 16 tonne 8x4 to come in to service. There was never a shortage of AEC 10 tonners either, rows of 'em. One Hippo even had a show plaque on it where the Army had attended a historic transport rally!

They were not popular with young squaddies and were always in our Workshops for clutch and gearbox repairs, spares eventually drying up. From the long serviced guys at the workshop, some going back to the 40's at that time, it would appear that they were surprised to see these Hippos reappear. We did also get the odd QL in for work at the same time.

Back to the AEC 10 tonner, its replacement was the Bedford TM 8 and 14 tonne range.

Richard

[Les Freathy]

Richard
heres one with the Coles crane in use with the engineers, i presume some of those you worked on would have come in from the R E depot at Maidstone and Chatham
Les

[Les Freathy]

Time to include a few more knocker photos ( of the metal kind) photo one is the MK3 artillery tractor version FV11041

[Les Freathy]

The old computers of on its own again, amazing it told me it could not post this photo and then you get two. OK lets try the others

2 the LWB GS version

[Les Freathy]

Cant believe it was over a year ago since i put any thing in here, so heres a photo of the Militant as seen in the early 1970s in the bridging role a task it was well suited for
cheers
Les

[Les Freathy]

And another from the 1060s for luck
Les

[Richard Farrant]

Originally posted by Les Freathy
And another from the 1060s for luck
Les

Hi Les,

...and with an Albion 10 tonner in the left of the shot. The last of these in service were RE Mobile Workshops and were they heavy on the steering, far worse than the Militant. I know that REME Museum have one in their collection, but not seen any other variants in preservation.

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

As discussed by Richard F. and Les in an earlier thread, Some Militants were used with a Coles crane. If they had a hard Australian life before being retired to the big blue shed, they would look like this.
I have been assured that this one is still a runner.
I note that the transfer case has been changed so that drive is no longer available for the front diff. I assume this mod was used to drive a part of the crane.
Rich.

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

Another Coles crane conversion. Must be pretty common, they were lying around all over the place....
Liked all the room for a heavily booted clutch foot, and the familiar dash/switch gear/air cleaners of that era MV.
Perhaps Richard could elaborate on the "geared" steering.
This too has lost the use of the front diff, and is also a runner.
Rich.

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

Coming out of the woodwork now.
This Militant, now 1800 kms away from the Coles ones above , is an ex drilling-rig truck. Definatley a runner, it was used to recover a tractor crane (and part time water feature....) out of a dam only a few weeks back. Still has 6x6 capability.
Air Cleaner is a modification, but the tyre carrier appears to be original.
Bit of a worry, the rear split rim has been bolted back together wrongly, and the whole tyre/rim fitted backwards, by the previous owner.
Looking forward to a drive on the next visit.

[Richard Coutts-Smith]

Nice big cab, but bugger all room in it.
Ampmeter may just not be original...
Note that this is a different steering column to the Coles Conversion shown previously. Appreciate any suggestions as to why, I know the latter marks had different ratios, but I assume this would not affect the cloumn itself.
Rich.

[Richard Farrant]

Hi Rich,
a brief reply as I will be off to work soon. Brings back memories! The "geared" steering on the Coles chassis .... this was in fact connected to a large electric motor attached to the steering column, when operating the crane in Free-on-Wheels mode, the crane operator could drive and steer the cranne using a joystick control in the crane cab, brake control as well. There would be a big electric motor connected to the transfer box as well, the drive motor. If you have seen a 6x6 with no output flange from the transfer box for front wheel drive, then it might be a box has been changed from a 6x4 version.
Room in cab? The 11.3 AEC engine took precedence in there, gear lever hard against your left leg, real basic stuff, but they are definitely of character!

regards, Richard