Swiss Army Truck

[Kuno]

Just recently I have seen this (uncommented) foto in a Swiss Army Museum. It must have been taken in 1939 since as far as I know the Swiss Army purchased the tanks in this year as well. Was not aware that they had such trucks...

Can anybody tell me more about that vehicle?

[nuyt]

I think it is a 1939 GMC ACK 101 4x4 1/2 ton truck, imported chassis/cowl from the US with local bodywork, including Schwarzlose machinegun. Bodywork is a bit similar to Dutch pagtrekkers. I wonder how they imported the truck...

[Bill Murray]

That, Gentlemen, is one very rare and to me never seen before photo and I thank you Kuno.
I agree with Nuyt's ID and I have not ever read of the Swiss Defense forces using GMC trucks pre-war.

Any more such photos would be very nice to see.
Bill

[Kuno]

Many thanks for youur information. As I said in above post - there was no "caption" to the picture...

I would post it here if I could get any further information about the topic.

[nuyt]

Kuno, I borrowed your pic and posted it on The Overvalwagen Forum with some other Swiss vehicles and guns of the period. Plus another wartime GMC:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/33033...Swiss+Army+WW2

Be welcome there!

Nuyt

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

The truck would have been supplied by General Motors Suisse SA, in Biel or Bienne. You may have unwittingly answered a question that remained unsolved..which model was that trialled by the War Department in 1939 in front of DND representatives? I had no idea that there was a Model ACK-101 ...Bart's information is that the 1939-40 Models as supplied to the Belgian/Dutch armies was the Model 4930. The 100 series was a 1/2 ton / tonne bottom of the pile chassis...I thought that the smallest 4x4 was the ACK-353 1 1/2-tonner and that was I worked out the 4930...the 4929 being the 6x6 version.

Incidentally the Swiss Army purchased 15 1939 Model Chevrolet Master 85 Sedans converted to 1229 Phaetons and 130 1940 Sedans converted to Phaetons. These were used for towing munitions for many years. However I have never seen any evidence before of commercial vehicle assembly by GM Suisse; all their production figures are for cars. At least one of the '39 Phaetons exists today.

[zemsi]

Good Day Mates

I've been living in Switzerland all my life but never seen this picture or have been aware that the Swiss Army had a small batch of these GMCs. How surprising!

cu
Chris

@David: Biel and Bienne is the same town. Biel is German and Bienne French.

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

General Motors Suisse SA went into production 8 February 1936 (a Buick): see my page:
http://clubs.hemmings.com/clubsites/.../gmsuisse.html

This provides a copy of the February 1940 GENERAL MOTORS article on the phaetons.

http://clubs.hemmings.com/clubsites/.../GMSuisse2.jpg

Sorry, I should have made it clearer that when I said "Biel or Bienne" I meant Deutsch/Francais versions of what General Motors referred to as"Biel", except say in French language brochures.

Regular readers will notice that I also refer to GM Continental SA/BV as in "Antwerp", "Antwerpen" (Flemish/Flamand), or Anvers (Francais) and GM International as in "København" rather than "Copenhagen". GM also referred to the English version, generally as in "Copenhagen" and "Antwerp", but French/Flemish brochures refer to the respective local description and the Dutch GM brochures referred to the GM Coninental Rotterdam sales office.

I believe Ford used English for their Belgian plant, and presumably did so for the Amsterdam one. I apologise but I feel that I should personally attempt the local spelling wherever polite to do so.

As regards Danish/Dansk production of GMCs, this gives you some idea:
http://clubs.hemmings.com/clubsites/...penhagen1.html

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

[Edward C. ]Riley played a major rôle in decisions made in his various offices: as General Manager he was responsible for all assembly plants and distributor territories outside North America. He was then sent in 1935 to set up the Swiss Plant. Riley oversaw the construction of a new assembly plant that opened on 8 February 1936, in Biel/Bienne, Switzerland. Riley had “collected a team of construction and equipment engineers who, with enthusiasm, made the Suisse plant a model of its kind”: General Motors World, July/August 1959, P.2.

[nuyt]

For the record:

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

The GM Suisse plant developed a wartime substitute fuel unit, and the engineers perfected a carbide generator which was offered on the market as "G.M. Carbor". However rapid depletion of the Swiss sheet metal and tyre reserves brought this activity to a close in mid-1942 and also prevented the lauunch of an alternative program, a food hydrator. The plant then devoted its time largely to repair and reconditioning work for the Swiss Army.

Amazingly, the 1938 order for Phaetons to tow guns etc for passage through the alpine regions was so successful that the Government thought about subsidising the conversion so that trhese vehicles could be used in an emergency! No mention at all of GMC trucks but thi might have been as part of the 1937-on order for militarisation and defence of all essential civilian factories.

extracted from: THE WAR EFFORT OF THE OVERSEAS OPERATIONS, 1944

[Kuno]

@ Zemsi; the foto can be seen in the Army Museum in FULL-REUENTHAL. May you find somebody who can give information about its origin.

[zemsi]

@Kuno

Hmm, I've been in Full-Reuenthal several times, but just once at the top floors, where the picture should be. Will visit it the next time I'll be there.

I will ask the staff at the Museum to see if somebody knows more about the picture.

greetings
Chris

[Kuno]

@ Zemsi; you have to go to the area where all this 1:35 models are shown - there it is at the outer wall (direction towards Germany). It is hanging relatively low...

(They have now som "new" swedish and french tanks / recce-vehicles).

[zemsi]

I spoke with Markus Hofmann, author of the book Fahrzeuge der Schweizer Armee (vehicles of the Swiss Army). He also wrote a short article about Fargo 4x2 and GMC 4x2.

Unfortunately, he hasn't found anything in his documents about this particularly image. The Swiss Army bought before the war usually a small quantity of vehicles for test purposes. This GMC could be one of them. It is unlikely that the picture ist dated etc. At this time before of the war most of it was top secret.

I guess the data behind this image woun't be discovered

Greetings
Chris

[Kuno]

...the foto is framed & behind glass. Maybe there is a handwritten text on the backside?

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

I must buy a copy!

The large success, which the subsequent series of "Vehicles of [the] Swiss Army" produced in the magazine "4x4plus", today "Swissmotor", caused the author and editorship co-worker Markus Hofmann, to publish its large knowledge and time-consuming detailed work of collected photo material of military vehicles of the Swiss army in book form, now. Hofmann, since recent years in automobile history interests, created it, to bring data over 'our' military vehicles into reader-fair and clear form.

The book - not identical to our series - deals with vehicles of the last hundred years. It represents therefore a most interesting time document. Clean arrangement of the topics, 700 illustrations and 80 tables therefore make the 320-page "century work" a valuable reference book. The book of "Vehicles of [the] Swiss army" is available at the price of SF 97, - - (excl. forwarding expenses) starting from November 2000.

I hope that this is a fair translation.

[zemsi]

@David

If you want a signed copy, drop me an email and I will make a contact with Markus Hofmann.

The book is only available in German, with little text about the vehicles (technical data). Most of the pages have 2 - 3 excellent images. It's the best book available about Swiss Army vehicles (with loads of US stuff).

I can scan some sample pages if requested.

Greetings
Chris

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

A Deutsch language version would be no problem thank you! I have spent years researching old GM documents relating to Opel and General Motors GmbH pre-1944. You just get a "sense".

[nuyt]

If these vehicles have never been sighted in Swiss service before and do not show up in official lists of purchases and stocks, I would not rule out the possibility that GMCs and other vehicles were among the 900 vehicles brought over by the fleeing French armed forces.

In the book Corps d'Armee Campagne 1 I read that 38000 troops fled to Switzerland in 1940, among which Spahis and a Polish division. Though I admit there is presently no evidence of GMC ACK 101 trucks in French service, I would certainly look into it. The French were more than experimenting with GMC and other US brands in 1940. Large orders were placed. Maybe Davis can shed some light on this connection?

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Nuyt, I asked about the fleeing forces on another forum. The answer I got was that it was though mistakenly that an order had been given to cross the border in anticipation of a German invasion and that when the clarification followed that this was not the case, the forces went back across the border.

I think any seized vehicles would have been publicised as such in the various books that I have seen extracts of .... photos including the Chevrolet sedans in parades, etc.

[nuyt]

Not quite. The Swiss took over 12 R35 tanks:
http://mailer.fsu.edu/~akirk/tanks/s...itzerland.html

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Nuyt I have a particular fascination with the nature of the Swiss frontier ever since I saw THE GREAT ESCAPE I think. That's why I asked about the alleged crossing of the border ...

I have checked my information on GMCs and cannot see any known French orders for what appears to be a swb chassis, 4 x 4. However this is not definitive, and your suggestion is possible. However I would suggest myself that these were orders placed with GM Suisse and delivery was before mid-1940 after which the company complained that they could not get any supplies from the US.

It may be intersting to note that one or two ex-Antwerp GM managers ended up in Biel/Bienne for a time.

EDIT: I have just done a check on AXIS HISTORY FORUM and this is an abstracted quote from a Swiss correspondent:

After 1935, a frantic activity began, but they still lacked in 1939.

Take a look at the equipment:

Tanks: 24 (chzechian tanks of the model Praga, ared with a 1inch gun)
Heavy Artillery: 286 (some dating back to 1882)
Anti Air Guns: 44 Total
Anti Tank guns: 823 (mainly 4.7cm caliber)
Figher Planes: 86 (Primarily Me109 D and E and Morane Saulniers)

To top it all of, the majority of the heavy equipment needed to bought in other countries, as switzerland itself lacked the raw materials and production facilities to produce them themself.

Doctrine:

In 1339 the mobilized swiss army took a line along the rivers Rhine and Limmat, with the left flank leaning against the french maginot line.
In secret negotiations, the french agreed to send 2 army corps and heavy artilleriy in support in the case the germance attacked switzerland.
After the fall of France, this all changed.
Switzerland was now largely surrounded and a frontier defense was not any longer possible.
In a move the was hotly discussed, General Guisan decided to pull back the majority of the army into the mountains in a "national reduit" to be built, which favored the infantry-heavy army.
Work begann in 1940, although many projects was not finished in 1945 (some bunkers were at that time still not equipped with guns).

This figure of "24" tanks seems to be maintained by correspondents as being the same throughout the 1940-45 period. Also that the only Swiss-produced trucks were by Saurer. I think therefore that the photos and information found and posted here are of immense interest.

[nuyt]

Those tanks may even have been Polish (in France):
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums...p/t-43587.html

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

During the German Blitzkrieg in France in May 1940 the Allied defense broke already after two weeks which was the reason for a hasty withdrawal of the British troops and capitulation of France. Polish units fought in the southern section of the front: the Polish Grenadier Division after one week of combat was dissolved because of the French-German armistice talks; the soldiers of the Brygada Kawalerii Pancerno-Motorowej (Armoured Cavalry Brigade) after the battles of Champaubert and Montbard upon the order of their commander, General Maczek, destroyed their equipment and withdrew south; 2 Dywizja Strzelców (2nd Riflemen Division) stopped the German attack on the Clos-du-Doubs hills but when on June 19 it turned out that the fight is almost over, it crossed the Swiss border and was interned there

I gather that the French crossed the frontier as a result of the agreement between the French and Swiss to defend Switzerland in the event of a German invasion. Somehow the impression was given that this had happened and so forces crossed over but subsequently returned.

This is definitely a candidate for further study.

[nuyt]

I was actually hoping one of the Swiss posters would say something about ex-French vehicles in Swiss service...

[zemsi]

@ericnuyt

Sorry, haven't heard or read anything about ex-Frenchies vehicles in the Swiss Army. We bought postwar some AMX-13 tanks.

[nuyt]

Gruezi,
But Leland Ness in Jane's WW2 Tanks and AFVs mentions them as well and he is usually well informed...
Nuyt

[zemsi]

Good Day Mates

I just got a response from Josi Zbinden who has this picture in his collection.

According to his sources, the truck in the picture is a Chevrolet, manufactured 1939, modified by Carrosserie Langenthal. This statement is from the Gruppe für Rüstungsdienste (similiar to the british MoD). This department is responsible for the acquisition of new army equipment.

He believes that the truck was used in the Militarypolice Battalion during the war. This was the first fully motorised bat!

Greetings
Chris

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Well, it could well be a "Chevrolet", model VA-S 1-ton but convereted to 4x4. Evidence:

Interesting information on developments was contained in a Memorandum dated 31 May 1939. On 30 May at GM of Canada’s plant in Oshawa, Colonel NO Carr was shown two 4 x 4 trucks destined apparently for the Malay States. It is queried here whether Colonel E.W. MacDonald, the ‘Special Representative’ in Ottawa for GM Products of Canada was involved in the presentation. The company informed him that they also had orders for two more such trucks for Australia, one for India and one for Egypt. The front axle on all of these trucks was a Timken product that was similar in all respects to the Marmon-Herrington system, which was apparently also produced by Timken. The two trucks seen had 7.50 x 20-inch tyres with dual rear wheels, and 13.50 x 20-inch single wheels all round. The wheelbase in each case was the standard 133-inch, which coincides with some Chevrolet and GMC 1939 Model trucks. The exhibited trucks looked abnormally high in the front because of the straight axle and the fact that the mudguards for the standard drop-axle were being used, exaggerating the space between tyre and mudguard. They were fitted in front with a screen over the radiator and headlights identical to those used by the U.S. Army. The whole design was evolved in Pontiac, Michigan, and all parts were at that time being imported from the U.S.

Pontiac Plant built both Chevrolet and GMC military trucks. The reason why I suggest he may be right is the fact that on closer inspevction the radiator grille does indeed look like a 1939 Chevrolet, not the slightly different GMC one, and it does not have "GENERAL MOTORS TRUCK" on the side of the hood/bonnet, but otherwise it's a parts-bin special...a Chevroelt built in Pontiac Plant and then dismantled and crated and sent to GM Suisse SA for assembly, and then ce to the Carrosserie for bodying.