F15A Trying to Identify

[James Y]

I am in Alberta and working thru restoration on a F15A, the numbers on the Cab appear to be RCC or RCS 41759, the data plate has the Chassis # as 41790.

The truck was picked up locally in the Edmonton area, it had been converted to a wrecker unit and the rear deck was modified, the deck appears to be a welding deck as the original mounts for a portable table behind the cab are still in place as well as the side toolbox, the fenders were modified above the rear wheels and were cut and dropped down to create a flat deck. The data tag veh code is F15441-M-MACH-1.


Would like to find out what the numbers and letters on the cab mean, are they uunit #'s or just vehicle #'s?

Would it be correct to assume the deck is for a welder?

What other markings would be correct for the truck?

Pictures attached.

[James Y]

More pics. Tags

[James Y]

More picture of a KL deck and Truck pulled from Web

[James Y]

Progress currently of the cab.

[rob love]

The letters on the door are PCC which stands for provisional condemnation certificate. Basically it means the army is getting rid of it. I cannot say what the numbers signify after the PCC....perhaps the date of April 17 1959, but it more likely will be the certificate number. I have seen other CMPs with the PCC number on the doors as well as on the cowl like yours.

It does look like it was a KL. The welder on those was very heavy, so the truck would have had a few extra leafs on the back axle. If you make it into a regular cargo truck, you may find the ride a little harsh, but then again none of the CMPs feel like they are gently riding on water.

[Kirk Armitage]

Nice pics, and a great looking truck. My tags are missing on my KL, I was under the impression they left with the missing rht door. I better have a look on the top of my dash for some holes.
Thanks K Armitage

[Grant Bowker]

The standard F15A rear spring pack had 10 leaves, according to the parts list the "Machinery" truck had 12. Are Mach-KL and Mach-1 two descriptions of the same truck or two different configurations?
Before hearing Rob's explanation of PCC, I wondered whether the lettering might have been RCS for Royal Canadian Signals. I still sort of wonder whether they would have gone to the trouble of stenciling the door of a surplus vehicle or would have freehanded it?
Another possibility would be that mix and match happened. Knowing how the wrecker's winch is driven might help clarify this as the only F15A variants come to mind with a power takeoff are tankers. PTO drive from the transfer case would be an addition, two speed case would be a changed part which would suggest that other mixing might have taken place.

[rob love]

Here is a shot I just grabbed off kijiji of another truck with the PCC markings on the door. Jame's truck has it on the cowl. While it seems like a lot of work to do to mark a vehicle before disposal, I can only theorize that whomever writes the directives sits at a desk and does not worry about the amount of time it takes to perform the tasks. As well, the army did worry about getting the best possible prices for the vehicles as salvage (I have documentation attesting to this), so having graffitti over the windows like the LSVW sales would not do. Lastly, soldiers are paid by the year, not by production, and in garrison (generally) have plenty of time on their hands.

Looking at the other PCC number, I suspect it is the certificate number. I have also seen the PCC sprayed on the early release deuces, so the practice stayed around until the 70s. Note this one has a PCC number of 41773, where the other one was 41759. I'll start keeping an eye on other trucks with this marking and see what they have to figure out if there is a meaning to the numbers. Odd that these two from different regions are only 14 apart.

[David Dunlop]

Not to muddy this thread, Rob, but the last M38CDN I owned came out of Kapyong in the early 1970's and had the following stencilled across it's hood:

PCC BMS L 13/71

Nice looking KL, by the way, James. Great looking truck when they are brought back to life, though you might want to hope gas prices stay where they are at the moment when it's all back together!

Cheers,


David

[rob love]

Dave

A later system which may be the result of the Cdn Forces Unification. BMS-L will be Base Maint (S=?) Land and it looks like the 13th PCC of 1971, most likely at that location (Winnipeg). We used a similar system of numbering for workorders and UCRs back then, starting a fresh register each year. Remember these were the pre-computer days.

[James Y]

Interesting that they had enough time to put the PCC #'s on both side of the hood and I see it on the passenger door.

[James Y]

Here are few pictures when we picked it up.

[James Y]

If anyone can help out on the details of the welding table that would be great.

Jim

[rob love]

Originally Posted by James Y

Interesting that they had enough time to put the PCC #'s on both side of the hood and I see it on the passenger door.

When you are in the service during peacetime, you have plenty of time. They went to all the trouble of putting together the stencil, they might as well use it.

I have an old BSF tap and die set that is Cdn Forces surplus. Besides the usual stock number, description, and checklist number on the lid, it also has a kit number stenciled on the top of the box. Whomever did that then taped the stencil to the inside of the box. Would of been a shame to only use it once then throw it away.

[Colin Alford]

I saw this thread last night and thought that I might be able to assist. I was concerned that the data plate in the truck read F15441-M-MACH-1 as opposed to F15A MACH-KL so I had a flip through the design records to figure out what the M-MACH-1 could be.

There are no Machinery Lorries listed that match M-MACH-1 and the only Machinery Lorry that entered production on a 15cwt chassis was the MACH-KL (the exception being a pilot model "Machinery Lorry 15cwt Slave Battery Charger" Code 15A-BC-1 but it appears that this pilot model was built on a Chev). I wonder if the designation F15441-M-MACH-1 was a code for the beefed-up chassis designed for a Machinery Lorry as opposed to the code for the complete vehicle?

Having not found an answer from the design records I then decided to drop by the KL in Borden during lunch to have a look at the data plates on that truck. Unfortunately the data plates are missing from the Borden truck. They were definitely on the dash (not on the door) but were missing prior to the last paint job.

Knowing that the only Machinery Lorry on a 15cwt was the KL and the fact that the remains of the body appear correct for the KL, I think that it is a safe bet that the subject truck was a KL.

Colin

[super dave]

The parts truck I picked up last fall is also a M-Mach-1, Seams to be a regular F15A to me.

[James Y]

On Dave's truck he has the 12 leaf rear spring pack instead of the regular 10 leaf spring pack and his truck also has the MACH-1 tag. Would there be other configuration of equipment that would be on the same rear deck style? Other than a KL welder?

Jim

[George McKenzie]

would you be looking for the welder for this truck?

[James Y]

Yes If I could ever find one.

Let me know.

Jim

[George McKenzie]

There was one here that a fellow sold a couple of years ago .I'll give him a call to see where it is .

[James Y]

That would be great George let me know.

[Eric Korhonen]

I have a F15 as well, went out and checked the numbers on tags. Interesting to see how close the numbers are.

Chassis #F15441-M Cab-13
Chassis serial# 40762
Engine serial# 3G-22388-F
CD 312 Built Mar 27/42

Vehicle Code F 15441-M-GS-2

Eric

[George McKenzie]

I wonder what the welder was .? Hobart ,Lincoln ? amperage ,Model # ect. .We are trying to get a hold of the one that was here .Years ago I used a 300 Amp Hobart army welder.Check with Richie Brothers Auctions they may have a lead on one

[rob love]

Welder was a Lincoln which ran on the same great engine as the truck.....a flat head V8 Ford. I remember on mine how heavy that welder was. I used the overhead crane at work to lift it and it's weight was deceiving. We used to tow the CMPs to various displays in Saskathewan and Manitoba with MLVWs. The KL behind a MLVW was like a boat anchor, limiting the MLVW to 65 kmh. Made for a very long trip to Winnipeg.

A loose welder was on Kijiji a couple years ago in Alberta. I think I posted on here on MLU and Rick bought it.

[David Dunlop]

A thought on these data plates.

Both are 1942 and I think that is when KL production actually started. The KL was apparently a dedicated Ford product.

It might be possible that when Ford ramped up for production of this vehicle (for which the cab and chassis assemblies were their sole production concern), the information they had to go on was that it was going to be a new class of 15-cwt Machinery Truck, so the first data plates that were produced were stamped 'MACH -I'.

By the time the KL bodies started arriving from their manufacturers, Ford had much clearer information at hand that stated the coding for these vehicles should delete 'MACH - I' and go with KL. Those cab and chassis with the first iteration of the data plate were left as is and all subsequent production went with the KL coding. So these two vehicles could be very early production KL's.

David

[James Y]

Bringing this thread back to life.

After a spring/summer/fall break I am back on the CMP. I have a couple of different trucks that were sourced one being a F15A with the regular box and a well the other being a KL tuck, i have decided to go down the KL route.

I brought the KL chassis in a couple of weeks ago with the goal to get the motor running I dropped the oil pan and cleaned out all the gunk and got it to fire up.

https://youtu.be/lD6AKC6ghD0

Here is the start up, the truck was probably sitting for 30 plus years with out starting, it Had no compression on 2 cylinders due to stuck valves with super dave's advise i was able to get the valves unstuck and running real smooth.

This was today!

https://youtu.be/5XYaeiizQZ4

Also uncovered a rebuild tag on the motor.

[James Y]

And here was the distraction. The LR WOLF was picked up from BATUS here in Alberta.

We built a trailer based on a Sankey.

Jim

[super dave]

Originally Posted by James Y

Here is the start up, the truck was probably sitting for 30 plus years with out starting, it Had no compression on 2 cylinders due to stuck valves with super dave's advise i was able to get the valves unstuck and running real smooth.

That motor sounds really good

[James Y]

Progress.



I wanted to get the truck deck sandblasted and painted however the original deck was modified by the PO for the tow truck rigging. They had cut the wheelwell and lowered them down for a flat deck. They really did not waste anything as they used the original wheelwell material, this gave me an original pattern to work from.

I cut the wheelwell out from the deck and then took them to make a new ones. This weekends job is to weld them in.

[James Y]

I also took a compression test on the motor I am planning on using. It was pretty consistent so I was very happy with the results.