Long Service Life

[David Dunlop]

Some photos of a pair of Machinery vehicles at CFB Borden that were in active service there until the late 1970's. As a result, most of the kit for them survived when they moved across the base to the museum complex. Both were runners in 1984. The 3-Ton body is an MCI product from Winnipeg. The Ford KL was deliberately moved outside so Peter Ford could drool over it.

A couple of fuzzy details regarding the 3-ton photo. There is a prototype truck hiding behind the 3-ton. I cannot remember if it was a Canadian design, or European, but I remember the museum staff advising us it was a project that never went into full production.

Also, there is a tank engine sitting on the floor in the foreground. Cannot recall what it was out of, however.

David

[Bob Carriere]

...sure looks like the Chrysler model from the early 70...... amphibious no less.

Is it still in Borden/Museum...?

Only seven were made....

One was destroyed at the Orleans testing grounds
One in Cantley, PQ
One at the Kars P&S museum
One on the West coast
One on the East coast
One in Borden.....

Were is the seventh one...?

Bob C

[David Dunlop]

Bob.

That rang a big bell! Yes, I believe it is one of the Chrysler prototypes. The interesting thing about it was from the front end, it bore some resemblances to the Cab 13 CMP.

Not sure if it is still alive and well at Borden. I do know they recovered a large amount of the armour sitting outside for many years and brought it indoors for repairs etc. The prototype was on indoor display back in 84, along with about another dozen vehicles.

While on the subject of prototypes, the Bobcat was on outdoor display in 84, but IIRC it had been gutted of all power train items for some reason, so was basically just a shell.

David

[Bob Carriere]

Why is it that most museum feel the need to gut the inside of historical vehicles..?

That is like saving all the shoe boxes of all the shoes I bought over the years but keep only the last pair of shoes I actually wear.

The Churchill bridge layer at the CWM suffered the same fate. They gutted all the inside, they only have the shell left. When I inquired about the power train, firing mechanism, etc. they denied they ever had them. I know better I was there when it was recovered in 1972 and crawled all over it and inside it..... it was a complete tank.

Hoping they never find out about the balloon inflatable tank decoys or they might want to replace them all with light weight copies.

I can just see a cartoon in the editorial section of the Ottawa Citizen showing a cleaning lady lifting a Sherman by the gun barrell while dust moping underneath.

The engine was a marvel by itself and worthy of its own display. They mated 2 Bedford 6 cyl. engine into a pancake 12 cyl. ....but it was not Canadian so off it went to become Honda bumpers.

Ha! for the good old days.

Bob C

[Bob Carriere]

Yes very boxy but even more cab forward...... you actually sat ahead and on top of the 318. It was very scary running up to the edge of a sand pit....tires stopped on the edge and you actually sitting past the edge.... has you went forward and dropped over your stomach just came up as in a circus ride.

It was nice inside and you could sit 4 on the front seat.... but we were smaller then.

To cross a fast moving stream not deep enought to float but to prevent the stream current to move you sideways .....you left the traps open underneath and allowed the hull to partly fill up with water... the 318 had full water proof iginition like the M37.

Once on the other side you lined the side of the truck with a new Toyota and turned on the bilge pump.... which would shoot water about 20 feet from the side.... including mud, leaves and any oily residue left in the hull...

Mind you... you had to crawl underneath to manually open and close the trap covers.

Tail gate was scooped down in the middle like a CMP tailgate.... but reinforced supposedly to allow the use of a long stalk outboard motor.
When we used it in deep water the 4 rotating tires would propell the truck quite well but with a scary nose down position. It took guts to drive it off a boat ramp at the Hull quay..... scared the begeezus out of a couple of old gents quietly fishing from the edge of the dock.

The all aluminium shell was easily dented and knowledge of working/repairing alum. bodies was rare. The model we played with had a special "one of" solid roof and incorporated the ventilation system duct for the sealed hull. Both front and rear axles had special 4 inch spacers between the sheet metal cover and the cast iron shell. These where cast as a water jacket cooling system connected to the engine cooling system. Working on the power train meant removing cover panels in the cargo bay and crawling inside... not very pleasant on a hot Summer day.

Circa late 70s.

Bob C

[lynx42]

Originally Posted by David Dunlop

Also, there is a tank engine sitting on the floor in the foreground. Cannot recall what it was out of, however.

David

I think that that engine is out of a, or, the Churchill Bob mentioned.

Regards Rick.

[Bob Carriere]

I would be pleasantly surprised to hear that it would be the engine that came out of the bridgelayer in Ottawa.....

From what I can see it looks like a V type engine. I beleive that the Churchill was a pancake 12.... with 6 cylinders opposed to each other..... two 6 cylinder engines sharing a common crankcase. The engine bay was packed tight but it was a huge engine... mind you the Chruchill was a huge tank. Once inside you had room to move...particularly the bridge layer who had the turret removed..... the extra space on each side within the tracks made it appear even bigger. The back wall of the fighting compartment, separating the engine compartment was holding two huge solid mounted fire extinguishers..... behind the driver and within the track sponsoon was the firing mechanism for launching the forward ramp and dropping the rear ramp.
It was explained to me that the large brass buttons firing system looked similar to naval installations for firing large naval guns. The forward ramp was deployed by setting of 3 naval rockets on each side of the folded ramp. It was strong enough to raise and swing the ramps forward a full 180 degrees against a seawall. Externally, at the rear was a container of empty tubes for storing the 4 to 5 feet long rockets. The armpored external cabling for the connections was about 2.5 inches in diametre. The rear ramp was held cocked up at about 45 degrees with heavy cables. It was deployed by n means of explosive bolts which allowed to drop in place. The front ramp was folded on top at about a 30 degree angle. When fired it pivoted up and forward which created a steel bridge for following tanks to drive over. I understand that it was meant to allow tanks to breach concrete curved seawalls in continental Europe. They never did see any action and were deployed in displays/testing only. Why did two of the 11 or 13 ever made reach Canada is hard to explain. There was some files in the National Archives which seemed to indicate they were sent here then to the USA for testing then brought back to Canada. By then the D Day had long passed.
The two on them, complete, were found in a junk yard outside of Kemptville.

The CWM bought one for $1000. plus delivery by Hurdsman to the Annex on Sussex drive and left in the curb of the traffic lanes at 4 pm on a Friday afternoon in December 1972 with two safety cones marking its presence. The musuem had made no provison to move the tank when it arrived. he long float was unhooked, the wooden blocks holdingit in place were knocked off and it rooled by itself into the street. The following week Long branch sent a team with crane from Montreal to lift it bodily and position it in the small paved parking lot next to the Annex. It stayed there for years slowly sinking its massive weight into the pavement. It had taken two days, and a large bulldozer, to get it out of the ground in Kemptville where it had sunk to the belly pan. There was a newspaper article in one of the weekend editions of the January 73 Ottawa Journal newspaper. That is about the time I got infected with OD green.

The side vents on these Churchills had the extended snorkel duct work necessary for sea trials/landings.

Bob C.