1953 m38a1 cdn

[wingnut]

Hi I have a 1953 m38a1 cdn cfr 53-32744 and would like to find out any history on it. Also would anyone know how this batch of cdn jeeps came to be in the u.k. thanks in advance . best regards Bernard.

[Ed Storey]

Bernard; do you have the vehicle's serial number? It could have been a 4 Brigade vehicle (Germany) that was sold as surplus in Europe.

[maple_leaf_eh]

There is a little book published by Clive Law at Service Publications that will help fill in the blanks on your Jeep. The early contracts are better described than the later ones, but for less than $20 you will learn more than any of us can remember.

[Frank v R]

all the history you will find about your vehicle is in the layers of paint, time to wet sand and be gentle some of the markings will be decals ,DO NOT SANDBLAST !! the vehicle is too old to find records within the CF, you may be lucky and have one of the jeeps that took part in Nato Ex in Norway, nice Cam scheme, please send me (click here) a 3/4 front photo of your vehicle for the data base with the CFR# in the photo , it would be great if you can post some general photos of your vehicle for interesting details, you may have a Willy's or Ford produced M-38A1 cdn, the Willys are rare, your CFR number also tells us that the vehicle was not equipped with radios upon issue, 32 being non radio , 33 radio equipped , this may have changed later during the vehicles service life, hope this helps

[Ed Storey]

Frank: What about the M38A1s that have a CFR which starts with 31?

[BCA]

From my understanding the CFR number system (Canadian Forces Registration number) has the prefix year when the number was assigned. In this case: 53 for 1953. Then a dash mark. In the case of the 1/4-ton jeep the next digit is 3 which signifies the weight class of the vehicle, in this case a 1/4-ton truck. This leaves only 4 more digits.
I believe these four digits started at 0001 for the first 1952 M38 (i.e 52-30001) and progressed to about 52-3220 or so. I believe when the 1953 M38A1 jeeps were received that the last 4 digits of the CFR number were continuous with the last issued M38 CFR.
It is interesting to note that the ordnance code for the M38 and the M38A1 were the same: 2230 wo /wn and 2231 w/wn so this implies that the army didn't really differentiate between the M38 and M38A1.
There is photographic evidence of M38's with CFR's like 53-33xxx but I don't know why this high series existed. As Frank suggests it may be related to specialized equipment that was added and therefore the CFR was changed. However I would want to see documentation on this possibility.
Of particular interest of the UK M38A1 would be to know the Ford serial number and the date of delivery (MM-DD-YY) on the dashboard brass serial plate.

[wingnut]

Hi thank you everyone for your replies to my questions. the serial number on the dash plate is 200578 date is 2-53.Built by ford at the windsor plant. the jeep is in very good condition and looks like it has never had a major rebuild although it has been repainted a few times. It is now marked up as a u.s. army jeep but i would like to do it in it,s original service markings if i can find any .I do already have the book m38a1 quarter ton truck in canadian service by andrew iarocci but is there another. I will try to get some help to post some pics soon as i,m not too good on computers. Best regards bernard.

[Ed Storey]

Bernard, the book by Andrew Iarocci is the one that Terry was talking about. Good to hear that you have a copy.

[mel gabel]

I have a 1953 M38A1CDN made by Ford under contract LV600 - ARMY.

The mfr serial number is F200574 - 4 units prior to the jeep at the start of this thread.

The CFR number is 53-32610. No evidence of any radio equipment having been added to the jeep, or any other modifications by the Cdn Forces, other than turn signals common to military jeeps of this era.

The delivery date is 2-12-53. Not sure if that means Feb 12 or Dec 2.

This jeep came directly from Crown Assets during a public auction in Nov 1974 at the Downsview base in Toronto, Ontario.

[wingnut]

Hi. the fake u,s. army hood number on this jeep reads 231253 . Not sure how this was arrived at. also data plate marked lv600 army. Thanks for your input . Best regards Bernard.

[wingnut]

Hi, these are the photos requested! Best regards Bernard.

[Frank v R]

Hi Ed , I do not have info on a 31 , just the other ones , found it in some of my early 60's paperwork , I need to talk to Eric on some of the photos he's had in CMP , and I'll take a look to see if there is a pattern for the "31" vehicles , I'm only going to look at the M-38A1cdn's

[BCA]

All M38CDN and M38A1's were stamped with a "Delivered Date" of the format MM-DD-YY or Month-Day-Year. Be warned that the Ford serial number sequence does not always match the date sequence. For example F-200445, 5-5-53 has delivered date much later than F-200459, 2-12-53. So do not interpolate missing dates by comparison with other documented jeeps.
Bernard: your serial number is stamped much more clearly than most however I can not make out the month of your delivered date. It is most likely a 2 , 3, 4 or 5 (Feb/Mar/Apr/May) but take note of my comments about out-of-sequence dates. Can you examine it closely to help identify the month?
The lower right corner has an inspector's stamp. I think it is the common "IS" over the logo with "E19" below the logo, although I have seen variations. Can you confirm? The inspector's logo is often referred to as the "Canadian Tire" logo due to its shape. Can anyone confirm the meaning of this logo or the use of this type of stamp: unique to the inspector at the Ford plant? Seen on other vehicles or army equipment like firearms etc.
Finally: the lowest CFR number that I have seen on an M38A1CDN is 53-32181. Ignoring the date (52 or 53) and the first "3" which is the 1/4-ton vehicle class this leaves only 4 more digits to identify the jeep series of vehicles. Considering these last 4 digits: I believe they started numbering M38's (roughly 2165 made) at 0001 and continued straight through into the M38A1's (roughly 700 vehicles). The highest M38A1 CFR number I have seen is 53-32908).
I propose that the a block of CFR numbers ending in 33XXX was set aside for US-purchased Willys vehicles, rebuilt vehicles, special equipment vehicles or for re-assigning a new CFR number at a later date. The date pre-fix is largely irrevelent: the army only used the last 5 digits of the CFR for assigning a license plate.
Comments welcome. there is lots to learn.
....Brian