|
#1
|
||||
|
||||
Hamilton's own Armoured Car
Hi everyone.
I just got the book "Hamilton at War, On the Home Front" by Margaret Houghton the other day for my birthday. One of the capters was on an armoured car that Hamilton's Home defense Force had had made for the defense of Hamilton. The first was delivered on Aug 24, 1940. It states that a "heavy truck chassis from International Harvester was armoured from stern to stern with welded armour plate provided by a local steel mill and assembeld by Hamilton Bridge Company to a completely original design." The chapter goes on that the armoured car "was entierly Hamilton made with the exception of the revolving machine gun turret which had to be built in Toronto. A 45 caliber Thompson sub machine gun was installed in the turret." There was also radio equipment installed to receive calls from police headquarters. Its other attributes were that it weighed 5 tons and coudl reach 60 mph. (Id love to see it stop in a hurry at those speeds) The funny part was that it was planned to house it at the Central Police station. However it turned out to big to fit the door and they had to relocate it to an east end fire station. Unfourtunaltey when the Hamilton Home guard stood down in 1945 its fate was uncertain. Both the fire and jail commitee want to dismantle it to use the chassis for a service truck. This resulted in a big argument over it as the Hamilton Auxiliary Defense Corps said it belonged to them and not the Fire and Jail commitees and that the City had little jurisdiction over it. However it had been licensed under the city because the Hamilton Auxiliary Defense Corps was not incorporated. Its fate is not exactly known as there was no sign of it in the Hamilton Police Department's annual report for 1945. The text above and the photos below were paraphraised from the book. I ahve also found a bunch of Spectator articles on the internet anout the armoured car. I will try to post copies of them over the next few days. Does anyone have any suggestions as to what kind of chassis would have been used? Also what kind of engine. I have tried finding more photos but no luck. I will try and get in touch with the author to find out if she has any more ideas.
__________________
Jordan Baker RHLI Museum, Otter LRC C15A-Wire3, 1944 Willys MB, 1942 10cwt Canadian trailer |
#2
|
||||
|
||||
Here is a close up of the truck from the previous photo.
__________________
Jordan Baker RHLI Museum, Otter LRC C15A-Wire3, 1944 Willys MB, 1942 10cwt Canadian trailer |
#3
|
||||
|
||||
interesting stuff
would love to see more info and pictures on this truck.
Was the lower turret fixed or revolving? The basic layout of the hull, including raised driver and commander or co-driver position, is similar to the early type South African "Marmon-Herrington" armoured reconaissance cars. The Hamilton was of course 4x2 as it used an International chassis, probably a D-line, the heaviest of which was the D50 (also sold in Canada) tractor unit with dual rear wheels. 1940 saw the advent of the restyled K-line trucks... Kind regards, Nuyt |
#4
|
||||
|
||||
Re: interesting stuff
Quote:
__________________
Those who live by the sword will be shot by those of us who have progressed. - M38A1, 67-07800, ex LETE |
#5
|
||||
|
||||
Great photo. Anymore?
That thing sure was a beast of an armoured car wasn't it.
__________________
Jordan Baker RHLI Museum, Otter LRC C15A-Wire3, 1944 Willys MB, 1942 10cwt Canadian trailer |
#6
|
||||
|
||||
thanks
great picture!
Yep, double rear wheels... Kind regards, Nuyt |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
KB 5.........
Quote:
He told me those were the last ones there and the were building "Tanks" when he was there to get his truck...they may have been building half tracks ,that would look like a tank to a Saskatchawan farm boy.. Anyway the wheels are the same as used on the KB and COE 4&5 International..I can't see the rear wheels but they were also spoked.. THis is out of the KB manuals.. Front wheel...
__________________
Alex Blair :remember :support :drunk: |
#8
|
|||
|
|||
According to John Wallace in his book "Dragoms of Steel" page 131 it eventually ended up at Borden. I would imagine the statement "armoured from stern to stern with welded armour plate provided by a local steel mill" is an exaggeration. The plating would almost certainly be of mild steel as armour plate production in Canada did not get going until the fall of 1940 and was not being produced in anything like sufficinet quantity even in July 1941 (see Clive Law's book Making Tracks, page 11.
While we are on the subject of one-off Canadian armoured cars, in the fall of 1940 the Dept of Munitions and Supply commissioned two "Wheeled Tanks" using Ford chassis and bodies made by Hamilton Bridge. One was on a 4x4 Ford rear engined 101 inch wheelbase chassis. It had a slope sided mild steel body and a two man turret similar to that of a British cruiser tank, with a Browning .30 calibre machine gun and a dummy 2-pounder. It weighed 6.6 tonnes and was powered by a Ford V8. It had two floating wheels on stub axles so sometine sis referred to as a 6 wheeler. It was tested at Borden in early 1941. The front axle and suspension turned out to be very fragile. DM&S wanted to make some improved versions but DND overruled them and opted for a Humber type body on a GM chassis - the future Fox. DM&S also built a pilot Ford 8x8. It weighed 32,000 lbs needed three Mercury engines to power it and was fitted with a Ram I turret. When tested in llate 1941 the steering and suspension proved unsatisfactory and needed a complete redesign. Ford planned to replace its three V8 engines with a Continental engine, and it would seem a Ram II turret with a 6-pdr was planned. In April 1942 DND estimated it was 18 months away from production, and was quite happy to cancel the project when the British Tank Purchasing Commission ordered the T18E2 Boarhound. At the same time the Fox, Lynx and Otter received their names in early 1942, the 8x8 was christened the Wolf I. I would be most interested if anyone has any pictures, drawings or more detailed specs of the Wolf. Here is a picture of the 4x4 "Wheeled Tank" Roger Lucy |
#9
|
||||
|
||||
This was in todays Hamilton Spectator.
http://www.thespec.com/News/Local/article/237306 August 22, 2007 Paul Legall The Hamilton Spectator (Aug 22, 2007) It was built of plate steel and paranoia and designed to crush any domestic group from commies to fascists who might try to undermine the war effort. The Hamilton-built vehicle was a forerunner of today's light-armoured vehicle (LAV) and was trotted out with great fanfare during a public rally at the old Hamilton Civic Stadium in the fall of 1940. It wasn't just an armoured car. It was also a symbol of the xenophobic attitude of many in this city to immigrants and anyone else who posed a perceived threat to the wartime status quo. Mounted on a standard truck chassis with rubber tires, it was riveted together with boiler-gauge steel and had several gun slots in the hull as well as a turret on top. By today's high-tech military standard, it was almost like a Tonka toy on steroids. But in 1940, it was the only vehicle of its kind in Canada and the pride and joy of a group of volunteer soldiers called the Hamilton Auxiliary Defence Corps or Home Guard. A raft of old documents, including minutes of defence corps meetings, that have recently surfaced reveal a telling story about attitudes of the time. Consisting mostly of veterans of the Great War, the founders of the auxiliary were obsessed with rooting out disloyal citizens whom they described as "enemy aliens" or "fifth columnists." They feared non-British immigrants would side with the Axis powers and commit acts of sabotage in Hamilton. During the war, the auxiliary co-operated with the RCMP in drawing up lists of suspected Italian fascists, many of whom were interned in camps without due process. After the unveiling ceremony, the vehicle was kept under 24-hour guard in a fire station on Sanford Avenue. It disappeared after the war and its fate remains a mystery. As the war progressed, the ranks of the volunteer corps swelled to the thousands. The guardsmen identified themselves with arm bands and berets and were issued a variety of weapons, including 800 shotguns and six gangster-style Tommy guns like the ones used in the Valentine's Day Massacre. Hamilton police Sergeant Gary Ostofi, who is also a Navy Captain and president of the Royal Hamilton Military Institute, recently discovered a stack of musty old documents that have cast new light on the history of the auxiliary corps. The materials, which will be turned over to the archives at the Hamilton Public Library, reveal an almost pathological paranoia of immigrants and suspected dissidents. In the minutes, the auxiliary leaders suggested pre-emptive measures to lessen the threat of a domestic uprising. They were confident there were no longer any weapons in "the hands of local enemy aliens," after a five-year police roundup of guns. But the guardsmen were concerned they still owned cars that could be used to form a flying hit squad. As a preventive measure, they suggested their licence plates be revoked and that no foreigners be granted citizenship until the end of the war. They also expressed concern that alien enemies were running in the municipal elections and recommended taking out newspaper ads to denounce them. J.F. Cauley urged his colleagues to prevent persons linked with "organizations disloyal to the Empire ... from getting a foothold in municipal candidates." "This organization is unalterably opposed to the election to city council, or any of the elective body, any person who has been at any time connected with any Nazi, Fascist or Communist party," Cauley stated in a motion. Members of the auxiliary also discussed how they could arm themselves and got weekly reports on the construction of the armoured car, which was a joint project involving the Hamilton Bridge Company, Dominion Foundries and Turnbull Elevator. On Aug. 26, 1940, the armoured car committee reported the prototype, which was to be the first of three vehicles, had passed all the tests with "flying colours", including withstanding machine-gun fire at point blank range. It would soon be in the hands of the home guard and ready for action. To forestall any suggestions they were building a private army, the auxiliary corps members had Hamilton city hall pick up the $9,000 bill for the armoured car. The other cars were never built. A police officer for more than 40 years, Ostofi has no idea what happened to the vehicle after the war. By the time he joined the officers' club in the 1970s, all the old veterans who'd promoted the project were gone. But the Tommy guns did surface again at the old Hamilton police station in the 1970s. Now considered antiques, the machine guns were sold back to the American company that built them and the proceeds were used to buy assault rifles for the newly formed police tactical team. "It was a different time, I guess," Ostofi mused when asked about the attitudes of the day. "We were at war. It was a little different than today when we debate whether we should be in Afghanistan. "There was no debate in this. You were either for us or against us." plegall@thespec.com 905-526-3385
__________________
Jordan Baker RHLI Museum, Otter LRC C15A-Wire3, 1944 Willys MB, 1942 10cwt Canadian trailer |
#10
|
||||
|
||||
Just bringing this back to the forfront to see if anyone has found any more info on Hamilton's Armoured Car.
Im very interested in more photos, especially those showing the back/rear side.
__________________
Jordan Baker RHLI Museum, Otter LRC C15A-Wire3, 1944 Willys MB, 1942 10cwt Canadian trailer |
#11
|
|||
|
|||
revisionist history
Quote:
__________________
Terry Warner - 74-????? M151A2 - 70-08876 M38A1 - 53-71233 M100CDN trailer Beware! The Green Disease walks among us! |
#12
|
||||
|
||||
__________________
Jordan Baker RHLI Museum, Otter LRC C15A-Wire3, 1944 Willys MB, 1942 10cwt Canadian trailer |
#13
|
|||
|
|||
Any more on the hamilton armd car?
Just curious if anything more, including photos, has surfaced about the armoured car. Fascinating story. Would be very interested in seeing any further photographs of this beast.
Cheers! Don Allen |
#14
|
||||
|
||||
I just spent couple of hours at the Hamilton Public library special collections branch and found a few more. Once I get home I'll post them up. Sadly I think they will be it other then what people have in their own private albums.
My dream is to eventually build a full size replica. Slowly it's becoming a reality.
__________________
Jordan Baker RHLI Museum, Otter LRC C15A-Wire3, 1944 Willys MB, 1942 10cwt Canadian trailer |
|
|