Longest serving mv in cf

[Robin Craig]

Gents,

Allied to a thread I have running on another forum, I challenge nominations with provenance for inclusion to this.

Please dont be glib and haul off and post without dates that can't be proven.

My entry is an M100 trailer, delivery date as per data plate as 3/53 and serial number 1172 out of service / disposed this year and bought yesterday so that makes it 58 years of service in the CF. Admittedly it was a training aide for the last part of its usage but it is still "in use" which is all that counts in my book.

For those interested, the trailer is sold and will be delivered to its new owner tonight.

Pictures to follow tonight hopefully.


R

[rob love]

We still use a WW2 Sorel Industries Limited 25 pdr howitzer as a funeral carriage in Shilo. It has never left DND service. I would have to check the date of the gun, but if the latest is 1945 (may well be a year or three older than that), then it would still be in service after 66 years of Service and still counting with no end in sight.

[Robin Craig]

Rob,

That is great to hear, I suspect that it may match closely the UK DUKWs still in service with the Royal Marines.

Is the gun complete?

Does it have a CFR on display.

I lost track of that gun at Uplands in Ottawa a good numbers of years ago, it just evaporated.


Any chance of pictures please?

R

[Mike Kelly]

One of those was or still is on the Govt. books . Never been in civvy street . It is based on a RAF / Air ministry test airfield somewhere in the UK. It was featued in a MV mag .

Mike

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

The RAF MoD test airfield must surely by Boscombe Down, Wiltshire unless it's the 'field in north Wales.

I keep hearing about the RM DUKWs but a friend who was an RCT officer queries if any are left? I have a photo of an RN Duck in 1958 in Portsmouth.

[Wpns 421]

One of the oldest pieces of gear in service today in the CF are the Boffin 40MM guns that are on the coastal ships. These guns were put into service during WWII and are still serving today. The mounts have been changed but the gun remains the same. I worked on the guns in CFB Gagetown in the Air Defence part of the Artillery school.
A couple years ago I say a video by DND showing the new improverd mounts and the trainers, impressive new mounts beautiful old guns. Gilles

[Robin Craig]

Mike + David

The Royal Marines have the DUKWs at Instow in Devon and are at trials facility there. They were repowered a while ago but still serving strong.

Gilles, Im trying to talk about land based equipment not Navy kit but thanks anyway.

Robin

[Yeo.NT]

Would appear this is going off topic to weapons instead of vehicles, but heres my 2 cents. Browning Hi-Power 9mm pistol MkI, 1944 to present, I carried MkI last year in afghanistan and I doubt its going any where soon

[Robin Craig]

Perhaps you should start another thread on longest serving weapon?

R

[rob love]

Originally Posted by Wpns 421

One of the oldest pieces of gear in service today in the CF are the Boffin 40MM guns that are on the coastal ships. These guns were put into service during WWII and are still serving today. The mounts have been changed but the gun remains the same. I worked on the guns in CFB Gagetown in the Air Defence part of the Artillery school.
A couple years ago I say a video by DND showing the new improverd mounts and the trainers, impressive new mounts beautiful old guns. Gilles

I know a guy at DRES who was involved in a Bofors project just a couple years ago. I think it was an update to modernise and install them onto some coast guard vessels. In the end I think his comment was: "They really are yesterday's gun."

Actually Gilles, perhaps you can recall better than I, but it seems to me that some of the C1 howitzer caissons were US made, and some a mix of US made caisson and SIL barrel, breech ring and recoil. The caissons I recall were WW2 dated.

DRES in Suffield also had some other long obsolete equipment around including a never released M37 3/4 ton, and a 155 long tom which I saw just a few years ago.

As to weapons, the Cno7s were 1944 to 1946, while the Cno4s were potentially dated 1941 and newer. If we are going to talk general equipment though, then the oldest item I can recall still in service are the Stanley prismatic compasses, some of which date back to the first world war.

Another vehicle I just recalled are a couple of Centurians which languish at the recovery training area in Borden. They would get pushed down the hill just to be winched back up. Haven't been back in a decade, so can't confirm that they are still there.

[Scott Bentley]

Now that you mention it Rob, there are at least 3 x M37's sitting at the Cameron Centre in Suffield. They are actually in surprisingly good condition. No sign of them getting retired anytime soon. Considering what they are used for, I doubt they will ever be auctioned either

[Robin Craig]

Just so you know the same thread in the UK that I started has scared up a truly amazing result.

The 13 pounder guns used by Kings Troop Royal Horse Artillery date from 1915


R

[rob love]

I think a better yardstick for a thread like this would be vehicles and trailers that are still on the books and used as vehicles. Problem with howitzers and guns are they tend to stick around in a ceremonial use forever.

To that end, I saw a number of M101 3/4 ton trailers in the range control compound at Connought the other week. I did not go close enough to them to tell if they were 50s or late 60s production. How these things manage to not get disposed of on retirement of a fleet is beyond me.

[maple_leaf_eh]

Originally Posted by Robin Craig

Just so you know the same thread in the UK that I started has scared up a truly amazing result.

The 13 pounder guns used by Kings Troop Royal Horse Artillery date from 1915

There are some (well, one I could count) naval signal gun used by the sea cadets for gun drills that are at least pre-WWI. The tube is in-the-white gun metal. Before heavy snow cracked the roof trusses at the navy barracks at Dow's Lake, Ottawa, that gun used to be parked in the side of the drill floor - next to the 9 Pound Rifled Muzzleloader, circa 1875 ... beat that!

[Wpns 421]

Hey Robin Don't blame me for starting the weapons annotations, blame it on Rob Love, he started it. It's not my fault Dad, Rob did it. HaHa. It's easy to blame him, he's far away. But in the end we got some really excellent(UFI) info. That's what this forum is about. Just out of curiosity, Robin was the person who bought the Iltis at Rideau auction the same guy who has the MLVWs? Curious Gilles

[Robin Craig]

The Iltis were bought by one person, not the same as the ML guy.

R

[rob love]

Originally Posted by Wpns 421

Hey Robin Don't blame me for starting the weapons annotations, blame it on Rob Love, he started it. It's not my fault Dad, Rob did it. HaHa. It's easy to blame him, he's far away.

Only as far away as the keyboard.

The gun I quoted is on wheels, and presently used in a transportation role. The guns you quoted are shipborne, and the ships, quite frankly, are not that old.

Tsk tsk, when will the 421s learn that they cannot beat their masters (411s) in debate.

While this thread has meandered (as usual) it's always interesting to hear about what's still out there.

[Robin Craig]

Rob

Thanks for moderating this thread

Gilles thanks for your input on the weapons side.

The Kings Troop guns go out on a regular basis with a reg force unit but admittedly in ceremonial role.

So to clarify, in use for "work" we have the DUKWs in the UK

Link here to some pictures http://www.18coyrasc.btck.co.uk/2010REUNION

and in the "ceremonial" category the Kings Troop 13 pounders http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ordnance_QF_13_pounder which according to this link were actually made in or started production in 1904. This makes them over a century old according to my math.

R

[45jim]

I took the last Sherman still on strength from LETE where it was used as a tug. Turret removed, it had been previously modified to mount magnets for range clearance and then relegated to hauling stuck vehicles. We got it to use as a power pack doner for our Sherman restoration in Calgary with the Strathcona's. It had CFR plates on it, we got the maintenance log books and had to do a normal vehicle transfer to get it. It was then struck off strength in Calgary. It was just before LETE closed, about 1994. I think I have some photos about. I'll have to ask about its current disposition, but I imagine Cold Lake or Wainwright to replace vehicles we removed for parts or restoration. So about 48 years, for a vehicle still listed as an "A" echelon vehicle.

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Frow Wiki:

The Royal Marines still use four of these vehicles for training purposes at 11 (Amphibious Trials and Training)Squadron, 1 Assault Group Royal Marines at Instow North Devon. The DUKWs are used for safety to allow the training of all ranks to undertake Drills for boat work for the landing craft ranks and the drivers undertaking wading drills from the LCU (Landing Craft Utility

This RN-registered Duck was photographed ('shot' ) at Portsmouth Naval Base (HMS Nelson) in 1956 I think, at a round of Lorry Driver of the Year.

[Robin Craig]

Jim,

somewhere, I have prints of that Sherman in a wonderful yellow all over scheme minus turret with a powerpack hung off the rear and some kind of de mining kit out front. I undrstand it was used to clear up some lands being handed back to an aboriginal group.

When I saw it at LETE I was visiting to research another vehicle and it used to sit in a lone building off to the right of the main building at the back of the car park.

R

[Scott Bentley]

I'll post up the CFR and location once I regain access to EDR, but there is at least one 1952 M38CDN that has been converted to a Parade Reviewing Vehicle that is still on the books. That would definitely count as a CF SMP Vehicle that is still used as a "Vehicle".

[rob love]

Originally Posted by 45jim

I took the last Sherman still on strength from LETE where it was used as a tug. Turret removed, it had been previously modified to mount magnets for range clearance and then relegated to hauling stuck vehicles. We got it to use as a power pack doner for our Sherman restoration in Calgary with the Strathcona's. It had CFR plates on it, we got the maintenance log books and had to do a normal vehicle transfer to get it. It was then struck off strength in Calgary. It was just before LETE closed, about 1994. I think I have some photos about. I'll have to ask about its current disposition, but I imagine Cold Lake or Wainwright to replace vehicles we removed for parts or restoration. So about 48 years, for a vehicle still listed as an "A" echelon vehicle.

With many of the M113A1s having a build date of 1966 to 1968, they are already at the 45 year mark and still climbing. Sure they have been upgraded to A2 and now A3 status, but they are still in that age range.

I remember that yellow Sherman when I was in Gagetown in 1980. I believe it went to Sarcee later to help clear the ranges I believe, and then to LETE.

[Wpns 421]

I believe that the M38 parade vehicle is in CFB Borden because I remember a parade jeep there. Also I think there is a Sherman in 202Wksp in Montreal, I remember the vehicle as it was used as a towing for bringing in Leopards from the parking. It was in Bldg #3. Gilles

[Jason Ginn]

Originally Posted by rob love

Another vehicle I just recalled are a couple of Centurians which languish at the recovery training area in Borden. They would get pushed down the hill just to be winched back up. Haven't been back in a decade, so can't confirm that they are still there.

Back in 1993 i saw one of the Centurions down in the gully in the recovery area. It was missing all of the coffins and had a tree growing out if the engine decks. I seem to recall that it was painted a John Deere shade of green.

I made a few inquiries last winter when I was at Borden for a few days and it was apparently recovered one last time a few years back and is now a monument somewhere on base.

[maple_leaf_eh]

Originally Posted by Robin Craig

Jim,

somewhere, I have prints of that Sherman in a wonderful yellow all over scheme minus turret with a powerpack hung off the rear and some kind of de mining kit out front. I undrstand it was used to clear up some lands being handed back to an aboriginal group.

When I saw it at LETE I was visiting to research another vehicle and it used to sit in a lone building off to the right of the main building at the back of the car park.

R

That was the old Calgary training area where DND had to guarantee no ordnance or leftovers down to some specified depth. The EOD company was a private business. They may have leased a military owned vehicle, but that is purely speculation from me.

[sapper740]

Originally Posted by Wpns 421

I believe that the M38 parade vehicle is in CFB Borden because I remember a parade jeep there. Also I think there is a Sherman in 202Wksp in Montreal, I remember the vehicle as it was used as a towing for bringing in Leopards from the parking. It was in Bldg #3. Gilles

RCEME at Borden keeps an M38A1CDN in tip top shape for Change of Command parades and reviewing the troops by dignitaries, complete with chrome plated grab bars so as to allow the reviewers to stand. I saw it in use once back in 1996 and it's still going strong, I assume.

CHEEMO! Derek.

[sapper740]

Canada's LOGBatt Bluebell Garage in the Golan Heights had what I believed to be a WWII (might have been post-war) era WC-14 still putting about the base when I was there in 1999. Any RCEME types out there that had been posted to Camp Zouani remember this truck? I was told it had been re-engined, but I never took the opportunity to check it out. I believe this truck is a good candidate for the oldest, still in military use vehicle anywhere on the planet.

CHEEMO! Derek.

[Phil Waterman]

I've been waiting since this thread began for someone to mention the F15 Welding unit that I believe is still in the Camp Bordon Museum, and back in 1984 the museum had (as the story goes) wrestled it out of the hands of base maintenance who wanted it back because of its usefulness.

Cheers Phil

[sapper740]

Originally Posted by Phil Waterman

I've been waiting since this thread began for someone to mention the F15 Welding unit that I believe is still in the Camp Bordon Museum, and back in 1984 the museum had (as the story goes) wrestled it out of the hands of base maintenance who wanted it back because of its usefulness.

Cheers Phil

Does time spent in a museum constitute military service or should it be deducted from the total?;>)

CHEEMO! Derek