Photos of an old abused veteran

[Keith Webb]

Originally Posted by Lionelgee

Hello All,

I did a google image search of Cab 13 CMP and I came across a site which mentioned that there were more series of cabs after the Cab 13. From this MLU site I have learnt about a 11-12 & 13. If there were series of cabs after 13 what years were they manufactured and how were they each different from the 13?

Kind Regards
Lionel

In fact it went right up to 43 but there was nothing in between. The cab 43 was built as a roofless wide version to carry a bofors gun crew.

There were also many detail differences between the first 1942 model cab 13s and the final version.

[Lionelgee]

Originally Posted by Keith Webb

In fact it went right up to 43 but there was nothing in between. The cab 43 was built as a roofless wide version to carry a bofors gun crew.

There were also many detail differences between the first 1942 model cab 13s and the final version.

Thanks Keith

I remember someone on another thread directed someone to stay with Fords as Chevy's were too complex. Well it seems CMP land is just as complex. I went to your site Keith before posting my last message and I could only see cab 13 as the highest number cab - of course I could have been looking on the wrong part of your site.

Also someone sent an image from a CMP Shop Manual and it featured lines and bubbles leading to different parts of the truck the photograph was taken from. Has anyone done a similar thing for example the great photos of Max's trucks and drawn arrows on the photo saying note the differences between the headlights on the two trucks? The Cab 11 has lights mounted on the mudguards and the Cab 13 has the headlights integrated into the mudguards. With information like this newbies could learn a lot of things and no ask so many questions. There are those books by Dr Grigg or spelt something similar which people have referred to on MLU however I have not seen one. However has anyone written an Australian New Zealand CMP book showing them and the changes between series from Cab 11 to OMG Cab 43?

Kind Regards
Lionel

[Lionelgee]

Keith, does your CMP DVD have a commentary which points out differences between trucks or do you have to work it out by just looking at the DVD?

Kind Regards
Lionel

[Keith Webb]

Originally Posted by Lionelgee

Keith, does your CMP DVD have a commentary which points out differences between trucks or do you have to work it out by just looking at the DVD?

Kind Regards
Lionel

No, the DVD is mostly about the 2002 Corowa event with a few side trips. Mike Cecil of the AWM does give a good history of the CMP in Australian use though.

And as I haven't yet finished the 2009 DVD yet I may take that on board and do a complete rundown on how the early and late cabs vary, also how the Australian Chev cab was completely built here and how it differs from the Canadian version.

But don't let that stop you buying the first DVD - there's a lot of CMP action in it including some material from Canada.

As for the site, I don't have anything on the 43 as it wasn't used here and I don't have pics.

Cliff is right, Dodge did make a prototype cab 13 using what looks to be a Ford cab.

There is also a shot in Bill Gregg's book with a cab 13 with all three manufacturer's badges on the grille.

[cliff]

I think the photo below is of the 43 cab. Whole unit was known as an F60B - the B standing for bofers. Not used by Australia.

Two other models not mentioned yet in the CMP lineup for you Lionel is the C60X, a 6X6 chev version and the F60H a 6X4 version with a lazy non driven extra axle at the rear. The C60X had a 13 cab on it and was used here in Australia but the F60H is not known to have made it to Australia and the photos I have seen show it with an 11 and 12 cab fitted.

[Keith Webb]

Originally Posted by cliff

I think the photo below is of the 43 cab. Whole unit was known as an F60B - the B standing for bofers. Not used by Australia.

Two other models not mentioned yet in the CMP lineup for you Lionel is the C60X, a 6X6 chev version and the F60H a 6X4 version with a lazy non driven extra axle at the rear. The C60X had a 13 cab on it and was used here in Australia but the F60H is not known to have made it to Australia and the photos I have seen show it with an 11 and 12 cab fitted.

Yes the F60B was for Bofors. Another obscure Ford was the F60T, a 115" wheelbase tractor for trailers.

The F60H appeared with a cab 13 as well as can be seen on page 248 and 249 of Bart Vanderveen's excellent 'Observers fighting vehicles directory' as both a Breakdown version and Folding Boat Equipment.
Another oddity quoted by Bart on page 249 was a 'Truck, 3-ton APT w/winch GM/Chrysler' fitted with a Chrysler 8 cylinder engine, 5 pilot models built including FAT of which there is a picture available. The engine was quoted as a 323.5 CID sidevalve.
Australia also produced an interesting one-off experiment when we created a half track based on a C60S and carrier components. It was not a success.

[Lionelgee]

Originally Posted by Keith Webb

Yes the F60B was for Bofors. Another obscure Ford was the F60T, a 115" wheelbase tractor for trailers.

The F60H appeared with a cab 13 as well as can be seen on page 248 and 249 of Bart Vanderveen's excellent 'Observers fighting vehicles directory' as both a Breakdown version and Folding Boat Equipment.
Another oddity quoted by Bart on page 249 was a 'Truck, 3-ton APT w/winch GM/Chrysler' fitted with a Chrysler 8 cylinder engine, 5 pilot models built including FAT of which there is a picture available. The engine was quoted as a 323.5 CID sidevalve.
Australia also produced an interesting one-off experiment when we created a half track based on a C60S and carrier components. It was not a success.

G"Day Cliff and Keith,

This CMP stuff just gets more and more bizarre. Just when I grasp a little of the Cab 11 – 12 & 13 differences I am informed that it went up to series 43. I have picked up from you two blokes and other contributors to MLU that there were variations between nationalities that assembled CMPs. So you could have a generic Cab 13 pattern yet there would be differences between the Canadian versions, and the Australian and the New Zealand version; plus some were assembled in Russia. Also that Ford chassis are longer than Chevrolet chassis. This bit puts the mockers on some article I read which said chassis were fully interchangeable between Chevy and Ford. Also now Cliff adds in the information Dodge had a little foray into CMP land. I do recall that there were prototype models before the series 11 cab so I have not forgotten about that bit on CMPs on MLU.

So to clarify, or confuse the issue further – what series CMP cabs were used the most by ANZAC forces in WWII and you could expect to find sitting in a paddock in Australia today? Cab 11 + Cab 12 + Cab 13 what comes next?

As a further challenge what percentages would you expect to find of these different series cabs in Australia; as in, which would be the rarer ones to find in an Australian paddock today? Forgetting of course the continued clandestine boarder raids that are going on!
Cab 11 = %
Cab 12 = %
Cab 13 = %
Up to Cab whatever series used by Anzacs and found in Australian paddocks

My final thought is none of us are getting any younger and there is such a store of information that blokes like Cliff and Keith and many more very knowledgeable contributors to MLU are carrying around in their heads. It also seems like the Dr Grigg (or spelling like that) was one of the rare types who wrote a book on CMPs. It would be great if there was a definiative ANZAC CMP and to a lessor extent MCP book written here in Australia. Also the youngest CMP which saw in the final days of the war would be 64 years so paddock stock is reaching its use by date very rapidly. Such a book would also be invaluable to people like me who stumbled into Military vechiles by sheer accident.

If I could help any one out whose interested in getting such a book together please let me know. After the end of the year as I want to get my PhD out of the road first.

It still all boils down to one thing... That Mike Kelly bloke has a lot to answer for! It all started with just a simple statement in an email that he sent me - "have a look at your truck and see if there are any army markings on your truck". Oh the loss of innocence by such a simple action. It also meant that I was unleashed on the MLU forum to annoy everyone.

Kind Regards
Lionel