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#1
30-10-10, 19:22
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Thanks Richard for that.
R 
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#2
31-10-10, 16:48
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Robin,
We know each other from the old Mil-Veh list and we have met before at Oshawa rally (remember your drive up Parliament Hill? :-) ...)...... The Ferret was originally designated "Fieldmouse Mk. 1" I have an original WD manual (bought from Peter S. at the OMVS show many, many years ago) which has this right on the front page. Inside is "Change 1" to this manual which states " Change Fieldmouse Mk. 1 to Ferret Mk.1" I'll dig this manual out of the boxes of manuals here and post the cover and change. Only very early "Ferrets" were actually "Fieldmouses". ...and most CDN "Ferrets" are early.... As to the side hatches. The early Ferrets had square hatches...later this was changed to the angled or sloped type. It is a spotting feature for early vehicles. Clive wrote: ".....Canada, Australia and the UK shared an order for 593 MkI Ferrets in 1951, under contract number 6/FV/4267....." I don't believe the contract was actually divided up between the countries. If the CDN Ferrets were part of this contract they would have been delivered in 1951 or at the latest 1952. If so..then the CDN Reg. numbers would have been 51-xxxxx or 52-xxxxx and not 54-xxxxx. As Robin has said.....the xxBAxx numbers on the CDN Ferrets would indicate that they were delivered to the British Army. As soon as I can get the CDN number from my vehicle I will contact Bovington to see if they have the BA/WD record for it and maybe it will list if it was sent right to Canada or if it was in British service first. As to Robin's vehicle with the sloped hatches....what is the BA number for this vehicle? It may have been a BA Ferret used by the BA for training in Canada and later transferred to CDN ownership. Jim Gilmore Jim Thorpe, PA.
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#3
04-11-10, 03:24
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I have just gotten some info on a friend of mine's CDN Ferret Mk-1 and the data does not jive with what has been posted.
He gave me the following: Date plate information: 412.B.6.4 (412th Ferret made, June 1954) Hull number: 54-82606 War Department Number: 36BA86 (from Bovington Tank Museum records) ----------------- Now this is different from what was posted..... From Canadian Army records: Year Number HUIC Holding Unit ERN ERN Description 1954 82606* 0109* CFB CALGARY 30541* CAR ARM FERRET FV701MK1 1954 82606* 36BA80 LDSH --------------------- From British contract records 36BA86 Hull No 412 36BA80 Hull No 406 ---------------------------------------- Note that the Canadian records show the vehicle as 36BA80 with the Canadian number as 54-82606. There is no 36BA86 listed as a CDN Ferret. Can anyone sort out the differences here? Also, is the data plate number ..... 412.B.6.4 ......show the date of manufacture or date of delivery ? What does the B mean? According to contract data it was built in 1951. Interesting....... Jim Gilmore Jim Thorpe, PA.
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#4
04-11-10, 04:23
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Canadian/Australian Ferret list
The Canadian Ferret list looks very much like the Australian list.
The Ferrets delivered to Australia (mine and others on this side of the paddock) had British ARN/numbers under the Australian numbers. The contracts must have been mixed as there is an Australian Mk I as 36BA87 and the British numbers are not in any run of numbers.
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#5
04-11-10, 13:17
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I think, one day, we will all agree that there was a yard full of vehicles fully built and someone went down the rows counting off vehicles for Oz and Canada until they had the order filled.
There was no need to follow serial number order, it was superfluous. Just ship 'em out mate, next! Jim, yes I have a memory, and would like to keep it a memory not a legend. R
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#6
04-11-10, 13:19
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Oh and the other thing about the Canadian Ferret List, is I have never seen the original, will anyone scan it and upload it please? So many people quote it but wont show it around.
R 
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#7
13-11-10, 23:27
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Just to add fuel to the fire, I was today reliaby informed by an "informant" that there is documentation floating around that substantiates a rumour that Canada never actually paid for their Ferrets nor their Centurions.
I understand that they were part of war reparations. "How do you like them apples?" Robin
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#8
16-11-10, 04:56
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Quote:
I can't say for certain as i don't have a copy of the Canadian Ferret vehicle history sheets but the discrepancy may be as simple as a typo. The sheets were often completed by hand so information entered on them can be difficult to decipher, especially when someone has corrected information. 8 and 6 can appear similar when quickly written or when read off a stamping. Attached is a sample of the Canadian Army RCEME vehicle history sheet for Centurion Mk.V 53-81182. Notice that the "serial" number has been changed from 12 BA 86 or 88 to 12 BA 89L. It is of note that the Canadian Centurion listings contain a number of errors and corrections. The Canadian Army seem to have had a hard time deciding when to use 52, 53 or 54 prefixes to the CAR numbers (sometimes going back and forth a number of times for the same tank) and the "serial" is recorded using a mix of the British Army census number, the actual hull serial number or just completely omitted. Engine numbers are really hit and miss. At least a few Canadian Centurions were marked in Europe with both the British Census numbers and the CAR number. Don Dingwall's book on the Centurion (p.17) shows Mk.V 53-81365 wearing the CAR on the right rear of the hull and 47 BA 86 on the left. I know Colin visited Ottawa to pull Ferret files from LAC but a number of them are still closed and I don't know what they opened to him in the end. A quick search of the on-line catalouge shows "Manufacture, Procurement Production & Requirements - Tracked Vehicles - Tank Centurion" the file is dated 1953-1955 so it may contain some useful information. File no. (creator) S-7133-Tank Centurion Textual records 32: Restricted by law Box 3428 File Part 1 90: Open Former archival reference no. RG24-C-1-c Other accession no. 1983-84/048 GAD At least it is CLSN 90 so it may be easier to get at. Sorry I don't have more specifically on the Ferret but I hope this is of some use. J
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#9
16-11-10, 11:45
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So, To sum up so far, by reading between the lines, if you have a Ferrret, and have numbers stamped into it, or have original markings painted onto it that are visible then you know what you have, because if you rely on the hull number from the welded in plate inside some pencil pusher cocked up the records that everything else academic has been based on.
Well, at least thats the impression im getting at the moment. R
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#10
20-02-11, 22:20
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Just to add a bit of an update.
I was out today and confirm the Ferret with the turret on it in my pictures has a hull number of 337. B. 4. 4. with a confirmed CFR stamped in of 82569 R
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#11
13-12-18, 17:59
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The issue continues
So 7 years later I now own the ferret. Hull stamps 5482606. Last 3 on the front glacis plate upper right hand. 54-82 on the top plate lhs.
Interior Plate is 412-B.6.4 KAM ES S also stamped on hull. KAM Last edited by Kevin MacDonald; 13-12-18 at 18:09.
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