ontario mounting rules

[Seatyger]

Considering where your located I would heed the advise provided by Rob. During an appropriate Function, ceremony or parade etc., or even a Car Show as a static display you would be hard pressed to arouse any kind of 'Interest' of an official nature.

There are however numerous locals pushing the envelope with respect to what is and what isnt a legal obligation/responsibility. Be it Free Men of the Land who dont believe in Drivers Licences, Vehicle plates Blah blah blah who incidently are quite active in SW Ontario.

Perception is everything, and there are enough fruitcakes who would be more than happy to describe to an officer how the 'Army type vehicle with the machinegun {INSERT REASON} cut me off, was driving in a threatening and aggressive manner towards me, was..... laughing and drinking coffee while making eye contact etc.

Basically that is enough to become an item of interest and begin the BS process of having to explain yourself and what your all about. If your articulate enough in your explanation you'll likely be fine.

However, if your not an accomplished and confident speaker you run the risk of having the non-gun seized in the interest of 'Public Safety' and having to explain why you felt the need to attend the Sobey's parking lot with a life like machinegun mounted and in full view to the shoppers present. (Example mine)

After a couple hours in Court and around 5,000. in legal fees you may get the item back but you would certainly be criticized for poor judgement by the 'System' and probably Bad Taste by your peers.

Having said that; Are the gun laws and current firearms regulations ineffective, intrusive and basically stupid? Absolutely. But bringing that kind of attention to yourself as an individual could be a disasterous experience.

If you were to 'Convoy' up for a road trip with a couple to half dozen or more vehicles and enthusiasts and stay to more rural areas I would think you would be fine. If you were stopped it would likely be by someone like myself who is genuinely curious and interested in your equipment and its history.

Sorry for the long winded response, but I have dealt with many people who have acted without thinking it through so to speak. No malicious intent, nor devious behaviour they simply never anticipated the reactions of others.

You will likely get a few who will tell you 'Screw them, they can't do that because........' and in the end, after a couple of expensive years it may very well be. But you are the one who will have to endure the stress and financial hardship to prove 'Them' right.

Oh and PS: Just because it may no longer be technically considered a Firearm does not mean that it cannot be preceived as a Weapon. Something else to keep in the back of your mind. (Its like falling into a legal Black Hole) If your going to drive through the City I would suggest-

Stay away from, Military Bases, facilities, and Property, all Federal and Provincial Government facilities, School and Educational buildings of all types and/or configurations, Hospitals, City Hall, Police Buildings, Tim Hortons Drive Thru Lanes, Power Generating facilities.................... Now I'm just being a smart a$$ but you get the picture

[Hans Mulder]

As previously mentioned, once deactivated, not a firearms. Display all you like...in my experience, you are more likely to be pulled over because the officer wants to know what exactly the green thing is that you are driving, than because they have any concerns. I wouldn't worry in the least.

[servicepub (RIP)]

Originally Posted by Hans Mulder

As previously mentioned, once deactivated, not a firearms. Display all you like...in my experience, you are more likely to be pulled over because the officer wants to know what exactly the green thing is that you are driving, than because they have any concerns. I wouldn't worry in the least.

Wrong answer. Advice provided earlier is the best course. You may be right, you may be within the law, it may even be a 'no brainer' to you because you know the intricacies of the law, but to the avergae bystander it is a 'machine gun' and you aren't allowed to own it.
Most police officers don't know the detail of the gun laws and will seize it first and find out later -and their bosses will support the decision as will the Crown prosecutor and the judge (as he grudgingly agrees that you can have the dewat back). Meanwhile, it costs you time and money because you wanted to show everyone that you were 'right'.
If you can, transport the 'toys' as cargo and install once you are in place.
Oh, and to add to Seatyger's list of destinations NOT to go to with your MG openly displayed is Parliament Hill - 'nuff said.

[Bruce Parker (RIP)]

Originally Posted by servicepub

Wrong answer. Advice provided earlier is the best course. You may be right, you may be within the law, it may even be a 'no brainer' to you because you know the intricacies of the law, but to the avergae bystander it is a 'machine gun' and you aren't allowed to own it.
Most police officers don't know the detail of the gun laws and will seize it first and find out later -and their bosses will support the decision as will the Crown prosecutor and the judge (as he grudgingly agrees that you can have the dewat back). Meanwhile, it costs you time and money because you wanted to show everyone that you were 'right'.
If you can, transport the 'toys' as cargo and install once you are in place.
Oh, and to add to Seatyger's list of destinations NOT to go to with your MG openly displayed is Parliament Hill - 'nuff said.

I agree 100%. What your 'rights' are and what you should do to avoid a whack of trouble for yourself, the rest of us and the hobby in general are two different things. The best policy is to keep the dewats under cover unless it's a sanctioned event. A silly incident brandishing a 'machine gun' on a jeep going to the shopping plaza could create such a fuss that it would impact us all in a very bad way. Hell, a camera tripod coming out of a car trunk recently closed down York University.

Dewats, in my opinion, are a privilege we should not abuse. Replicas are illegal in Canada and it wouldn't take much to get deactivated firearms banned as well if something silly happened.

[Hans Mulder]

I think the likelihood of something "silly" happening is pretty slim in the MV community. Further, the OP is referring specifically to "parade vehicles", not tooling down to the 7-11 for a slurpee. Also, tripods, the anti-theft club, etc have inspired the paranoid "sheeple" across the country to call the police and scream "gun"...remind you of anything...maybe of a boy calling "wolf"? Police need to start screening these "gun" calls better, as guns are here to stay.

[rob love]

There is a difference between the rural west, the urban west, and then Southern Ontario. Whereas I can carry my unrestricted guns to and from the house to the shop, or into my vehicles, or transport them visible to the range, I know guys in Southern Ontario who have to almost sneak their firearms into their vehicles as if it were something as untoward as child porn. Vancouver is becoming almost as bad.....I think it was a year or so ago that the police there did a high risk take down of some guys heading to the range because a neighbor saw them loading their guns into the jeep.

The guy putting his club on his vehicle in Winnipeg, then having the swat team at his door arresting everyone a couple days ago show just how far this hysteria has gone. This was not in the crime infested part of Winnipeg either, but in a nice middle class neighborhood.

Even if you are right, you will lose something to prove it, be it your time, your reputation, or your toys. The newspapers will plaster your name and address, along with what you are presumed to be charged with on the front page of the paper, while the NWEST will lie through their teeth at the press information session. Your welded dewats will be described as appearing functional, and your obviously hollow inert ordnance will blow up when combined with some C4 at the ordnance dump. Your lawyer will warn you not to talk to the press. A year later when you are exonerated, the press will not say a word about it as they will deem that not newsworthy.

Anyone here know how those guys fared in the end when they drove the ferret with the dewat GPMG mounted on top up the driveway to parliament hill?

[Seatyger]

Hey Guys- I can understand the resentment and anger this subject brings up. I too feel that way and I am a police officer. I certainly won't apologise for what I do for a living. I own more than 'many' firearms. I have also sold off my C1A1, MP5 amongst others back in the day because I absolutely refuse to pin magazines on a functioning firearm.

So, do I protest and keep them regardless? Sadly no. Being active in the shooting and outdoors community, word eventually gets around as to what you have etc. And frankly I would have more to risk from some 'comrades in arms' who have not grown up with firearms, have never served with our armed forces and who can barely tell what end the bullet comes out.

So using myself as an example, can I articulate myself in Court as to what I have and Why? Very much so. But even if I survived the overzealous, uninformed Prosecutor etc., I would then have to navigate the parallel Police Act investigation which I would not win. Not in this climate of Liberally indoctrinated Senior Management. So a very beautiful, very accurate (as Battle Rifles go) 8L Series FN C1A1 with many C1 & C2 magazines serves on active duty with a Sheriffs Department in the State of Georgia, along with the H&K.

With respect to the MV Circle etc., dont fool yourself. A gentleman is still waiting to receive back his Bren, No.4 MkI and related from Ottawa, because the Provincial Weapons Unit wanted to be convinced that the firearms in question were in fact 'Deactivated'

They dont, nor does the Courts in this area really care about what an approved Gunsmith had to say, even when they did the work! I have every confidence that he will get them back. But they've been gone for 18 months already.

What brought attention to himself? He ordered a mail order replacement barrel from the U.S.

The sad fact of life in Canada is that the Collecting and Sporting communities are far too dysfunctional to rally a truely effective counter attack on the Anti's.

We could argue and yell on this forever. I just want everyone to use common sense and frankly not be stupid when 'flying their colours' so to speak. This Community is awesome in that regard, mostly I think because they have a committed passion for what they are doing.

I find its the younger, XBOX syndrome just an bought an AK Copy airsoft gun who cause 98 percent of the grief.

I have to stop because I will keep typing all night. I am not being an alarmist, I don't want anyone to have to suffer a similar nightmare.

If anyone has any direct questions on any topic relating to this subject PM me. I can only deal with the CFO here in Ontario but I will do my best to get a direct answer for you.

Just dont shoot the messenger if your not satisfied with the answer!

[Bruce Parker (RIP)]

Originally Posted by rob love

Anyone here know how those guys fared in the end when they drove the ferret with the dewat GPMG mounted on top up the driveway to parliament hill?

I don't know, but after the event quite a few of us with armour were just waiting for some politician to go on a crusade demanding private ownership of 'tanks' be banned.