New to the Shilo Museum:WW1 Cadillac Ambulance

[rob love]

Work is now underway on the Cadillac troop carrier. I am trying not to use the term ambulance as I found nothing on it to indicate that use.

Got the fourth tire together and installed the other day, so it can now roll on the floor. I moved it to a more active area of the shop so I could start working on the cargo box and tarpaulin.

The vehicle is to be part of a WW1 display starting on 1 July, so there is no more time for procrastinating. The hope is that we can preserve the original wood, but it has had significant shrinkage (as George Castanza would say) and is now a full half inch less in width than needed to match up with the holes in the metal brackets behind. I removed the 3 bows and today managed to get the right side off the cargo box. We have put a call in to the CCI about the proper methods of preserving the wood. With the amount of material missing, there is going to end up being a choice between moving the holes in the wood to match the metal, or putting new holes in the metal. Personally, I don't like either choice, but lean towards moving the holes in the wood.

The other alternatives are to try and add 1/2" onto the boards width, or else get new boards made.

The good news is that I was able to remove all the nuts and bolts with no breakage. I did order a bunch of hardware from a place in the us called Blacksmith's bolt and rivet supply who have most of these fasteners available, including the square nuts in about 4 different styles. If I do run into stubborn nuts I can merely split them.

Here are some photos of the present state.

[derk derin]

It's amazing what a new set of tires does to improve the look of a vehicle!
The paint on the side stowage lockers looks yellow? Is that the color they are?
Great looking project but dissapointed it's not an ambulance!!!
Regards,Derk

[rob love]

Originally Posted by derk derin

It's amazing what a new set of tires does to improve the look of a vehicle!
The paint on the side stowage lockers looks yellow? Is that the color they are?
Great looking project but dissapointed it's not an ambulance!!!
Regards,Derk

The truck was painted yellow overtop of the Khaki. The Khaki was overtop of the original Cadillac Black on those portions which were factory. On the woodwork it would appear to have been primed in grey, so it ended up being khaki over grey on the wood. The wheels and hubs were painted red overtop of the Khaki overtop of the Cadillac black.

My thoughts are to gorilla glue the wood back together, reinforce and repair any gouges with expoxy, sand it all smooth, paint the wood with POR-15 grey, then paint the wood outside surfaces with semigloss olive while the POR-15 is still tacky. Of course, my plans will depend on what the conservators say. I could be out to lunch...I am but a lowly mechanic so I'll see what the experts say.

Front fenders will be removed if I can and lightly blasted, painted with POR-15 black, then overpainted with the semigloss OD. The hood will be chemically stripped (it is aluminum), then possibly zinc chromate (substitute) followed by the khaki.

I have ordered all the "common sense " fasteners for the tarp from the DOT manufacturer. All those fittings were ordered in government black as per the originals. Only problem with the new stuff is they put the word "DOT" on top of the little turnbuttons. The oval head slot drive screws to hold the fasteners were ordered through Blacksmith supply.

[Bob Carriere]

Hi Rob

I have had hit and miss success with overpainting POR while it is still tacky....... I know they say you can do it and it may depend on how tacky is tacky...... in a few instances it resulted in the top coat of OD to have a crackle finish........ and only a sand blast will get you back to the original surface.

I would suggest you do a test scrap piece first and take notice of the temperature and humidity during your test......

It may also depends of the actual chemical composition of your top coat versus the content of the POR...... would just hate to see you mess up a fantastic vehicle.

Cheers

[rob love]

I know the crackle of which you speak. I have had it on areas where the POR-15 was a little thicker, and had not set far enough yet. As a result I often will wait almost too long on the setting of the POR-15.

I find, in general, 6 hours from application of the POR-15 until I spray the top coat on. I use Xylene as the thinner on my top coat when spraying, and I have successfully used it to thin the POR-15 as well the odd time when I spray it. So I suspect the xylene may be the binder when the top coat is applied over the POR-15.

I did the wood spokes with brushed on POR-15 and sprayed on the Gillespie top coat 6 hours later. Worked perfectly.

Again, I'll wait for the specialist's recommendation prior to going any further on the wood. More to follow in that regard. Tomorrow I'll take the left sideboards off, and I have to level off one of the support brackets. I'll add some more shots at that stage.

[rob love]

I am attaching some photos of the MT section in Camp Hughes, and their conversions. It would appear they liked to use model T cab and chassis. There are some vehicles in the background, including one ambulance that seems to have the hood of a Cadillac.

These photos came from Grant Tyler, who has been part of the Camp Hughes Conservation group for as long as I can remember.

[lynx42]

Originally Posted by rob love

I am attaching some photos of the MT section in Camp Hughes, and their conversions. It would appear they liked to use model T cab and chassis. There are some vehicles in the background, including one ambulance that seems to have the hood of a Cadillac.

These photos came from Grant Tyler, who has been part of the Camp Hughes Conservation group for as long as I can remember.

Hi Rob, not a Model 'T' to be seen in any of the 3 photos. I am not sure what the chassis are, but hazarding a guess, I would say that they are the Hudson 1/2 ton chassis based on the Hudson Super Six. That chassis was used for passenger cars, ambulances and as troop carriers carrying up to 8 troops.

Regards Rick.

[rob love]

Thanks for the information Rick. These older vehicles are way outside of my normal scope of interest, so I have a lot to learn.

[rob love]

As promised, here are some photos of the progress dis-assembling the box. I had to chisel two 1/4 square nuts to open them up a bit as the flat head bolts (I think they are called step bolts?) were turning in the wood, but in the end the step bolts themselves are fine.

Shrinkage on each side was about 1/2"so none of the holes are going to line up with the metal.

Now working on removing the backs. Some success but the nuts on the carriage botls underneath are a little snug. I have wire brushed them and oiled the threads....they will come.

Measuring the rear door and it is nowhere near square...considerably wider at the top. There is a shim on one side and not the other which may have contributed to that state. I also note they installed a wedge shaped spacer on the door jamb to make up for the extra width. So the question comes: do you rebuild with the flaw, or correct it. I think I know the answer....it doesn't sit well with me but it's not my job to change their 100 year old build.

Wood screws are generally a problem on this one. They were unplated, so some will turn, most won't, and some are the thickness of a finishing nail now. Photo below shows two that are in different states yet only 5" apart.

It is a tough call on whether to replace the wood or not. For instance the floor boards are simple 3/4" x 5" wide tongue and groove flooring pieces which I could buy off the shelf at the local home depot store. The ones in the truck now will likely not support the weight of a person on them, and some are missing. But to replace them will destroy the patina and the heritage. And if I replace the floor boards (I could distress them a bit I suppose) then what about the other boards? None of them will really support a screw as they stand.

I wish the whole truck could be as easy as the wheels were.

[rob love]

Originally Posted by lynx42

Hi Rob, not a Model 'T' to be seen in any of the 3 photos. I am not sure what the chassis are, but hazarding a guess, I would say that they are the Hudson 1/2 ton chassis based on the Hudson Super Six. That chassis was used for passenger cars, ambulances and as troop carriers carrying up to 8 troops.

Regards Rick.

Was just looking at 1916 Hudsons on google and the radiator does not seem the same. In the one photo you can see a partially assembled truck where it looks like the military is actually building the cowl. It will make it much harder to identify the vehicle if that's the case.

If there is an old car guy who wants to take a stab at IDing the vehicles, I can email a higher resolution photo that can be increased in size to help identify.

IDing those trucks is a bit of a red-herring in all this, but since camp Hughes is only a half hour from here it will still be good to know.

[rob love]

Just a short update: the truck has been stripped as far as it is going to be this time around. Niel Yeo has been popping in this week to help out......nice to have a young back around.

Some of the sheet metal has been painted already, same goes for the front axle assembly. The front half of the frame is being hand stripped of paint and grease, and will be given a coat of POR-15, then olive semi gloss applied to those areas that had the olive in the first place.

There is quite a frame patch on the right frame rail, and signs of previous cracking. Not the neatest of jobs, but it is part of the car's history so I will leave it as is.

Jack was telling me there is nothing for a rear main seal on these motors, and there should have been some shielding to direct the oil to the roadway. This car does not have it, and the wood shows it. Some of it is rotten from the oil soaking.

Wood is on order for the rear cargo box and it will be the original tongue and groove format. I am only replacing the outsides, and two planks over the wheels which support the outsides. The present wood will no longer support a screw with any amount of strength. I have ordered in all slot drive non-plated wood screws...there wasn't and won't be any Phillips or Robertson on this vehicle. However, for the actual Cadillac portion, I am going to cheat and install some furniture grade oak plywood for things like the firewall and the running boards. They get painted over or covered over with linoleum for the most part, and boards the original size (up to 18" width) just aren't available. I tried to buy some beautiful rosewood plywood, but when the guy heard I was going to paint 80% of it (under the hood would have remained stained) he refused to sell it to me.

All the original woods will be crated in prep for proper preservation and conservation measures to be taken over the next period. That is a little out of my field, so it will be a learning curve.

Some photos to see it as far as it is going this time around:

[maple_leaf_eh]

Why does the last photo make me hum the theme music from, "The Beverly Hillbillies"?

[rob love]

Originally Posted by maple_leaf_eh

Why does the last photo make me hum the theme music from, "The Beverly Hillbillies"?

Blasphemy!!!

Actually, I have hear that a lot. Once the wood is back on it, and the tarpaulin manufactured and in place, it is going to really look like something. The tarpaulin and canopy over the driver give the WW1 trucks a real personality.