Drag Ropes: How are they used??

[rob love]

There are some dimensions on this other drag rope thread, but mostly for the 6 pdr and the 25 pdr: http://www.mapleleafup.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=27265

Notable is the model number for one of the two available 25pr ropes as being no1mk1 model. This could indicate that the ropes were used on other pieces and may date back to earlier guns. The other rope model is no5mk1. The 6pr rope model is given as no2mk1.

[Mike Cecil]

Rob Beale,

Trewin's Early British QF Artillery page 386 states:

'Drag Ropes. There were two classes: heavy and light. Both classes had similar terminal fittings; at one end was a black painted iron hook, the other end was a leather lined eye-splice.These were of two classes, heavy and light. The heavy drag rope hook had a slot to take a tie attached to the shank. The drag rope was 3 inch white rope, thirty feet in length. It was issued to all siege guns and howitzers.

The light drag rope was a two inch white rope, fifteen feet in length. It was issued to BL 12 pdr and BL 15 pdr guns and BL 5 inch howitzers.'

The 1952 Australian 25pdr QF user handbook simply states 'Ropes, Drag, No.1 or No.5' in the tool/stores list, and on para 297 states 'these are 30 feet of white rope with two thimbles hook and chain'.

Regards

Mike

[Rob Beale]

25 pdr has the heavy drag ropes of 3" rope (=1" dia) x 30' long
6 pdr has the light drag ropes of 2" rope (5/8" dia) x 15' 6"long

Both ropes have steel thimbles in the spliced loops at both ends
with a drag link with a leather strap at one end for the drag washer on the axle,
and a ring with a pair of chains at other end for the wheel lugs on the pneumatic tyres.


18 pdr and 15 pdr and 12 pdr each have the light drag ropes 2" rope x 15 foot long.
These ropes have a leather lined loop at one end and a plain drag link at the other end. (Not sure if this end has a thimble or leather lining).


From other reading it seems early drag ropes often had wooden poles or rope nooses along the length to give the troops better purchase.
The longer ropes are thicker as they will carry a greater load with more people pulling on them.


Many thanks to Rob L, Rob N and Mike for your excellent prompt help.
I am not a gunner but an ex infanteer who is fascinated by the extent of the gear used to move the guns and to equip them. Serendipity rules!

Rob B

[tankbarrell]

Rob, where did the info regarding the length of the 6pdr ropes come from?

[Rob Beale]

Rob Love sent me this link:
http://www.mapleleafup.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=27265

Rob

[tankbarrell]

Ah but that doesn't say the 6 pdr ropes were the same as the light drag ropes in length, just rope size. The 6pdr handbook says the ropes are the 30' rope converted with an eye sliced on one end with chains for the rim hooks, so they cannot be the old 15' 6" rope, though they may be that length.

[Rob Beale]

The image below is the firepower museums 6 pdr. The drag ropes fitted look like early style light ropes with the leather lined eyes.

The stowage hooks for the rope look to have less than 2 yards circumference and there are probably about 6 or so loops of rope wound on.

Two ropes of 15 feet each are 2 x 5 yards = 10 yards

Can anyone measure the diameter of the hooks on the shield to compare with the diameter of the ropes please?

Alternatively can someone wind a 25 pdr rope on the hooks to see whether 30 foot of 1 inch dia rope will fit?

Rob

[Euan McDonald]

I have two NOS drag ropes, one I know is 25pdr and I suspect from MKC the second is for a 18pdr/15pdr.

[Rob Beale]

My apologies Adrian, for not reading the other thread thoroughly.

My thoughts are that the longer rope stowage hooks on a 6 pdr shield would suit the thicker rope, but not at the full length of 30' for two thick ropes. Has Marc's gun got the short or long hooks? One long rope = 2 short ropes

Rob Love's scans of the 6pdr gun manual does show the 2" rope and indeterminate length. What is the difference in weights for the two guns?

The longer a rope is, and the more soldiers pulling on it, the greater the load on the rope at the gun end. From a strength point of view, there doesn't seem any advantage in the heavier rope if it is shorter. Perhaps it is easier to grip by hand?
Like wise the lighter rope may not be strong enough for 30' of soldiers pulling as 2" rope has only 44% of the cross sectional area of a 3" rope.

The pics on the Armorama site show different lengths of rope although one look to be broken. So maybe there is an intermediate size between 15' and 30'?

Regarding the chains at the other end, although the rim of a 25 pdr has a greater diameter, the tyres have similar circumferences for 9" versus 8.25" dia. The drawings in Rob's scan show 8 links on each chain for the 6 pdr, but the Aussie rope in Euan's pic has 11 links.

It would be useful to try the different lengths and sizes of ropes on the hooks and post pics here for comparison.

My thoughts are not definitive but based on my reading of all above posts on the two threads and the other site.

Rob

[David Dunlop]

For what it is worth, the manual for the American 57mm M1 Gun (6-pdr clone), lists the drag rope as being 15 feet with a hook on one end and two rings on the other.

Interestingly, the wheel rims on the carriages lack any form of tabs for fitting drag ropes to. Only the center drag washer ring.

David

[tankbarrell]

Which could imply the ropes were identical to the British ones....... At least I can shorten mine if needed!