Info needed: 1967 M38A1 Lubrication?

[Les Kovacs]

Thanks Rob....I guess I will be buying more 2243's....the plugs were not fouled (all three 2243 & the single 2245 I took out) in fact they were all nice light tan on the insulator suggesting a clean burn....which leads me to my next question....then where is my oil going?.....I am loosing about 1/2 a quart of 15W40 in approx. 200-300kms. There is no visible oil in the coolant (which has remained new looking and bright green), the exhaust does not blow blue smoke on start-up (valve seals) nor smokes on the drive....I leak 1-2 drops per day from the area around the rear main seal and that's it. Where is the oil going?

Regards,

les

[rob love]

1/2 a quart in that time/mileage period is quite bad. You have covered the only 3 places it could go. Leakage standing still is not relevant, especially one to two drops per day.

Take a measuring cup and fill it with a half liter of water. Pour that on the ground and you'll see just how big a puddle you are talking about. Huge.

So either you are burning it, or leaking it. I would suggest leaking. Run the front wheels up on a pair of those little metal Cdn tire ramps like you might use for an oil change, and leave the vehicle running. Now you will see what the true oil leakage will be if it is from the rear main.

If it is not leaking then it is burning it. You have no idea how old those plugs are......they could have been changed a week before you bought the Jeep. Try a compression check. Cylinders should be at 120-125 each with the engine warm. Anything lower will indicate worn rings. What I normally found was that the cylinders would deeply score. These old engines have a very long stroke, and the scoring would go all the way from the top to the bottom, and deep.

In my experience, once compression was below 115, you were in trouble. At 110 consumption would get very high, and at 90 you will have trouble just to get the Jeep to start on a cold day.

Perhaps that is why you had a 2245 plug in the one cylinder?

[Les Kovacs]

Thanks for your patience....I am under the jeep several hours a day and I can tell you there is no engine oil leak anywhere (I have cardboard under the jeep 24/7) with the exception of 1-3 drops from the rear main seal.

Only the first plug was a 2245...the remainder were 2243's...and all had the same light colored tan insulator and electrode suggesting even burn/ignition in all cylinders.....your opinion?

Also, no visible blue smoke on start or while driving.

What about a blocked PCV valve?

Last question....brake fluid.....where to add and what type...dot 3?

Regards,

les

[rob love]

Here is something you can try. Before our next outing, find a 1/8 pipe plug and put it in the drain hole of the bellhousing. After your ride, remove the drain plug and see what comes out.

I don't think a blcked PCV is your issue. But it is possible the fording valves are wired wrong. I have seen (once) where the arm was 90° out and the valve had been wired closed instead of open.

[Les Kovacs]

Hi Rob....thanks for your previous reply....OK....where is the bell housing?...is it the flywheel cover/housing?.... the thing attached directly to the back of the engine?....if it is, there is a hole at the lowest point but its larger than 1/8 inch....its closer to 3/8 inch....and I have already plugged it up (yesterday)so no dirt/dust gets in. OK....so if I take a drive with the plug in and return home and take it out...what should I expect?

Also, I want to take out the PCV valve for cleaning.....do I have to take off the round thing with the bolt in it that screws into the side valve cover?....and all the plumbing that comes with it just to get access to the PCV valve?

Also, the fording valve that you are talking about...is it the valve beside the PCV valve/fuel pump...someone has disconnected the actuating wire/cable but the arm/lever is parallel with the PCV valve and its related plumbing but I can move the arm up to vertical....where should the lever be? and should it be disconnected...or reconnected?

I would really appreciate pics of the bell housing hole location and of the valve you are talking about if possible.....but I do not have access to viewing pics yet.....any chance that you could email it too me....I would understand if you prefer not too.

Sorry for all the questions...but I really do want to get a hold of this loss of oil issue as I cannot afford to rebuild the engine.....so if there is a cheaper solution......

Regards,

les

[rob love]

The flywheel/clutch cover is referred to as the bellhousing. If you look at it rom underneath it has the shape of a bell.

The hole may well be bigger..I'm under a lot of military vehicles and the memory is starting to fade.

The plug should only be in there when you are driving in water that is deeper than the bottom of the engine. If it is in there full time, and the proper gaskets are in place between the engine, the bellhousing, and the transmission, then it will collect any leaking oil. Then, when you depress the clutch, you will oil soak the disc facings and cause the disc to be oil soaked. This will cause the clutch to slip.

If you pull the plug, you will see if it is containing the leaking oil. Remove the plug and leave it in the glovebox like the decal on the dash says.

You can remove the PCV valve by taking off the steel lines on the other side of the fording valve, and then turning the pcv valve off while holding the fitting on the far end, towards the side valve cover. If you don't, then you could cause damage to the little cup like cover.

There are two fording vlalves: one at the PCV and one up top at the oil tube. They were commonly disconnected and then wired in the open position. The lever is normally in line with the tube in order to be open, hewever as I mentioned before it is possible they are assembled wrong and will then be wired closed, so you will want to make sure they are proper. I found that very problem about 30 years back on 67-08304 (a jinxed Jeep if there ever was one) which did not do the engine any fovours.

Funny I can remember that CFR after all these years, but can't remember my wife's birthday.

[Wayne Hingley]

Originally Posted by rob love

The hole may well be bigger..I'm under a lot of military vehicles and the memory is starting to fade.

Your memory is good Rob (except wife's birthday), the bell housing takes a 1/8" pipe plug.

[rob love]

Originally Posted by Les Kovacs

and I have already plugged it up (yesterday)so no dirt/dust gets in.

Trust me on this: the inside of the bellhousing is a mess of engine oil, transmission oil, a touch of grease, and all of the asbestos laden dust from the clutch which is now mixed with the previously mentioned oil and grease. A little dust and dirt will make no difference to the inside of that housing.

[Les Kovacs]

Wow...don't know what to say except thanks!

OK...so here is what I have done....I have driven the jeep for a total of about 400 kms since I have had it....the bell housing hole has not been plugged (I just plugged it yesterday when I saw it so dust-dirt will not get in-but I have since removed it) and oil has never come out of it. I will keep that hole unplugged from now on!

OK...now to the PCV valve....I took off the round cover from the side valve cover and rotated it out towards the fender....then I unscrewed the ventilator control valve from the PCV valve...and was able to actuate and see the open/closed when using the lever.....great now I know that "level" is open and 90 degrees or vertical its closed...great...however, try as I could with two 12 inch wrenches, I could not crack open the PCV valve or disconnect it from its left side elbow for cleaning....even after 2 hours soaked in liquid wrench....so, I was not able to clean the PCV valve...back to square one in figuring out the oil loss.

Thanks Rob....you are a wonderful resource that's making it easier to maintain this jeep.

les