Canadian Dodge, 3 ton 4x2

[lynx42]

I had a few minutes with nothing to do so I had a look at the ARN books, (AWM2016.38.206.pdf - you can Google it), which has most if not all the Australian delivered Dodge 3 ton trucks mentioned with their ARN's. This truck I have posted the photos of in posts 4 & 5, is ARN. 121064 in the book with the numbers from 114438 to 122646.

It is interesting as in that book there are more modern vehicles like the LARC 5's, motorcycles and some impressed vehicles from the Northern Territory and Papua/New Guinea. So the numbers are all over the place.

regards Rick.

[Kevin Goodwin]

Hi all, Lynn has mentioned that one of the data plates could relate to 'body type' can anyone shed any light on this? On other British vehicles there seems to have been a relatively 'standard' wooden body pattern produced by various manufacturers, having seen the few available pictures of the Dodge rear body some have an aperture at the front and some don't, did the Canadian built bodies have a 'standard' wooden body pattern, for example mine has hinged sides, is that a modification or original?
Kevin

[Lynn Eades]

Kevin, the four digit number is called the Model code.
As examples of 1/2 ton 4x4, the Model code for a WC-27 (this is called a sales symbol)
The 1/2 ton Ambulance is Model code 4139,
A WC-41 (Closed cab) Model code is 4162, while the two Reconnaissance models with and without winch (WC-23 and WC-24) are both Model code 4119.

For 3/4 ton WCs: WC-51 and 52 the model code is 4290 for the Bucket seat body (body work from behind the seats forward) while the pickup body (rear cargo bed is model code 4266. (that was complicated)
The plate with the 4290 is fixed to the front of the cowl just under the rear of the bonnet. (I don't think there was a plate attached to the 4266 on the body)
The WC-56 and WC-57 Command cars (reconnaissance) are code 4219
The Ambulance (WC-54) is code 4239
The Carryall is code 4249.
Any how...
The first two digits would be first year of production of that body type. (1/2 ton were 41 models and 3/4 ton 42 models)

A quick google search tells me that the other number is the body number, or if you like the number on your cab was that many from the start of production (yours was the 33,325 one built) of that Model code.

Sorry I dragged that out.
Lynn.

So, your model of truck was first built in 1942, the body code (for ordering parts) is 52, and it is the 33,325th. body of that type built (1942,1943 or 1944???)

[Kevin Goodwin]

Hi all,
Thanks to Lang for giving me the contract numbers for my truck I have found this picture of a truck from the same contract, this will now provide a template for the rear body on my truck, just the minor detail of sorting out some measurements!
Kevin

[Lang]

Instead of a rear body, what about this. One of the best looking WW2 outfits.

Lang

[Kevin Goodwin]

Very nice indeed, bit large for my drive though lol

[Mike Cecil]

Hi Lang,

I've had a chance to look at the data now, and think it shows pretty conclusively that the Dodge T110L (D60L) lorries were imported direct to Australia and not via the Middle East. There are several Contract Demand (CD) for the assembly of these vehicles awarded to Chrysler-Dodge Distributors (Aust) P/L, including E3339 for 154, E4050 for 13, and E4764 for 41. The Chrysler-Dodge Distributor network included such entities as Harden & Johnstone, Canada Cycle Co and Lanes Motors.

The most interesting is CD E4952, which also specified the body manufacturers who provided the rear bodywork: of 1,205 Dodge 3 ton, 160 in WB lorries under that contract demand, the bodywork was built (to AMF specs) as under:
87 by Peters.
125 by Star.
149 by Charles Hope
594 by Richards
and 250 by GMH, ie locally built rear bodies fitted to imported cab/chassis.

The remaining 495 of that demand were to be completed as semi-trailer prime movers, of the type shown in your latest posted image.

Dodge D60L's were also built in Aust as 23 seater buses, and a small number were lengthened and built as special buses for the Royal Navy in Australia and the Royal Australian Navy in 1945. A small number were also supplied to the US Army in Australia.

Cannot find any reference to their issue or use by the RAAF.

Mike

[Lang]

Thanks Mike

Interesting info.

Lang

[Ian McCallum]

Hi Keith, living in East Anglia you should have realised the body extensions relate to its post war life of hauling sugar beet, I believe called 'cheater boards'. This was a common modification to ex military vehicles to increase the capacity they could carry and goes along with the mod to install twin wheels/tipping gear. Have known of this vehicle for a number of years and glad its found an appropriate good home.

[Lang]

Some scans from parts manual.

[motto (RIP)]

Referred to in Australia by a previous generation as 'hungry boards'.
I haven't heard the term for years.

David

[Lang]

Dave

You still see hungry boards on light load trucks like mulch carriers and landscapers trucks to cart the light bulky branches etc away.

Those Dodges would probably carry 6 ton legal in their afterlife and most blokes would probably up that to 8 tons with duals fitted. Engine would pull the load but brakes might have been a worry! They were very popular with Cockies fitted with wheat bins carrying who knows what weight once bulk handling came in during the 50's. Even in the bag days they probably stopped loading when no more could be put on and the tyres looked like bursting.

Lang

[Richard Farrant]

Originally Posted by motto

Referred to in Australia by a previous generation as 'hungry boards'.
I haven't heard the term for years.

David

and 'greedy boards' in this part of the country !

Richard

[Lang]

Can't find Dodge photos with a quick search but this is an Army Chev which along with the Fords and Dodges formed the backbone of the farm fleets in the late 40's and 50's.

Photo split in two for some reason.

[Kevin Goodwin]

Thanks for posting the pictures Lang they will prove really useful.
Ian, I was aware that the truck had been used primarily for the Beet season and that the 'greedy boards' were not standard fitment together with the tipping gear, however I was not sure if the main body was the original that had been modified for its new role, as it turns out the original body has long since gone! I must have been very fortunate to acquire the truck if yourself/others were aware of its existence, are you able to throw any light on its history?
Kevin

[Lang]

Just looking at the Dodge photos in the parts manual. Similar to other British vehicles it only has one blackout light and no headlights. You can see the Australian Dodges from the same build had full headlights.

Even the bloke who decided to do this could not in his wildest dreams have believed an army vehicle would spend all or even most of its life in a situation requiring night concealment from the enemy.

I wonder how many vehicles were wrecked and how many people died because of this stupidity. I think the more common single full headlight (maybe a blackout light with cover removed) often seen in photos of CMP's was possibly more dangerous as on coming traffic did not know how wide - is it a truck, jeep or motorcycle - and on which side of the road you were.

The American system of both full and blackout lights was much more versatile and safer. Only a few wrecked vehicles because of lack of vision or collision would have paid for proper lights for the whole fleet and allowed trucks to travel much safer, faster and more efficiently in non-combat situations.

[motto (RIP)]

Originally Posted by Lang

Just looking at the Dodge photos in the parts manual. Similar to other British vehicles it only has one blackout light and no headlights. You can see the Australian Dodges from the same build had full headlights.
I think the more common single full headlight (maybe a blackout light with cover removed) often seen in photos of CMP's was possibly more dangerous as on coming traffic did not know how wide - is it a truck, jeep or motorcycle - and on which side of the road you were and safer..

Because of the single headlight-oncoming vehicle situation described I have wired my vehicles to have the parking lights stay on with headlights on in case I have a headlight go out.
I also now instal headlights that have an integral parking bulb so as to do away with the need for dedicated lights cluttering the front of the vehicle.
Many years ago I had a cousin ride his motorcycle into the front of an oncoming vehicle with a headlight out and miraculously live to tell the tale.
It may have been this event that alerted me to the possibility.

David

[Mike Cecil]

The reason the immediate post-war civilian fleet had so many ex-military MC types, including the Dodge D60L, plus small numbers of British military types such as WOT, and Bedford QLs, was that these were the vehicles that the military disposed of first and in the largest numbers, while retaining large numbers of the US Military Pattern and Canadian Military Pattern vehicles.

Jeeps were disposed of because of the very large numbers involved: the Army did not see a need to retain (store & maintain) some 12 or 13,000 of them for the post-war force. Same for motorcycles: once the Harley Davidson was decided upon as the immediate post-war motorcycle, all the thousands of BSA M20s, etc, were turned over to the Commonwealth Disposals Commission.

Mike

[motto (RIP)]

The MC trucks released from military service as a result of downsizing would have added to a large number already in civilian hands imported during the war for essential civilian service. The so called Lend/Lease vehicles.
Altogether these vehicles made the post war boom possible and their contribution is barely recognised. In my youth there were dead WW2 era Chevs laying all over the country. (The sunglasses I wore filtered out other types).

David

[Kevin Goodwin]

I came across these pictures in a magazine on classic commercials by chance at the weekend.
Kevin

[Kevin Goodwin]

Can anyone tell me how to reduce the size of the pictures to enable more than one picture to be posted? Not that I am hopeless with computers.... Honestly lol

[Lynn Eades]

Kevin, you can post a max of 5 pictures per post. If you picture is small enough it will post. making it smaller does not allow you to post more. You are missing something, I'm not sure what it is.

[Mike K]

Originally Posted by Mike Cecil

The reason the immediate post-war civilian fleet had so many ex-military MC types, including the Dodge D60L, plus small numbers of British military types such as WOT, and Bedford QLs, was that these were the vehicles that the military disposed of first and in the largest numbers, while retaining large numbers of the US Military Pattern and Canadian Military Pattern vehicles.


Mike

They were disposing of some British types before the war had finished . The Morris PU here was civilian registered in July 45, I have the rego papers .

An old timer at Whittlesea told me his dad bought a Morris CS8 from the local Morris dealership a few months before the war finished, he took it to the local cop to be registered but because it had no spare wheel ( run flat tyres ) the cop would not register it . So back to the dealers where a complete CS8 was broken up , just to get a spare wheel ! The old chap offered me the rear axle housing from the donor CS8 as it was still on the farm . He said his father traded in the Morris in 1952 for a new Land Rover , this was after two trips to Sydney in the Morris at 40mph towing a horse float !


Colin Anderson told me the Shepparton Morris dealers were selling CS8's just after the war. I'd like to find some newspaper adverts but so far none have been found . Colin said his neighbour had a CS8 with a extended chassis and he offered it to Colin, but Colin said to me " I thought it was too antique looking "

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Kevin Goodwin

Can anyone tell me how to reduce the size of the pictures to enable more than one picture to be posted? Not that I am hopeless with computers.... Honestly lol

Kevin, are you using an iPad or iPhone? If so, then only one photo at a time can be attached as the software of those devices rename the photo to be uploaded to "image.jpg" (or another generic name). So every next picture you try to upload has the same name and overwrites the one uploaded earlier on.

Lots of words to say that Apple devices only allow you to upload one photo at a time

As Lynn pointed out, normally 5 photos can be attached to a single posting.

HTH,
Hanno

[Kevin Goodwin]

Hi Hanno, yes I am using IPhone & IPad, I will try using the main computer next time.
Kevin

[Kevin Goodwin]

Hi all, a bit of progress with the truck today as in we have removed the old girl from the barn and deposited her in another barn! The restoration can now begin, I will be posting images of progress on here hopefully of some interest to you and hopefully to find out missing information from those in the know as it were.
Hanno do you want to move this onto the restoration section?
Kevin

[Kevin Goodwin]

Howard Wade of Rusty Bits is carrying out the restoration of the cab and running gear, and as can be seen good progress has been made, the chassis is now stripped and mounted in the frame ready for sand blasting and painting.
One concern we have is the possible low speed of the truck for today's traffic, the truck is fitted with the 2 speed rear axle, has anyone driven one of these trucks with this axle? As a potential option does anyone know if another Dodge model could provide an alternative rear axle with a higher ratio? whilst I do not expect to be travelling at 60mph, to be safe I would like to be able to achieve 40-45mph without making the truck suffer, I believe there is also a 5 speed gearbox fitted to some of these models, does anyone know if the top gear in the 5 speed is higher ratio than the top gear of a 4 speed box? I do not want to fit larger tyres than the 10.50x16 currently fitted as I would like the truck to look aesthetically correct. Any info or pointers would gratefully received!
Kevin

[Kevin Goodwin]

I recently came across this picture on the Internet, it shows a different style of circular roof cupola, does anyone know if this is a correct fitment or should the 'circular type' have the step design as seen in other pictures.
Kevin

[Kevin Goodwin]

A bit of an update on the truck, the engine has been pulled apart, it's a bit of a sorry state and will require a full rebuild including a crank regrind, it seems that basic maintenance was somewhat lacking when the truck was used!
The engine in this model of Dodge is longer than the one used in the WC Dodge and spare parts may prove difficult to find, does anyone have experience of sourcing parts for this engine? Or can anyone point me in the direction of someone or a company that is a specialist regarding these engines?
Kevin

[Lang]

Kevin

If it is a long block motor you should be able to find a Dodge KEW engine in UK to just drop straight in.

What is the engine number? If you give us that we will be able to tell you what you have.

Lang