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  #91  
Old 20-10-19, 18:01
Matthew P Matthew P is offline
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This mobile canteen looks to be British and most likely . The building behind it still stands today in Brussels. It was a canteen/club/leave centre late in WW2. I zoomed and cropped on the markings on the truck because it is so unusual to see that on these vehicles. Can anyone help me to identify those?

Thanks
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  #92  
Old 20-10-19, 18:22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew P View Post
Well here's the next photo puzzle. Not only what did this truck begin as, but the modifications to the coach work can be studied for quite a while and entertain the likes of us for some time. Either that or I'm just easily amused. No caption with this one.

Matt
I would say this is a Morris Commercial CV, going my window shape and molding line on the cab door, also the wheels.

regards, Richard
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  #93  
Old 20-10-19, 18:51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew P View Post
This mobile canteen looks to be British and most likely . The building behind it still stands today in Brussels. It was a canteen/club/leave centre late in WW2. I zoomed and cropped on the markings on the truck because it is so unusual to see that on these vehicles. Can anyone help me to identify those?

Thanks
Matt
A British built Fordson 7V
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  #94  
Old 24-10-19, 04:07
Matthew P Matthew P is offline
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Richard,

Thanks. Even I can at this point figure out a Fordson 7V. Or at least I think I can... Always good to get confirmation. I should have been more clear. I was interested in what appear to be unit markings on the cowl.

Edit: I asked this question on Facebook and apparently it's many units. It seems this canteen was "zapped" to use one gentleman's parlance with the various units it was associated with or supported, presumably from Normandy to Brussels.

Matt

Last edited by Matthew P; 24-10-19 at 17:29.
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  #95  
Old 24-10-19, 21:58
Alex van de Wetering Alex van de Wetering is offline
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Great pictures again, Matt.

Quote:
I asked this question on Facebook and apparently it's many units.
It does indeed seem to show several small markings....what looks to me like the bull from the 79th Armoured division, but also the Polar bear from the 49th Infantry division.
The poor Fordson did get a nose job sadly....
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  #96  
Old 28-10-19, 04:49
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Here's another photo. The canteen in question is a left hand drive Vanette, probably built on a Ford Chassis exported to Britain from the United States, a gift of the British War Relief Society, USA. Couple of military trucks to the left, one appears to be an ambulance? Looks like a cross painted on the canvas. Interesting hood cover blankets. Also two of the soldiers have M-1938 US leggings. Looks to be US uniforms?

Matt
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  #97  
Old 28-10-19, 11:22
Ed Storey Ed Storey is offline
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Default Allied Vehicles

This is an interesting photograph, thanks for posting. The vehicles to the left are British Bedfords and most of the troops in the photograph are also British although there are two Americans in the foreground.
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  #98  
Old 21-11-19, 12:53
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So I recently visited The Salvation Army archives in London again. This time one of my focuses was on a couple of "unpublished manuscripts". One was a sort of memoir type paper about 20 pages long written by a Salvation Army Officer who was in Arras at the War Graves Hostel at the outbreak of war and gives some details of the time from September 39 through evacuating at Saint Malo.

But the other manuscript was about 8 pages and written by nephew of a Red Shield Worker who was in Italy. Alan Clawley has since passed away himself. But his research into his Aunt Elsie brings us these three photographs of a Dodge in service with the British Forces in Italy.

Matt
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  #99  
Old 26-11-19, 00:45
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Default Welfare Vehicles, Canadian style

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  #100  
Old 26-11-19, 19:47
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Welcome back, Steve!

Hanno
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  #101  
Old 27-11-19, 04:28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew P View Post
This mobile canteen looks to be British and most likely . The building behind it still stands today in Brussels. It was a canteen/club/leave centre late in WW2. I zoomed and cropped on the markings on the truck because it is so unusual to see that on these vehicles. Can anyone help me to identify those?

Thanks
Matt
Looks like a number of British Divisional markings, including Airborne, 49th Infantry and 79th Armoured. Could represent the units the vehicle visited
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  #102  
Old 27-11-19, 09:20
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The picture with Austin inst war time, but from ree event ;-)
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  #103  
Old 27-11-19, 13:10
Matthew P Matthew P is offline
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Steve,

I wonder where/when that Canadian Red Cross vehicle served and in what role? During WW2 the four agencies providing welfare to the troops were Salvation Army, YMCA, Knights of Columbus and Canadian Legion.

Thanks for the vote of those were units that Canteen served. That seems the likely consensus so far.

Matt
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  #104  
Old 27-11-19, 13:13
Matthew P Matthew P is offline
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That Canadian Legion canteen photo was most likely in England. The first many canteens by the services I listed above in England were local trucks, the very first were donated from a tea company. It was several months before Canadian trucks caught up with their Welfare services in Great Britain.

Matt
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  #105  
Old 27-11-19, 23:44
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Default Food Flying Squad

Any interest in the Queen’s Messengers food convoy trucks?

This one was pictured in Rotterdam, early May 1945. Courtesy of Alex.

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  #106  
Old 28-11-19, 13:15
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Hanno,

That's a Bedford OXC correct? Somewhere I have reference to these canteen body Bedfords and it's my understanding the UK War Office was trying to standardize the chassis used because so many different ones were being donated it was hard to maintain them in good running shape. Here's a few more from the very late war, post war period. The first picture is captioned as being in Lengerick Germany and in the same series one of the gentleman at the canteen is a German officer POW stripped of rank and title conversing with a British Sergeant. The second of the cargo box is captioned as Brussels headed to Germany and the last is missing it's captions. No dates were given, but the circumstances and locations can give us a pretty good idea of when these photos were taken. There's also a series of pictures I've found from an air field in England with POWs being re-patriated. A Bedford chassis canteen and trailer feature prominently. I'll try to post them up later.

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  #107  
Old 28-11-19, 18:53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew P View Post

That's a Bedford OXC correct?
Matt
Matt,
All three photos show Bedford OYC 3 tonners.
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  #108  
Old 28-11-19, 22:54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew P View Post
That's a Bedford OXC correct? Somewhere I have reference to these canteen body Bedfords and it's my understanding the UK War Office was trying to standardize the chassis used because so many different ones were being donated it was hard to maintain them in good running shape.
Matt, indeed OYC's, as Richard already noted.

Here's another example of the myriad of vehicle types the British government had a hard time supporting the myriad of vehicles bought and donated by civilian organizations. This Commer Q2 is one of only two identified in pictures so far. Both were donated by Jamaican organisations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanno Spoelstra View Post
Richard Allebone sent me a screenshot, a quick search yielded the original of another Commer Q2 flying food truck. This is another vehicle, note “Jamaica’s Women War Material and Comforts Committee” on the side. It was supplied by UNNRA so this is a postwar picture.

Read more about how Caribbean women supported Britain’s war effort in a variety of ways at http://westindiacommittee.org/caribb.../women-in-war/

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  #109  
Old 29-11-19, 09:00
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Default NAAFI Tokens

I understand that the troops wanted a cuppa they gave their money to the NAAFI cashier and received a token which they then passed to the tea lady.

Recently our Museum received some NAAFI Tokens which are abut the size of an English/Australian shilling or 1/2pence.

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I am not sure what is printed on the round token. It looks to me to be for the value of 1/2pence for the "British, British, Armed, Armed, Forces Forces.1/2d.1/2d.1/2d."

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Regards Rick.
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  #110  
Old 29-11-19, 10:16
dcrfan dcrfan is offline
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Default YMCA to RNZAF in Pacific

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  #111  
Old 29-11-19, 11:41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanno Spoelstra View Post
Matt, indeed OYC's, as Richard already noted.

Here's another example of the myriad of vehicle types the British government had a hard time supporting the myriad of vehicles bought and donated by civilian organizations. This Commer Q2 is one of only two identified in pictures so far. Both were donated by Jamaican organisations.
Hanno it wasn't supplied by the UNRRA it would have been gifted to the UNRRA post war to provide relief in Europe manned by British volunteers. See this article on http://hmvf.co.uk/topic/14010-guy-vi...comment-261757

Ted

Last edited by ted angus; 29-11-19 at 11:50.
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  #112  
Old 29-11-19, 12:03
Matthew P Matthew P is offline
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Richard and Hanno thanks for the correction. I'm not at all well versed in Commonwealth vehicles, but that's where my interests lay so I'm learning.

lynx42 here's a website with a bunch more of those tokens: https://sites.google.com/site/malstokens/naafi

dcrfan, that's an interesting photo. Although I've read about it in several locations I haven't seen many photos of standard issue cargo trucks being used as canteens by the welfare services. The other I can think of is also YMCA in fact.

Matt
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  #113  
Old 29-11-19, 14:03
Patrice DEBUCQUOY Patrice DEBUCQUOY is offline
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Hello,

Could this Ford 7V in Holland 1945 be considered as a welfare vehicle ?

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  #114  
Old 29-11-19, 14:22
Brian Gough Brian Gough is offline
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dcrfan, re post #110, thanks for that picture. It's nice to see a rare C8AX in service.

Brian
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  #115  
Old 29-11-19, 14:26
Matthew P Matthew P is offline
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Patrice,

You bring up a good topic. At least in the United States many who study World War II history end their study of Europe when the Allies entered Berlin. The millions of refugees, displaced persons and the programs to repatriate, relocate, feed, clothe and house the victims of the war are not even thought of by many. But of course welfare agencies already in theater with the Forces then turned to civilian relief. The Salvation Army had their Overseas Relief program, it is well documented in their archives and I'd like to study it in the future.

There is the aforementioned UNRRA. The Wikipedia page for it being all of nine paragraphs long. Contrast that with the Wikipedia entry for the Normandy Landings that has around 60 paragraphs! We come along and take an interest because of the vehicles. But then I see just the staggering size of the tasks these post-war relief agencies faced. From the Wiki on UNRRA "By 1947, UNRRA was running nearly 800 resettlement camps, housing seven million people.[10] Forty-four nations contributed to funding, supplying, and staffing the agency...". Then there were all the non-governmental ones.

It is a topic I feel as big as the war itself and deserving it's own study. Lacking that, it is my opinion that all of these should stay in this thread. Many of the vehicles are the same types if not actually the same vehicles in some cases and the motives behind their operators and drivers are the same. The only difference being serving civilians impacted by the war instead of the forces.

Matt
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  #116  
Old 30-11-19, 09:50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ted angus View Post
Hanno it wasn't supplied by the UNRRA it would have been gifted to the UNRRA post war to provide relief in Europe manned by British volunteers. See this article on http://hmvf.co.uk/topic/14010-guy-vi...comment-261757
Hello Ted, you’re right, I should have written supplied to UNRRA instead of by.

From that fascinating thread on HMVF I learned that two Queen’s Messengers Convoys (22 vehicles) were gifted to the Netherlands, which led to the subsequent discovery of pictures of the being in use here.

The Hague, 25/05/1945

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  #117  
Old 30-11-19, 10:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew P View Post
You bring up a good topic. At least in the United States many who study World War II history end their study of Europe when the Allies entered Berlin. The millions of refugees, displaced persons and the programs to repatriate, relocate, feed, clothe and house the victims of the war are not even thought of by many. But of course welfare agencies already in theater with the Forces then turned to civilian relief. The Salvation Army had their Overseas Relief program, it is well documented in their archives and I'd like to study it in the future.

There is the aforementioned UNRRA. The Wikipedia page for it being all of nine paragraphs long. Contrast that with the Wikipedia entry for the Normandy Landings that has around 60 paragraphs! We come along and take an interest because of the vehicles. But then I see just the staggering size of the tasks these post-war relief agencies faced. From the Wiki on UNRRA "By 1947, UNRRA was running nearly 800 resettlement camps, housing seven million people.[10] Forty-four nations contributed to funding, supplying, and staffing the agency...". Then there were all the non-governmental ones.

It is a topic I feel as big as the war itself and deserving it's own study. Lacking that, it is my opinion that all of these should stay in this thread. Many of the vehicles are the same types if not actually the same vehicles in some cases and the motives behind their operators and drivers are the same. The only difference being serving civilians impacted by the war instead of the forces.
Matt, you're right. The fighting may have ended in May 1945, but the war certainly wasn't over.

Here is a link to a page with interesting info about Mobile Canteens: Kent at War - Life During Wartime
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A Bedford OX 30 Food Flying Squad mobile canteen. This vehicle was provided by donations from the people of Kent County, Michigan, USA, which is inscribed on the side of the vehicle. Two of the convoy’s motorcycles and riders are also shown. (WanPs-0337)

Also make sure to read the thread Ted Angus mentions over at HMVF: Guy vix-ants - queens messengers

HTH,
Hanno
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  #118  
Old 30-11-19, 12:02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanno Spoelstra View Post
Also make sure to read the thread Ted Angus mentions over at HMVF: Guy vix-ants - queens messengers
There were some excellent files on HMVF but I lost my copies in a PC crash; However one of the members has very kindly given me some info on the Commer : There were 15 of them in the CUN reg block they came into service in 1942 a year after the OXDs. The bulk of the Queens messenger vehicles went to Europe as soon as areas were liberated, the bulk being to the Nederlands , Belgium and France. The vehicle in the UNRRA lineup is CUN351, it had served in the Dundee convoy and is on its way to Belgium in the photo. TED
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  #119  
Old 30-11-19, 12:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ted angus View Post
There were some excellent files on HMVF but I lost my copies in a PC crash; However one of the members has very kindly given me some info on the Commer : There were 15 of them in the CUN reg block they came into service in 1942 a year after the OXDs. The bulk of the Queens messenger vehicles went to Europe as soon as areas were liberated, the bulk being to the Nederlands , Belgium and France. TED
Ted, "Runflat" has just reposted some of these files on HMVF - excellent stuff!

Hanno
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  #120  
Old 30-11-19, 12:11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanno Spoelstra View Post
From that fascinating thread on HMVF I learned that two Queen’s Messengers Convoys (22 vehicles) were gifted to the Netherlands, which led to the subsequent discovery of pictures of the being in use here.
Here's a better picture taken at the hand-over on Saturday, December 16, 1944. Quote from The Times on that day: "FOR HOLLAND: The Queen with Princess Juliana standing by one of the mobile canteens she has given for service in Holland. Altogether she handed over two "Queen's Messenger" convoys, 22 vehicles, to the Princess for the use of the Dutch Government"

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