FLASH....4 More Canadians killed in Afganistan,..

[Alex Blair (RIP)]

Four Canadians killed by roadside bomb in Afghanistan





A Bison vehicle, one of the different vehicles Canadians use in Afghanistan. The soldiers killed were driving in a G-Wagon. (CPimages/Murray Brewster)
KANDAHAR, Afghanistan - Four Canadian soldiers have been killed today in a roadside bomb in southern Afghanistan.

Three of them died at the scene in Gumbad, about 70 kilometres north of Kandahar.

A fourth was transported to hospital from the scene but died a short time later.

The dead are Corporal Matthew Dinning who was stationed at Petawawa, Ontario, Bombadier Myles Mansell of Victoria and Lieutenant William stationed at Edmonton.

One of the names is being withheld at the request of the family.

The soldiers were travelling in a G-Wagon as part of a mixed convoy of vehicles when the blast happened, at about 7:30 a-m local time.

Brigidier-General David Fraser says they were engaging with locals in the region to "establish the legitimate authority of the Afghan government."


He says the enemy will attack, but the local residents are extremely happy to have coalition soldiers helping them.

Fraser says the Canadians will not be pushed away by the Taliban.

[Jon Skagfeld]

Alex...and others who might be observing this thread...

I'm most probably the most right wing hawk around here. I believe in Conservatism, defense of one's country, belief in the need for immigration reform etc, etc, etc.

I'm stretching my political belief in imagining that our troops in Afghanistan are there for any purported purpose.

Think now...Alexander the Great wasn't able to contain the Afghanis...

Attilla the Hun wasn't able to contain the Afghanis...

The British Empire (Gunga Din, Erroll Flynn and all that) weren't able to contain the Afghanis...

The Russians, for 10 years, weren't able to contain the Afghanis...

Would someone please explain to me why the **** our troops are in Afghanistan?

We've got now...what, 14 dead and 40 wounded, and the first Roto is less than half way through!

The primary mission of the Canadian Forces is the Defence of Canada (that's why we have a Department of National Defence).
With all the pointy end guys out of country assisting in Third World country civil wars, who in hell is left here to do the primary job of defending our country?

I'm more than a little bit miffed about our Federal Defence policy and especially when our newly elected (minority) leader rams a muzzle brake on our CDS.

Rant over, comments invited. Be nice.

What you said , we need to come face to face. Nuff said


BIG MIKE

[Garry Shipton (RIP)]

For the first time in our military history,this minority government(33 % of the total nation's vote) who think they've taken over OUR country, have taken it upon themselves,NOT to lower the national flag on the pinnacle of the Peace Tower in Ottawa to half mast.Now,does this tell us something about these people.Little Greoge W. Bush(Stevie Harper) makes a big publicity campaign by visiting the boys in Afghanistan,but doesn't have the BALLS to respect our fallen lads.It's enough to make you puke.

Rant over

May they rest in Peace

[Alex Blair (RIP)]

Originally posted by Jon Skagfeld
Alex...and others who might be observing this thread...


I'm stretching my political belief in imagining that our troops in Afghanistan are there for any purported purpose.

...

Would someone please explain to me why the **** our troops are in Afghanistan?

Jon....
As usual ,it is about oil and gas...in my humble opinion...
Uzbekistan,on the northern border of Afganistan is rotton with gas and oil....
In order to have access to gas and oil starved western democracies,a route for the pipeline is needed to get the gas to the sea,where it can be liquified and shipped by tanker to the customers...
Can,t run the pipeline through Russia,Iran,or China....they would steal it....
Gotta get it to Pakistan,a western friendly(?) nation to have access to the sea...
What is left to route the pipeline....?
Afganistan...
Here is a map...
http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgur...&ct=image&cd=2

I don't know if this link will work..But Google up a map of Afganistan..

Here is a part of the next link...
Don't shoot me...You asked why we were there....

Unocal foresees a pipeline which would become part of a regional system that will gather oil from existing pipeline infrastructure in Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan and Russia. The 1,040-mile long oil pipeline would extend south through Afghanistan to an export terminal that would be constructed on the Pakistan coast. This 42-inch diameter pipeline will have a shipping capacity of one million barrels of oil per day. The estimated cost of the project, which is similar in scope to the trans-Alaska pipeline, is about $2.5 billion.

This is from the 1998 Congressional report...long before 9 11

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/oil.html

[John McGillivray]

And I thought that our politicians were only trying to win brownie points with GWB.

[Bruce Parker (RIP)]

Originally posted by Garry Shipton
For the first time in our military history,this minority government(33 % of the total nation's vote) who think they've taken over OUR country, have taken it upon themselves,NOT to lower the national flag on the pinnacle of the Peace Tower in Ottawa to half mast.Now,does this tell us something about these people.Little Greoge W. Bush(Stevie Harper) makes a big publicity campaign by visiting the boys in Afghanistan,but doesn't have the BALLS to respect our fallen lads.It's enough to make you puke.

Rant over

May they rest in Peace

1. The decision to use Canadian troops in a combat role in Afganistan was made during the Liberal govenment, not the Conservative, so why the blame?
Would you have preferred the Conservatives pull out at a monments notice, leaving the rest of NATO to scramble and fill the void? Recall we had a vote in parliament, but those in opposition who screamed the loudest for it, couldn't make the time to attend.

2. The lowering of the flag may tell us something about people. Flag lowering was a recent Liberal practice...for the rest of our history, the tradition was not to do so. I would suggest that the Liberal lowering of the flag, while at the same time treating the Armed Forces with contempt, does indeed say something, but perhaps not what you think about who.

PS. "Taken over OUR country?" How do you define ownership, Liberal by divine right?

[Alex Blair (RIP)]

Originally posted by Bruce Parker
1. The decision to use Canadian troops in a combat role in Afganistan was made during the Liberal govenment, not the Conservative, so why the blame?
Would you have preferred the Conservatives pull out at a monments notice, leaving the rest of NATO to scramble and fill the void? Recall we had a vote in parliament, but those in opposition who screamed the loudest for it, couldn't make the time to attend.

2. The lowering of the flag may tell us something about people. Flag lowering was a recent Liberal practice...for the rest of our history, the tradition was not to do so. I would suggest that the Liberal lowering of the flag, while at the same time treating the Armed Forces with contempt, does indeed say something, but perhaps not what you think about who.

PS. "Taken over OUR country?" How do you define ownership, Liberal by divine right?

Well said Bruce and may I add that Canadian troops are not...NOT under NATO Command...but American command..tHis is not a NATO Operation that the Canadian troops are fullfilling..

GOOD SHOW BRUCE I like your Message
Hey all you GWB haters , BIG MIKE voted for GW Because I don't like Demarat's and Fairy Libby's, , UP yours BABY who BOO'D my national anthem 2 years ago up in canada, BIG MIKE WILL NEVER FERGET THAT.



BIG MIKE

[RHClarke]

Oil? Sucking up to GWB? Is it the fault of the new PM?

If you choose oil - we have more oil in Alberta than in most of the Arabian states...logically this does not make sense. If you think we are doing this for Uncle Sam's oil dependency, shake your head - Uncle Sam does not need our help,

Sucking up to GWB - maybe, but it is a lot better than calling our trusted neighbour "bastards" or "morons" - which essentially closed the borders to beef, and tariffed the hell out of softwood.

Steven Harper's fault - guess again. As Bruce mentioned, Jean Cretin and his inept successor put our boy over there. Now they are snivelling about it!

Liberals of all ilk have shown their true colours (which run, of course) in federal politics and even here on this forum.

A more reasonable answer to the question of why are they there may be: To keep the bastards from doing their evil deeds here. Remember Sept 11? Did you enjoy your sleep last night? Was it interrupted by a fire fight? Has your office been targetted lately? Any relatives killed off because of their religious views? ...Didn't think so. Thank those who are actually doing something about the situation and who believe in their mission.

Gutless liberals and other pablum puking social engineers would have us believe that Mr. Taliban should be left alone, and if we are nice and quiet, he will leave us alone - a fine tribute to those who died in NY on Sept 11, and to those fine Canadians in situ who actually serve to protect our country...Would these folk want to go back to Taliban rule where females are treated as third class ciitizens at best and where children were not permitted to behave like children? Is democracy to be shunned for dictatorship? Education shunned for fundementalism? Isn't this what got ball rolling in the first place?

Historians will point to the Afghan's ability to kick out invaders - it is hoped that the legitimate government of Afghanistan will be able to control its own internal affairs in the future - how long? Your guess is as good as mine, but I do hope the invaders (even though were were invited) can go home in the near future. Progress is being made, but at a horrible price - not only to Canadian personnnel, but Afghans in general.

My heart goes out to the families of the soldiers who were killed in the recent attack. I wish there was a better way, but when you deal with "scumbags and murders", you have to speak their language, roll up the sleeves and get down and dirty with them. You can't do that by bleating from the sidelines.

On the matter of muzzling the CDS - What facts do you have on this?

God bless Canada, and God bless our soldiers on operations.

(I look forward to any educated rebuttals, and of course to the traditional liberal whining...Shot, Over!)

[John McGillivray]

The real reason that Canadians are in Afghanistan is because it is the right thing to do. Canadian troops (JTF2) were there alongside of the Americans, from the very beginning. The Canadian involvement is summarized at the site below. In early 2002 Canada had the third largest western military force in the region, behind the US and the UK. Canada also has suffered the second highest number of casualties of the Coalition forces in Afghanistan, after the US.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/af...an/canada.html

As for the name calling, there was quite a lot of that going in both directions. George Bush gave a nice description of American – Canadian relations when he stated that we are not friends, but are family.

Note that the deployment of the Canadian led multi-national brigade in Kandahar has allowed the US to reduce their troop strength in Afghanistan by a brigade.

Originally posted by RHClarke
Sucking up to GWB - maybe, but it is a lot better than calling our trusted neighbour "bastards" or "morons" - which essentially closed the borders to beef, and tariffed the hell out of softwood.

Softwood lumber was one of the first things that GWB did after he took office, long before 9/11 and the name calling. It was a direct result of the tens of millions of dollars the US lumber industry spent greasing the palms of American politicians. The banning of Canadian beef imports led to a sharp increase in the price of beef in the US and a windfall in profits to US beef producers. The American beef industry has being lobbing to keep Canadian beef out of the US because they like their higher profits. Its all about money, and not name calling.

[RHClarke]

Originally posted by John McGillivray
Its (sic) all about money, and not name calling.

You are correct, sir! It is all about money. So, how much has the name calling cost us so far?

There has been progress on the beef and softwood files where in the past progress stalled. Which is the more effective method for a nation of our status to get it's point across? Insults or diplomacy?

[Gordon Yeo]

As facinating as the political disscusion is could I mention Corporal Matthew Dinning. Most soldiers are a name and a face from somewhere in a huge country. It's become more personal for us in our part of Ontario Corporal Dinnings family lives in Wingham about 40 kilometers from here and being small town and rural communities his loss it will sting. The other connection is Richard Fitussi a freelance journalist, who was riding in another vehicle in the same convoy, is also from a local town.
Okay now back to your petty bickering.