Unknown plane in the sky.

[Jordan Baker]

Ok I know it is not a CMP or Carrier or some other Cnd Army hardware but I figured since it flew over my CMP and Carrier about 12 times on Sunday it would qualify for the posting.

Anyone ever seen anything like it before. It was very fast compared to another plane that flew by and had a very unique sound to it. The engines look like Turbo props but it also a had jet engine sound as it flew by. I know you can't see them in the picture but it had what appeared to be about 6 windows down each side of the body. It also seemed to be about 30 to 40 feet long.

[Jordan Baker]

Here is the second picture that I managed to get of it. You can clearly see the 2 props with each one having 4 blades.

[Jon Skagfeld]

Jordan:

Here's my best input:

Yes, turbo-prop, but "pusher" type vs standard "puller" type.

Vanes on nose are known as "canards" which leads me to believe that they are used to offset the "abnormal" thrust of a reverse blasting prop.

PS: I've sent your pics to an aviation expert friend of mine. Stand by for , hopefully, a good reply.

[herr-pear]

More a wild guess than anything else but it looks a lot like a Beechcraft "Starship". Beech only made a handful of them and they're REAL expensive.

Roger Hull

[Rob Fast]

in southern Manitoba . I was wondering the same thing. Fast and unique. Cheers Rob

[Jordan Baker]

Mystery solved.

I Googled the Beechcraft Starship and came up with a very similar looking plane. However the Beechcraft does not have a rudder and this plane does.

So after adding the word "similar" to my search I came up with
Piaggio P-108 Avanti

It turns out it is some Italian Navy/ Army/ Airforce plane.

I wonder what it was doing in the Hamilton area then?

[Garry Shipton (RIP)]

There's one that flies out of the old St.Hubert airbase here on the south shore of Montreal.Distinct sound , hear and see it taking off all the time,but never figured out it's make.But you're right.It's a pusher and it is fast.

[Grant Bowker]

A Piaggio is also seen fairly often in Ottawa. A quick check of the Transport Canada database shows C-GFOX registered to the RCMP, likely the one seen in Ottawa. There are a total of 10 P-180s on the Canadian Civil Register. One is based in Brantford, owned by a numbered company in Wingham, possibly the one seen in Hamilton area, others in Quebec (province), Toronto, London, Alberta.
The TC register is at http://www.tc.gc.ca/aviation/activepages/ccarcs/en/ You may have to play with the link to make it work.

[sapper740]

Originally posted by Jordan Baker
Ok I know it is not a CMP or Carrier or some other Cnd Army hardware but I figured since it flew over my CMP and Carrier about 12 times on Sunday it would qualify for the posting.

Anyone ever seen anything like it before. It was very fast compared to another plane that flew by and had a very unique sound to it. The engines look like Turbo props but it also a had jet engine sound as it flew by. I know you can't see them in the picture but it had what appeared to be about 6 windows down each side of the body. It also seemed to be about 30 to 40 feet long.

it's definitely not a Beechcraft Starship. Raytheon decommisioned all the Starships save four which are in the hands of collectors like Burt Rutan.

[sapper740]

Originally posted by Jon Skagfeld
Jordan:



Vanes on nose are known as "canards" which leads me to believe that they are used to offset the "abnormal" thrust of a reverse blasting prop.

The canard wings have nothing to do with whether the aircraft is pulled or pushed through the air. (see Wright Flyer, Vari-eze, B1 bomber, Valkyrie et al) Its all about having sufficient control surfaces to fly the a/c. Aircraft need ailerons, elevators, and rudder(s) to fly as well as lift in the right places for straight and level flight. (We're not going to get into flying wings which make use of "flaperons") Using Canard wings reduces drag and makes the aircraft more efficient. Important note! Look closely and you'll see most Canard wings are relatively straight while the main wing is swept back. There is a very important reason for this. The Canard wing must stall first before the main spar or the bottom will drop out of your a/c. Witness the Curtiss "Ascender", an attempt late in the war to build a canard winged a/c. The test pilot's called it the "Ass-ender" as the main wing would stall before the Canard wing and the tail would fall creating an exceptionally high beta (angle of attack) and and the a/c would rapidly descend tail first. The name "Canard" came from an early Paris Airshow when one of the first a/c using a canard wing flew by. I don't remember if it was the Vari-eze or not. A Frenchman asked "Que est-ce c'est?" and some wag responded, "C'est un Canard!" (It's a Duck!)

CHIMO!

Originally posted by Rob Fast
in southern Manitoba . I was wondering the same thing. Fast and unique. Cheers Rob

HEY ... LOOK ... It's a bird ... it's a plane ... Noooo ... it's Ma Yappy's Manitoba and longdistance toss .... LOOK OUT BELOW

[Garry Shipton (RIP)]

Unidentified Frying Object with wings.

OOOOH ! Couldn't resist this one.

Guess I'm in for the you know what ??

UFO ... unidentified friggen object

(I'm gonna get it too ... uh, no I'm not, I'm the boss for a while FAR OUT GOD HOW I LOVE THIS POWER IN A MANS DOMAIN

[Garry Shipton (RIP)]

Are you know the Big Cheesr ?? The Major Domo >> The guy(OOPS) girl in charge?? Hmmm?
So ,what does it feel like to be the king(OOPS!) Queen of the hill??
Do us lowly peon members bow down to -Oh Elle Supremo??
Dammit,where's the Shadster when I need him?? OH Shad,up there,can you come down and visit the Eva Perron of MLU and sorta scare her?Just one growl ??
Boy I'm in for multiple

[Alex Blair (RIP)]

Originally posted by Vets Dottir
UFO ... unidentified friggen object

(I'm gonna get it too ... uh, no I'm not, I'm the boss for a while FAR OUT GOD HOW I LOVE THIS POWER IN A MANS DOMAIN

Carmen..
Where is the Great Mhumba..???

[Garry Shipton (RIP)]

In a bar at this time of day with the Great Hanno Spolsta.Go figure .

Originally posted by Alex Blair
Carmen..
Where is the Great Mhumba..???

The Great Mhumba is taking a much wanted and needed R&R and rarely has access to computers and online for perhaps another couple of weeks, but Hanno, the other Big Cheese, will be about again in a couple of days We all need a holiday, eh?

Until then, you guys and gals are all stuck with an insufferable power mad Ma Yappy with a to be used if and when as I see's fit ... and darnit all anyways, while in such power, where the heck is MARK-O when I need his presence in here most ??? ... I could really be having some fun ............

Karmen (I'll be nice ... I just remember the Master Sunray and Master Dutch Boy both have the power to delete me so I can't go too crazy! )

Originally posted by Garry Shipton
Are you know the Big Cheesr ??

Well, I have to payback for some of the bandwidth I've used up by now, so Geoff has put me to work while both he and Hanno are away (they aren't away together, separate holidays )

Now that this thread has been totally highjacked (sorry folks!) I'll bow out and let it get back on track

Karmen.

[Jon Skagfeld]

Originally posted by sapper740
The canard wings have nothing to do with whether the aircraft is pulled or pushed through the air. (see Wright Flyer, Vari-eze, B1 bomber, Valkyrie et al) Its all about having sufficient control surfaces to fly the a/c. Aircraft need ailerons, elevators, and rudder(s) to fly as well as lift in the right places for straight and level flight. (We're not going to get into flying wings which make use of "flaperons") Using Canard wings reduces drag and makes the aircraft more efficient. Important note! Look closely and you'll see most Canard wings are relatively straight while the main wing is swept back. There is a very important reason for this. The Canard wing must stall first before the main spar or the bottom will drop out of your a/c. Witness the Curtiss "Ascender", an attempt late in the war to build a canard winged a/c. The test pilot's called it the "Ass-ender" as the main wing would stall before the Canard wing and the tail would fall creating an exceptionally high beta (angle of attack) and and the a/c would rapidly descend tail first. The name "Canard" came from an early Paris Airshow when one of the first a/c using a canard wing flew by. I don't remember if it was the Vari-eze or not. A Frenchman asked "Que est-ce c'est?" and some wag responded, "C'est un Canard!" (It's a Duck!)

CHIMO!

OK. Sapper, I have been hoist by mine own canard!

[sapper740]

Originally posted by Jon Skagfeld
OK. Sapper, I have been hoist by mine own canard!

While hoisting a tankard, I hope!

[Alex Blair (RIP)]

Originally posted by sapper740
While hoisting a tankard, I hope!

Sapper...
Jon is in Area 51....
All kinds of strange stuff in the air there...

Originally posted by Alex Blair
All kinds of strange stuff in the air there...

.... in the drinks and food too I think????

[sapper740]

Originally posted by Alex Blair
Sapper...
Jon is in Area 51....
All kinds of strange stuff in the air there...

Jon didn't see strange aircraft while investigating crop circles, did he?

JON! DON"T DRINK THE KOOL-AID!