Picture ID challenge: T16's near Caen

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Here's a picture for Mark, Clive, or anyone else who fancies a challenge. This comes from the 1970 vintage Marshall Cavendish Encyclopedia of WWII and is credited to IWM, who cannot find it. It is captioned "British advance South of Caen", but more likely it shows Canadian T16's.
Who can come up with the real identity of the T16s in this picture? NAC number? Location, date or anything else?

Thanks,
Hanno

[Snowtractor]

Looks very similar to a picture captioned Canadians approach Falaise I remember seeing, now to find it...
Sean

[Mark W. Tonner]

Originally posted by Hanno Spoelstra
Who can come up with the real identity of the T16s in this picture? NAC number? Location, date or anything else?

Good One Hanno!

Do you think you can scan in the last two carriers in line (lower left and centre) and post a good clear picture of them?


Cheers

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Mark W. Tonner
Do you think you can scan in the last two carriers in line (lower left and centre) and post a good clear picture of them?

I can't, but luckily Terry Johns sent me a detail scan as well.
Does this give you any extra clues, Mark?
Sean, does it help to refresh the memory?

Thanks!
Hanno

[Mark W. Tonner]

Hi Hanno;

There is something familiar about the last carrier, they could very well be from the 10th Independent Machine Gun Company (The New Brunswick Rangers), Canadian 4th Armoured Division. I don't think they are from an infantry battalion's anti-tank platoon, no 6 pdrs. Could be an MMG Platoon moving up or a 4.2" Mortar Platoon changing base plate positions (moving up). Also, their in the rear, the route is marked, so their behind the forward troops. I'll get back to you on this one.

Cheers

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Mark W. Tonner
I'll get back to you on this one.

Mark, it all sounds very, very plausible - I was hoping you would swallow the bait

H.

[Mark W. Tonner]

Hi Hanno;

Looky What I Found:

(I'll get back to you with unit ID shortly)

Cheers

[Snowtractor]

I found the same picture and it says advancing south of Caen towards the Falaise area. I can read some of the numbers on the last carrier in my pic. The pic is referenced in regards to the Falaise gap battle/campaign in the text portion of the book.

And Mark , you sneaky guy, that is a fantastic pic from what looks to be the same vantage point. Really neat.

Sean

[Mark W. Tonner]

Originally posted by Snowtractor
I can read some of the numbers on the last carrier in my pic.

Hi Sean;

Which numbers are you referring to, the WD or the AoS, if it's the AoS number, post it please

Cheers

[Snowtractor]

Originally posted by Mark W. Tonner
Hi Sean;

Which numbers are you referring to, the WD or the AoS, if it's the AoS number, post it please

Cheers

AoS? I can read the WD T number .
Sean

Originally posted by Mark W. Tonner
Hi Hanno;

Looky What I Found:

Now, Mr Sherman McSpool, looking at Mark's picture isn't the last one a M4A4? Looks like large bogie gaps to me. . . . . . . .You know how useless my Sherman variant recognition is.

R.

[Mark W. Tonner]

Hi Guys;

1 - I'm certain that the T16s pictured are those of the 10th Independent Machine Gun Company (The New Brunswick Rangers), Canadian 4th Armoured Division

2 - The Sherman (gun tank) and the Sherman Crabs belong to "C" Squadron, 1st Lothian and Border Horse, the rear Sherman bears the name "CONSTABLE OF CHESTER", which was a 'named' Sherman Command tank of "C" Sqn, also, the Sherman Crab in front of it carries the '52' AoS of 1st Lothians (30th Armd Bde, 79th Armd Div).

3 - I believe these pictures were taken on the move up to the FUP of 10th Cdn Inf Bde, who had under command at that time, 'one' Sqn of the Lothians, for Phase 2 of Operation "TOTALIZE" (8-10 Aug 44), with the independent M.G. company going with the infantry brigade of the division, since the 4th Armd Bde had their own separate taskings for Phase 2.

Comments?

Cheers

now its time for a since my brain needs a rest

Have attached both pictures in question:

[Snowtractor]

The position of the camera and the shadows on the ground seem to make the pictures only minutes apart. I wonder if the originals would have had some order numbering on the backs fo the photos.
Sean

[Mark W. Tonner]

Originally posted by Snowtractor
The position of the camera and the shadows on the ground seem to make the pictures only minutes apart. I wonder if the originals would have had some order numbering on the backs fo the photos.
Sean

Hi Sean;

It would be nice if we knew who the pictures were credited to, ie: NAC/PA or IWM. They could very well be 'stills' taken from a film. The camera doesn't seem to have moved, it's covering the same angle, height, etc.., in both pictures.

Cheers

[Jon Skagfeld]

Ok boys... Geoff here on Skag's machine and ID... who can ID this loc and get us a "here-and-now" pic?

Be home tomorrow, play nice, time for a drink and a and lots more of our old army BS before bed...

Find us the then-and-now, somebody...

[m kenny]

Athis Bridge Filmed here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ul7h3BKuePQ


Also:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/47208/thread/1330990309