Front Axles for 10 bolt Front Hubs-1.5 ton Australian Chevrolet Trucks 1940-1945

[Philippe Jeanneau]

Looking for information, specifically the part number for the front axle (2 ton?) used with the 10 bolt front hubs, fitted to 1.5 ton Australian Chevrolet trucks between the years 1940-1945. My front axle beam is marked 365291 GM198.
Thank you.

[Shaun Mastin]

Hey mate ,
I’m restoring a 1940 chev and it’s got the same part number as you’ve listed

[Bob Carriere]

The front axle for a Chev 1940 series 15 2 ton is 365291.....and they have the Hyatt bicycle ball bearings..... not the Timken rollers.

Shaun....do you have a picture of your front axle / hub / brake drum arrangement???? and do you have a casting number of 1701380 on your brake drum???? thanks

[Shaun Mastin]

Bob

Here’s some photos I already have , and I can get more in the next few days if you need anything in particular and to get a casting number for you

[Shaun Mastin]

Are these better ?

[Bob Carriere]

..... part number on the cast iron brake drum checks out for all 1940 Chevrolet and Maple Leaf trucks.

What I would like to see, whenever you get to that stage, is a photo of the HUB/adapter that attaches the rim to the brake drum...... should be like this photo.

The larger flange is the rim side 5 bolts .........the smaller flange fits into the brake drum.....and maybe 4 1/4 inches flange to flange.

Have you looked for a raised part number inside the front beam axle????***** ANSWERED IN A PREVIOUS POSTING

Thanks

[Shaun Mastin]

Probably have to wait till I take the wheel off if I can’t see any numbers with it on , but I do have a spare set off my 1943 lend lease chev I can check aswell

[Shaun Mastin]

These are a couple of spare sets I got with my truck

[Bob Carriere]

Nice to have spare parts to learn from.....

The first two pictures..... the ones with the small bolt holes.....are according to my reading....... the Heavy duty one and the small bolts hold a small domed hub cab/cover....... the lighter ball bearing variety has a screwed on sheet metal cap which is what I think I can see on your rolling chassis.

Looking forward for future posting of your project......

Thanks for your help.

Bob C

[motto]

In my experience the bearings used in the hubs shown in the upper three photos in Shaun's post 8 would not have been Timken Tapered Rollers but Hyatt Barrel Rollers.
These hub/drum assemblies were used on the heavy axle which would interchange as a unit with the lighter axle that used the cup/cone/ball arrangement fitted to most of the L/L trucks.
Strangely enough in post war Victoria (Aust) you were far more likely to find the heavy axle under a civilian 30 CWT truck than under an MCP which would have a civilian rating of 3 ton
I can only relate what I have seen over the years and the mixture of parts in these trucks has always been confusing.

David

[Bob Carriere]

You are correct David....... I would be happy to find the barrel roller bearing or the Timken rollers......... just hoping to find better than the ball bearing bicycle setup.

I tried to do a swap on a 46 to 1951 axle..... the Hyatt were bigger diameter and then center ID too big for the spindle........ HUB, Bearings, spindle must match............ still hunting for a larger HD axle.

Thanks

Bob C.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Bob Carriere

You are correct David....... I would be happy to find the barrel roller bearing or the Timken rollers......... just hoping to find better than the ball bearing bicycle setup.

If you have the Outer diameter and Bore diameter of the Angular Contact Ball Bearings, you can look up if there is a Tapered Roller Bearing in the same size using these SKF tools:

http://webtools3.skf.com/BearingCalc...Product.action
https://www.skfbearingselect.com/

You can also see how much you gain in Basic load ratings.

HTH,
Hanno

[Bob Carriere]

Will take some careful measurements today and check it out.\

for the time being we are fighting a snow blizzard....only 4 inches on top of the mud but the snow is moving sideways.....300,000 customers without power in Central Quebec..... we are still enjoying electricity for now.

This as to be the longest Winter yet.

Bob C.

[Bob Carriere]

Hyatt bearings on Ebay...... ranging from 11.00 for just the race......to $20.00 and full bearings same Hyatt at $386 and a Timken at $650.......all the same number......

Pays to shop around.........ridiculous........

[Philippe Jeanneau]

Would the answer related to the front spindle/hub bearings be located here on page 37 of the PDF?

https://www.gmheritagecenter.com/doc...olet-Truck.pdf

For a brief moment after reading this, I thought that you could fit the spare HD hubs shown in the photos directly to my axle, but that would not be possible due to the fact that the king pins and spindles are larger in diameter...

[Bob Carriere]

Will be measuring the spindle on the spare axle with bicycle bearings......

Thanks for sharing.

[Bob Carriere]

My Outer bearing location on the spindle......0.848 factory 0.8427 to 32

Inner bearing location on the spindle.........1.413 factory 1.4051 to 56

That makes my spindle on the worn side but.......

....it is listed on page 34 as conventional..... heavy duty..... and my spare axle has the proverbial ball bearing bicycle bearings.

So it remains that the only other axle with larger spindle seems to be the COE which might have the roller bearings.....Hyatt Barrel roller.....

I have been working and learning by taking apart a spare front axle which according to the cast number on the I beam was made for 1946 to 51.....

I have yet to fully examine the actual axle of the targeted 1940 1 1/2 ton Chev that is still frozen hard to the ground with 12 to 18 inches of snow and ice around it.

[Philippe Jeanneau]

Agreed, almost 100% sure that the roller bearings we're after are only found on the COE models... So, the challenge would be to find one of these complete front axles and just slide it under our rigs!

[Andrew H.]

The Chev 1533X2 trucks made in Canada especially for the LRDG had a wider and heavier Timken front axle - not sure what kind of bearings. They are quite hard to obtain in NZ and require wider front mudguards, so some replicas (including ours) use the standard beam axle with the bicycle bearings on the stub axle.

[Bob Carriere]

Hi Andrew

Nice to hear from you.....followed your build up with great interest....... you are to blame for putting this crazy idea in my mind to build one also.

I am working from 1940 GM master parts catalogue and specific GM 1940 parts lisitings including the Maple Leaf.

My biggest Handicap is that teh 1940 1 1/2 ton Civilian Chevrolet is still stuck in the Ice and snow......worst year in Ottawa since 110 years ago.

Meanwhile learning from a spare front axle I dragged in the barn....spare axle dates to 1946 to 51 according to casting numbers.

I have concerns that the long extension on the front HUB will put undue stress on the front bearing.....but the the manuals reminds me that the weak bicycle bearing was used well into the 1950s with a 2 1/2 ton capacity using duals.

Wish I would score a spare set of axles from a C15 Parts truck...... but no luck so far.

Am I to assume that your axle is a "Famous Timken Bearing axle" and if so could you share the cast raise part number from the front beam.....any photos????

Another two weeks and should be able to crawl under neath the 40 donot truck........currently in MUd, Mud Mud......

Last supplemental question.....what was the source of the dimension and design for your cargo box????

Thanks for the inspiration.

Bob C

[Andrew H.]

Hi Bob,
Great to hear that you got the idea from my blog - I see it has now received more than 64,000 hits. To answer your questions: Firstly I don't have a Timken front axle, if I did have one I would have used it and widened the front mudguards as per the original LRDG trucks. Secondly, the "weak" bicycle bearings on the stub axle must be stronger than we all think, as they were originally on our 3-tonne Chev dual-rear-wheeled truck that had been used for many years as a tip truck carting heavy loads of road gravel, with big fish plates riveted onto the chassis to give it extra load-carrying capacity (we later shortened the chassis). Lastly, I have a factory diagram (see attached) and also several factory photos showing the dimensions and general layout of the rear 4B1 body of the 1533X2 Chevs as they left the Oshawa factory in Canada.

[Bob Carriere]

Hi Andrew

I guess the old bearing were much better than we imagine.....and since I am not likely to overload my LRDG as in real life I may be worried for nothing. But I am still keeping an eye open for a HD Maple Leaf front axle with Hyatt barrel roller bearings.

I have those dimension for the box also but hoping you had some treasured diagram to work from. Since my truck will be an emulation of the original 33 handmade Egypt version I may have more options for the box...... not sure I want to build a wooden body replica due to all the storage care it "wood" need!!!

The chase is half the fun as they say!!!!!!

Thanks for documenting your efforts and will try to do the same from my end.

Bob C.

[Tony Smith]

From the Australian Commonwealth Military Forces Chevrolet and Maple Leaf Catalogue:

18" x 8" wheel: 5802210
Front hub: 5802242
Front I Beam Axle 1940: 1796042
Front I Beam Axle 1941: 5803481

[Tony Smith]

18" Wheel:

[Bob Carriere]

Thanks for the info Tony.

All models under one cover....... I have to thumb through different manuals to achieve the same info....

Nice to see the "naked" 18 in. wheel........ with five holes.... were they running five bolts on the rear axle???? ....all the unmounted wheels I have seen are drilled for 10 holes.

Now that I have cornered a C15 from a Canadian MLU member my quest is greatly simplified.

Cheers

[Tony Smith]

Originally Posted by Bob Carriere

Thanks for the info Tony.

All models under one cover....... I have to thumb through different manuals to achieve the same info....

Nice to see the "naked" 18 in. wheel........ with five holes.... were they running five bolts on the rear axle???? ....all the unmounted wheels I have seen are drilled for 10 holes.

Now that I have cornered a C15 from a Canadian MLU member my quest is greatly simplified.

Cheers

This rim HAD 10 lug holes, but has been re-modified for a Maple Leaf by welding up 5 of the holes. The wheels for the 10 lug Chevrolet or the 5 lug Maple leaf trucks used the same basic blanks.

Also of note is that the 18" wheels are 8"wide, with the inner and outer halves being the same width. Again, the same blank is used for both halves, unlike the Canadian/UK 16" wheels which have a thick inner and thin outer half for a 6" width.

See: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Bem...LsgA6hq2h/view

[Bob Carriere]

....can you imagine drilling bolt holes at the same station for 8 + hours......

Interesting google information..... and noticed that they were forge-stamped having been heated.......

does anybody know whether the same pre heating was used by GM and /or Kelsey Hayes in Canada ...... Oshawa workers where shown handling the parts...blanks and stamped parts in bare hands...... or was the picture staged??

Is it possible that the higher production capacity of GM Canada also punched out the center and bolt holes in the same operation.......???

Bob C

[Mike Kelly]

I see they used 'Camel Back' drills ... still see them around , I've got one .

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Thought I had found your axle.... but is is an 8-bolt hub only.

http://www.mapleleafup.net/forums/sh...834#post284834

[Bob Carriere]

Hi Hanno

Hi Philippe

What you have is a whole new and different type of adapter......... it has the CMP bolt pattern(8) ....similar to the C15 4x2 but much shallower....as in closer to the brake drum......... the C15 does nothave those smaller nuts showing and is bolted from behind like the civilian ones. The centre bearing cover is also unique being of a stamp metal screwed in to the hub,,,,,typically the bearing cover for the HD Timken bearing set up has a domed cover held by 4 small bolts/screws...... any idea what it came from????

Been very cold around here lately.... at night minus- 25 to -29C with a windchill factor of -35C.....very little snow so far but bitter cold.

Cheers