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  #601  
Old 14-06-19, 21:04
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The other day a nice package arrived containing a new made wiring harness for the truck. However the company wasnít able to do the metal braid shielding as found on the wireless trucks. So I ordered a roll of stainless braid and have been slowly getting the harness sheathed in it to match the original. So far itís turnout looking great. The last photo is an original wire for comparison.
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RHLI Museum,
Universal Carrier MKI*, 1942
C15A-wire3, 1944
Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
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  #602  
Old 14-06-19, 22:13
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Default Mice may need dentures

Hi Jordan


Nice work on the wiring harness. Want to see the first mouse who tries to chew on that, wonder where you get mouse dentures.


The shielded wiring and that every panel on my C60S had braided grounds like that was why I was pretty sure it had been a radio truck, even though it didn't have a body when I got it.



Cheers Phil
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  #603  
Old 14-06-19, 22:25
Bob Carriere Bob Carriere is offline
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Default Apples and oranges......

Nice job Jordan.

Are we talking Stainless Steel braided casings or "tinned woven/braided copper casings" .............. I have found and used a variety of sizes of the tinned copper type as found by the foot on Ebay and other suppliers....... heavy stock can be made into custom ground straps and very easy to lead/silver solder.

Curious!!!!
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  #604  
Old 14-06-19, 22:31
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Well with some barn cats Iím hoping the mice donít even get to the denture stage.

Phil, can you check your records for me please on the length of the rear harness? Iím looking for the length from the change over switch towards the front. Please and thanks.

Bob, Iím using Stainless braided covering. Itís working very well.

Anyone have any pictures on where the wires from the fuel tanks are run and secured to the frame?
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RHLI Museum,
Universal Carrier MKI*, 1942
C15A-wire3, 1944
Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
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  #605  
Old 15-06-19, 00:58
Grant Bowker Grant Bowker is offline
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Good afternoon,
The harness looks nice.
Is the harness an off the shelf item?
Who's the maker/supplier (looks like it shipped in a USPS box....).
Does it include provision for turn signals?
Source for stainless braid? A quick check of ebay shows more choice of sizes for tinned copper than stainless. McMaster shows more variety but won't sell to Canada or Canadian credit cards. Is your source local or a nationwide chain?
Lots of questions, hoping for answers.
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  #606  
Old 15-06-19, 01:18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jordan Baker View Post
Well with some barn cats ......

Phil, can you check your records for me please on the length of the rear harness? Iím looking for the length from the change over switch towards the front. Please and .....

Anyone have any pictures on where the wires from the fuel tanks are run and secured to the frame?
Hi Jordan

Having made harnesses for HUPS, C60S, C60L, C15A that the front harness seem to be the same length with the individual differences being for which Pattern and then on Pat 13s early or late instrument panel. From what I can figure/observed rear harness for, 134, and 158 inch wheel base are all the same from rear to just in front of the rear axle. That the difference is the length forward to the connection lenght to the junction point with the front harness.

If you think about it this would make a lot of sense for parts interchangeablity.

Will look tomorrow for photos and more details.

Cheers Phil
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`41 C60L Pattern 12
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  #607  
Old 15-06-19, 01:47
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Grant,

Yes itís an off the shelf item from Vintage Wiring Harness in Australia. Item number CV425. I had them add the separate wires for turn signals as well. The quality is great and Iím very happy with it. All of the leads are tagged, however the numbers donít match up to the wiring diagram in the C15a manuals. Saying this they may have used a different wiring diagram and matched it to them. One other thing I have noticed is that you have to provide your own light sockets for the dash lights. If I come across anything else I post about it. Ignore the box as it is only being used for holding CMP goodies such as side lights and other original bits.

The stainless braiding came from https://www.cabletiesandmore.com/sta...aided-sleeving. I ordered online and it arrived by the end of the next day via UPS.

I went with stainless as the tinned copper was a lot more. The other advantage was that the stainless had a good expansion range. So using the 1/2Ē stainless, I was able to do all the sizes as found on the main harness.

Thanks Phil. I look forward to seeing what youíve got in your files. Iíve got what I believe to be an original rear harness. Iíll have to slip under the truck and see how it goes then compare to the new made one. I do know the new one is way longer then needed for a 15cwt.
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RHLI Museum,
Universal Carrier MKI*, 1942
C15A-wire3, 1944
Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
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  #608  
Old 16-06-19, 03:39
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Started installing the front harness today. It was quite the job getting the dash wires to feed through the hole. Eventually everything got pushed and pulled through. I also started securing the harness to the cab frame with some clips. Iím so glad I went the extra and put the metal shielding on everything. It looks just like how the original should.

In my last photo showing the various holes. What are they all for? I know the top one is for the main wiring harness. Does anyone have any documents on what goes where?
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RHLI Museum,
Universal Carrier MKI*, 1942
C15A-wire3, 1944
Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
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  #609  
Old 16-06-19, 12:29
Grant Bowker Grant Bowker is offline
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The oval hole gets a rubber grommet with 4 holes in it that cushions the temperature line, choke cable, throttle cable and oil pressure line. the two smaller round holes above and below the oval are for bolts securing the tin that holds the grommet.
One vendor is Steele Rubber https://www.steelerubber.com/firewal...met-60-0010-45 Other vendors sell it too, Steele just had a clearer photo than Chevs of the 40s....
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  #610  
Old 16-06-19, 13:19
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Thanks Grant. I should have said that I have the rubber bushing. Any idea on the other two larger holes? Iím guessing the speedometer cable goes in one of them.
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RHLI Museum,
Universal Carrier MKI*, 1942
C15A-wire3, 1944
Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
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  #611  
Old 16-06-19, 14:20
David Dunlop David Dunlop is offline
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Jordan.

Would the vacuume lines for the wipers occupy one of them?

David
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  #612  
Old 16-06-19, 14:20
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Default Dash Wiring

Hi Jordan

Your truck has one more hole comin in from the engine compartment than I've seen before, wonder if it was drilled to replace a wire or possibly for a replacement temperature gauge tube.

Here is same area on my HUP
Click image for larger version

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As you have discovered the only practical way to work on the dash and engine compartment wiring is with nose off. I make this comment to anyone planning to replace or do major work on the wiring in this area.

Jordan though I'll guess you have looked at the section on wiring on my web page, here is the link for people getting into wiring on thier CMPs http://canadianmilitarypattern.com/C...formatioSn.htm I've included the link instead of posting over all the photos because you can punch down to much higher resolution than is practical on MLU.

Cheers Phil

PS In response to Davids comment on vacuum line, the vacuum line for the wipers on mine goes up through the center post on the windshield.
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Last edited by Phil Waterman; 16-06-19 at 14:24. Reason: add information
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  #613  
Old 16-06-19, 14:50
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Hi David.

As Phil says the vacuum line goes up through the top between the main windshield frame.

Phil, yes I have been checking out your photos from your website quite a bit the past few days.
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RHLI Museum,
Universal Carrier MKI*, 1942
C15A-wire3, 1944
Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
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  #614  
Old 16-06-19, 15:50
Grant Bowker Grant Bowker is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Waterman View Post
Having made harnesses for HUPS, C60S, C60L, C15A that the front harness seem to be the same length with the individual differences being for which Pattern and then on Pat 13s early or late instrument panel. From what I can figure/observed rear harness for 101, 134 and 158 inch wheel base are all the same from rear to just in front of the rear axle. That the difference is the length forward to the connection length to the junction point with the front harness.
If you think about it this would make a lot of sense for parts interchangeablity.
This morning I compared the parts books for C15A and C60L, most of the wiring harness part numbers were identical (differences for applications such as portee, arctic, instrument styles, wireless shielding, etc.).
To allow for the difference in wheelbases I would have expected either that there would be long, medium and short rear harnesses or that there would be extension harnesses to fit between common front and rear harnesses. Maybe I wasn't seeing clearly or didn't recognize what they were calling the parts but I didn't see either of these approaches described in the parts books....

Last edited by Grant Bowker; 16-06-19 at 15:56.
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  #615  
Old 16-06-19, 18:24
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Default Warning - be sure to secure wiring harness

Hi All



WARNING - BE SURE TO SECURE WIRING HARNESS

Yes, using all caps is like shouting, and regarding this warning I am, I learned the hard way. While looking for photos for this thread found the photos of the wiring harness FIRE I had in a freshly made wiring harness. The cause of the fire was simple I had not yet secured the harness with the clamps it shifted was shorted out burned out the harness. Nearly burned through a rubber gas line. I could have lost the truck, the other two trucks parked in the shop and the shop.

Click image for larger version

Name:	Pat 12 Cable Fire Sept 07 018.jpg
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ID:	107861 Top to bottom, speedo cable, fuel line, main harness, and bottom battery cable.

Be sure as you go along to secure the wiring harness with cable clamps, that's what all those 1/4 holes are for. Also watch very carefully your routing in the area around the brake master cylinder, starter, speedometer cable and fuel line.


What happened was I was in a hurry to test the truck and hooked every thing up and drove it around quite a bit great fun. Figured I'd get around to putting in all the clamps. What happened was the speedometer cable shifted shorted out to the brake light switch on the master cylinder. That heated up and melted the insulation on the main power going to the starter that that lit up the speedo cable which was tight with the main wiring harness running forward to come up to the dash. Resultant damage was a foot of the main harness had to be cut out and replaced.

All because I didn't take the time to put clamps on everything before powering the system up.



Now back to Jordan's excellent restoration thread with a question. What are you going to use as overload protection?


Cheers Phil
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`41 C60L Pattern 12
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`45 HUP
http://canadianmilitarypattern.com/
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Last edited by Phil Waterman; 16-06-19 at 18:25. Reason: spelling
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  #616  
Old 16-06-19, 18:45
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Warning acknowledged.

Iím slowly working away at installing the harness. So far Iíve used 5 clips just for the wires either side of the engine.

Overload protection? Would this be the current limiting device that is mounted to the backside of the dash?
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Universal Carrier MKI*, 1942
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Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
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  #617  
Old 16-06-19, 21:22
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Default Current limiter

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jordan Baker View Post
Warning acknowledged......


Overload protection? Would this be the current limiting device that is mounted to the backside of the dash?
Hi Jordan

Yes, that's the current limiting device I'm speaking of. Of the three of these on my trucks only one actually worked to limit the current. It vibrated to beat the band to limit current at 30-40 amps when bench tested. The other two would pass 40 amps with not a sound.

The first the one on the HUP I used, the other two I did not use, instead putting a modern thermo braker in, forget if I used 30 or 40 amp units. Now as I think about it think going back and adding a 30-35 amp fusible link at the point where the main harness picks up power at the starter might be a good idea. Now that your work as reminded me I should go back and add it to all three of my trucks.

Other thread over the years have discussed the value of adding a battery disconnect switch. I used a marine battery switch on my C60S when I installed the 261 engine. It let's me run truck on 6 volt normal conditions, then if for any reason the truck doesn't start I can switch just the starter over to 12 volts. In either position the trucks normal electric system only gets 6 volts. The switch as an off possition as well. The 12 volt battery normally just drives the water pump for the shower, lights in the shower/toilet and the modern radios in the cab.

Cheers Phil
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  #618  
Old 01-07-19, 02:04
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The harness still isnít fully installed yet. Iíve been busy working on some side projects the past week or so. However I did manage to get the following parts all finished and installed on the truck these past few days. The radiator shroud turned out looking great. I made up some wooden forms for the dished part. My first attempt didnít go well but my second was bang on. I even spot welded just like the originals. I did have a minor fit issue with the bottom of the shroud and the lower radiator outlet.
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Universal Carrier MKI*, 1942
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Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
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  #619  
Old 01-07-19, 02:10
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Once I cut out a minor section the shroud went on just fine. I also made up a felt strip for the top shroud to seal against the bottom of the top tank. I used stainless safety wire for the felt staples. Now the radiator is all done and ready to go on.
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RHLI Museum,
Universal Carrier MKI*, 1942
C15A-wire3, 1944
Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
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  #620  
Old 01-07-19, 02:49
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Things are looking good, Jordan!

David
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  #621  
Old 01-07-19, 13:38
Alex van de Wetering Alex van de Wetering is offline
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Lovely work on the rad and shrouds, Jordan. It seems you work just as easy with steel as you do with styrene!
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  #622  
Old 05-07-19, 19:18
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Very nice work Jordan

Pete
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  #623  
Old 05-07-19, 20:56
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Thanks all for the compliments.

Today I mounted the radiator on the test engine stand. Things are getting closer to running the engine up and making sure all is good before installing it in the truck.
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Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
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  #624  
Old 05-07-19, 22:24
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Default Fan

Hi Jordan

Out of curiosity are you going to paint the tips of the fan?

Reason I ask is that I've gone over to painting the outer 2 inches of the fan blades front and back either white or red for safety reasons. It hurts when you gets your fingers hit. I paint both front and back because if you paint only the back side there is one angle looking from the right that all you see is edge and the front of the blade.

Looks like you are getting close to running the engine on the test stand, so much nicer to find those little leaks or noises when the engine is out of the truck. Have also found it is a lot easier to run the engine though a couple of heat cycles and re-torque the head. Adjusting the valves is so easy when you can walk around the engine.

Looking forward to the first engine run video.

Nice work on the fan shroud.

Cheers Phil
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  #625  
Old 06-07-19, 05:12
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I thought about painting the tips but then didnít.

Anyway I got he engine running up for its first extended time. When I filled the radiator tonight I was quite happy about no leaks anywhere until it started leaking. I realized that I missed putting the gasket in when the thermostat goes. So I drained the system and pulled that apart and got the gasket installed. All is good now. I also had changed out the side pan gasket. The one I had out on was garbage. The gasket itself soaked up oil and was like a sponge. Felpro to the rescue and no leaks.

The first video is without a tail pipe. I then loosely put the tail pipe on. The metal clinking noise you can hear is the exhaust pipe rattling

https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=...&v=L83cKSWlW3Y

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dI9Ckf...ature=youtu.be
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Willys MB, 1942
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  #626  
Old 06-07-19, 14:22
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Hi Jordan

Looks and sound good. Yes getting the side panel to seal can be a real problem. I've had similar problem with "new" gaskets leaking through the material, for me it was the thermostat gasket that just plain weeped.

When I was working on the 235 and 261 I ran the engine with a lexon clear side cover and was surprised how much oil is standing in the side valve gallery when the engine is running. Other thing that showed up was how much condensation forms inside that cover shortly after starting. Will look to see if I have video clear side cover on the 216.

Like what category your engine test videos are listed, "comedy".

Cheers Phil
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  #627  
Old 09-07-19, 05:10
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Work continued on the rear harness over the past few days. Iím not sure if they sent the right one or if the one they based it off of was different. Anyhow out of the box it needed to be worked on. Once I finished fixing it, everything lined up and the harness fit. I then started installing the wire braiding over the harness. This afternoon I started to install into the frame but ran out of time.
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  #628  
Old 09-07-19, 14:32
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Default Think I've got the explanation

Hi Jordan

Ok now that I see your harness think I can explain the difference. They changed the location of the rear tail light blackout switch from on side frame rail with a head light dimmer switch through the frame rail, to late version that had a toggle switch on the drivers side tail lights mounting.

Now that I've seen yours will try and take some photos of the three different rear harness versions on my trucks.

Cheers Phil
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  #629  
Old 22-07-19, 02:26
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This past week I have been working away on the front harness. I ended up drawing out a new wiring diagram from the perspective of standing in front of the truck looking back. Basically where youíd stand. Initially I had trouble sorting out the lighting toggle switches but then realized the wiring harness was made for SPST switches and not the TPST ones used on the later trucks. The Ford wiring diagram shows this much better. I made up a few jumpers to be soldered into the harness.

One question I do have. Do I have the green wires on my drawing correct? That power comes off that circuit overload piece and then the wires split into 6 individual wires going to the inspection lamp socket, dash lamp switch, tail lamp switch, tail/side switch, tail/side/headlamp switch and stop isolation switch?
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  #630  
Old 22-07-19, 02:28
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Jordan Baker Jordan Baker is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Hamilton, Ontario
Posts: 3,235
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More wiring.
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AEE6DE9B-B098-43F2-AE5B-F9C2A042C121.jpeg   941467AD-9154-4B60-84E9-D07D66D40468.jpeg   99CC1875-6AA5-458F-8328-9EEC3C19D2A4.jpeg   89C66389-4FDB-456C-8758-7D58395AC5F4.jpeg   5DB0B72C-EF41-489D-98ED-A776911C930A.jpeg  

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Jordan Baker
RHLI Museum,
Universal Carrier MKI*, 1942
C15A-wire3, 1944
Willys MB, 1942
Dodge D23c, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
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