transporting carriers

[Ryan]

Gentlemen. How large a trailer do you need to transport a bren carrier successfully and legally?
My carrier in question will be a bare bones cut down hull. I will also be carrying a set of wheels and boggies in the back of my ute.
Your experiences would be greatly appreciated.
Ryan

[Plushy]

Ryan ,
I would suggest a Plant trailer with dual axles at least , I usually use a Tri axle plant trailer with electric brakes that can carry 3 to 4 ton anything over that weight i get a tilt tray to pick it up .

Plushy

[Darren Witty]

I towed a british carrier for two days using a kennards dual wheel trailer with a 2008 Landruiser. Started to rain at Mitchell QLD and the trailer overtook us and then swung around and punched a hole in the rear drivers side door of the landcruiser and then dragged the landcruiser over a culvert and through a barded wire fence into a ploughed paddock. It bent and cracked the draw bar. I then drove the rest of the way to brisbane keeping an eye of the crack. $700 extra fees from kennards. It had cut down armour and no motor. Hope this helps you to decide to tow with a car trailer?
Good luck
Darren

[Rob Beale]

weighs about 1 tonne, so figure less for the cut down hull, and any rust holes.

In NZ the towing vehicle must be heavier than the towed trailer plus load.
This means any load in the towing vehicle helps with traction and stability.

I too have experienced a jack knifed tandem trailer, fortunately at a slower speed. Key lesson for me was keeping the centre of gravity forward of the centre of the axles, (maybe over the front axle?)

Most light vehicles allow only 500kg as the total towed weight.
You probably need an SUV or big ute, (Falcon etc) to tow 2000kg or more.

best wishes
Rob

[ron]

Hi Ryan,
Its better to be safe than sorry, if its a reasonal distance spend the money and get a tilt tray, its much better let them do the sweating, and its door to door and they can place it exactly where you want no sweat,,
well thats my two bobs worth. its how I have always done it and overr the years I have moved quite a few with no dramas.
Good luck dont forget plenty of pics,and welcome to our carrier world, Regards Ron

[cantankrs]

Originally Posted by Rob Beale

weighs about 1 tonne, so figure less for the cut down hull, and any rust holes.

I think a little bit heavier than 1 ton for an uncut hull. Last weekend we let down one side of an LP2 with a half ton chainblock and it was hard work on the chainblock. We wanted to readjust so tried to relift the right side and gave up very quickly.

Regards

Alex

P.S. Anyone hired a tandem trailer with brakes that actually work??! Don't think I've found one yet over here. I hired one late last year in Perth and it had discs on the front and they were worn tapered due to pads worn away. I had to back all the adjusters off to avoid further damage and uneccesary friction. The old saying I guess "Youse gets whats youse pays for" and they don't charge enough.

[Ryan]

Thanks guys, makes for sobering reading.
I'll be heading to Corowa this year in my Hilux 4x4 (with a commodore V6) and was thinking of hiring a trailer to take up there, maybe even Kennards. And then from there into NSW to get the carrier. I once hired a tandem from them to transport my F15 Blitz. But that was only for a dozen kms or more.
This time it will be from Inverleigh, near Geelong, Vic, to Corowa and then into Nsw for another 350kms. And then all the way back again. About a 1500km round trip I think.
Was thinking of a light truck but that may break my budget.

Here is a pic of what the carrier looks like. What do you think the weight would be?

I guess I'm finally border raiding.

[ron]

Hello Ryan,
Not intending to be rude, but take the bits and leave the rest you can do better than that,
sorry mate but I mean it well.
Regards Ron

[Douglas Greville]

Originally Posted by Rob Beale

weighs about 1 tonne, so figure less for the cut down hull, and any rust holes.

In NZ the towing vehicle must be heavier than the towed trailer plus load.
This means any load in the towing vehicle helps with traction and stability.

I too have experienced a jack knifed tandem trailer, fortunately at a slower speed. Key lesson for me was keeping the centre of gravity forward of the centre of the axles, (maybe over the front axle?)

Most light vehicles allow only 500kg as the total towed weight.
You probably need an SUV or big ute, (Falcon etc) to tow 2000kg or more.

best wishes
Rob

Rob

I don't want to start an argument, but I am very sure a carrier hull weighs a lot more than 1 tonne. I have towed an LP2 bare hull but with
all road wheels, on a car trailer and can remember it as feeling a lot heavier
than that. Car trailers are typically 750kg by themselves and with anything heavier than about 850kg exceed the rating of standard passenger car
towbars (1600kg) (Falcon/Commodore). Thus, unless the towing car has a Hayman Reese style heavy duty bar PLUS tow pack (auto trans cooler at a minimum) then something is likely to break.

A totally bare hull, with no warp axle, no warp bogies, no rear boggies,
no rear plate and no air scoop would have to be around 1/2 tonne to 3/4
tonne lighter. However, most hulls I have come across typically were
not that bare. More likely was a cut down hull but with most of the
undercarriage still on it and that is heavy stuff.

I once had a warp axle with bogies that had been cut out of a hull and the bloke I sold it to told me that it weighed 750kg when he took it over a weigh bridge on the way home. There was the minimum of armour still around such
that the person who cut it out had stayed in as tight as he could with the
Oxy torch when cutting the hull.

Regards
Doug

[martyn]

Not to stick my nose in but when i was building my carrier i was moving a stripped hull around on a landrover defender 110 with a ifor williams trailer with no problems was towing at 50mph, i would say the hull would be about 2 tonns if you think the tracks and running gear is about a tonn the engine gearbox and all the extras would be about 1/2 tonn ish and a complete carrier is about 3.5 tonns, iam think iam on the high side on my weights but would rather guess and take something bigger to tow it with, looking at that photo you have put up i would say you would be looking a around a tonn maybe just over?
maybe you should strip it and put some in a trailer and some in your truck if you have the space and time to do that?
good luck

[RichardT10829]

Personally i reckon the trick with this is to make the carrier itself a trailer ie some way of lifting the tracks from the road surface my thoughts would be towards a bolt on system using the bogeys and sprockets as mounting zones so if you can imagine a gantry with two wheels on each side of the hull with flat plates on and a bar, the bar goes into the bogey jacking point the flat plates slide under the hull, you would obviously need to secure it in place, then a towing triangle on the front......... the idea being once where you needed to get to you jack up the hull and pop the sides off, second pro would be the system would take up very little space when not in use.


Richie

ps please excuse the crude drawing its a first attempt using Paint and a 3 minute job at that har har har

[cletrac (RIP)]

Here's how I hauled mine home with no problems whatever! By the way, that blue thing on the trailer is the carrier.

[Jordan Baker]

Interesting concept with the drawings. A couple problems I could see would that the track and suspension drops a lot when no weight is on it. So you would really have to jack it up. Some cross pieces would also be needed and how would you secure them, bolts??

I think this is a neat idea that could work.

[martyn]

here is a couple of photos one of a 10tonn truck with 2 wrecks on it and one of my landy with just the hull the problem is they are 3.5 tonns and a bumper pull tow bar over here is 3.5tonn max then you have the weight of the trailer kinda just over weight by about a tonn yes you can tow it but watch out for the blue lights in your mirror.......... did try loading it on my trailer to see what would happen thort might blow the wheels out she took the weight and towed around the yard but wouldnt want to go up or down a hill.

[Alex Blair (RIP)]

Originally Posted by rynoki

Thanks guys, makes for sobering reading.
I'll be heading to Corowa this year in my Hilux 4x4 (with a commodore V6) and was thinking of hiring a trailer to take up there, maybe even Kennards. And then from there into NSW to get the carrier. I once hired a tandem from them to transport my F15 Blitz. But that was only for a dozen kms or more.
This time it will be from Inverleigh, near Geelong, Vic, to Corowa and then into Nsw for another 350kms. And then all the way back again. About a 1500km round trip I think.
Was thinking of a light truck but that may break my budget.

Here is a pic of what the carrier looks like. What do you think the weight would be?

I guess I'm finally border raiding.

Ryan ..There are different methods of transporting tracked vehicles..
They are a little different from transporting rubber tired vehicles..
Part of the safety of transporting these vehicles depends on the friction of the wheels /tracks and the deck on which they are being transported..and is very often overlooked as an issue until your tracked vehicle is laying upside down in a ditch,or in Pinky Parkers case ..laying on its side on the main street..
The friction between a steel deck and steel tracks is virtually nil..the vehicle will act very tamely while sitting at rest on the deck and will remain that way until the evils of centrifugal force and inertia come into play as you are towing it merrily down the street and come to the first corner ,with which you travel around at any speed..
You will soon realize that even chained down,your pet will go traveling on its own..much to your chagrin..
So be safe and use a wooden deck or a rubber matted deck..to transport you vehicle//Maybe Bruce will post those pictures ..or maybe Jif can find them in the archive..They have been posted here before and are a good example of not being aware of this hazard..

[cantankrs]

Originally Posted by cantankrs

I think a little bit heavier than 1 ton for an uncut hull. Last weekend we let down one side of an LP2 with a half ton chainblock and it was hard work on the chainblock. We wanted to readjust so tried to relift the right side and gave up very quickly.

Out of respect to Rob (and thanks Doug) - I forgot the warp axle was still fitted along with the two rear suspension units minus wheels. Certainly the warp axle would add weight.

Also Ryan the diff is heavy.

It was a Kennards I hired to bring our furniture home but as I said they didn't charge much, and I was desperate, so it just pays to check and test everything before you drive away. I'd use Kennards equipment again at the drop of a hat. But they did say if the trailer broke down out of metro area we'd be paying for its recovery, and I think repair.

Regards

Alex

[cantankrs]

Hi Ryan,

Am I right in that the other side axle, brakes, etc are missing from the diff? My Dad encountered big trouble getting the diff clamp caps off and the axle housing levered away (on his LP2). Also he made a mistake in overhauling the brakes while it was still on the donor carrier thinking it would save him undue handling and have an idea that the diff might be OK before he went to the trouble of removing it. He could no longer screw the brake adjusters right in thru their respective hole in the hull extension plates so that levering the diff back and down would clear the adjuster holes. Not wanting to split the diff which a number of recoverers seem to have done, he pulled the axles and removed the hubs and backing plates again.

Anyone else had difficulties getting LP2 diffs off?
Do the LP1's have welded on hull extension plates that just unbolt crossways?

Also the rear supension units needed considerable effort to get detached even after bolts were removed.

Regards

Alex

[Ryan]

Your experiences and opinions have been very helpful so far everyone. Thanks for responding.
Going to give Corowa a miss this year to make the trip shorter and bring the budget in too. It's bill season in my house at the moment.

Ron, I'm not offended by your comments. I reckon it looks like a dog too. But the owner said I could have it for a slab of beer!
Thanks Alex Blair for the heads up on rubber and or wooden flooring. Wouldn't want a nasty surprise like that!
And yes Alex (cantankrs) the other side of the diff are missing. When I get home I'll post up the other two pics I have.
Stripping some of it Martyn sounds like a good idea.

[Ryan]

Yep, there isn't much left but I said to myself, "they don't build them anymore and something may come in handy".

[cantankrs]

Originally Posted by rynoki

Yep, there isn't much left but I said to myself, "they don't build them anymore and something may come in handy".

Hey Ryan, Get whatever you can off it. One little bit amongst many could save you some trouble later. Real pity about the weight/distance. Hate to say it but - gasaxe in winter with a helper?

Regards

Alex

[Tony Smith]

Originally Posted by cantankrs

Anyone else had difficulties getting LP2 diffs off?
Do the LP1's have welded on hull extension plates that just unbolt crossways?

Regards

Alex

The LP1 Diff bolts to extensions of the hull sides:

[RichardT10829]

forgot about the sprung load on the wheels, wonder if i could load them up towards the hull. and yes bolts would be used to hold the carrier to the system obviously it would mean drilling the carrier which is never good...

mind guys this is merely a 30 second concept i have conjured up i will work with martyn to see if we can make something safe and viable hahahahaha.


cheers

Richie

[Hendrik van Oorspronk]

Originally Posted by martyn

here is a couple of photos one of a 10tonn truck with 2 wrecks on it and one of my landy with just the hull the problem is they are 3.5 tonns and a bumper pull tow bar over here is 3.5tonn max then you have the weight of the trailer kinda just over weight by about a tonn yes you can tow it but watch out for the blue lights in your mirror.......... did try loading it on my trailer to see what would happen thort might blow the wheels out she took the weight and towed around the yard but wouldnt want to go up or down a hill.

Hello Martyn, try a RangeRover, this is how I transported the carrier last time, luckely didn't see the bleu lights.

Hendrik

[martyn]

Hi Hendrik
wow thats some trailer you have did we meet at arnhem a couple of years ago, I must say iam thinking of the mini artic route, thinking of converting my defender 110 to a 5th wheel pick up and changing the vehicle towing rates and making a nice step frame trailer maybe two sections of lorry chassie thats about the same width as a carrier track and strong a purpose built vehice and trailer?
Saw a iveco cab and chassie with a mini artic trailer with 5 cars on it when i was in holland last year that gave me the idea,
kinda like this photo i found on the net but my landy instead ? if a transit can tow sumthing a landy should lol.

[Hendrik van Oorspronk]

Originally Posted by martyn

Hi Hendrik
wow thats some trailer you have did we meet at arnhem a couple of years ago,

It could be we met, I have been there 2 times with the carrier, 1st time with my old Volvo seconds time with a rented Iveco made for transporting small diggers. In my opion the best way to transport a carrier.

Hendrik

[cletrac (RIP)]

Ryan, what's there could be carried on almost any kind of trailer. You could almost carry it in the back of a full size pickup. I don't think you'd have a ton of weight there.

[colin jones]

Morning everyone. Ryan, I agree with alex and the gas axe. As there is not a lot left it would be so much easier to load if it was cut neatly into usable pieces. There looks like some good parts there and everything is restorable. Just a tandem trailer with brakes would get that lot back to my place. Oops! I mean your place.
Colin.

[lynx42]

Hi Ryan,
Sorry we won't be seeing your happy smiling face at Corowa. You will be missing a big one. Almost 300 registrations to date and more coming in each day.
Regards Rick.

BTW.. Welcome to the carrier owners club. From small things, Big things grow.

[Ryan]

Guys, I've bit off more than I can chew.
I just can't afford it now.
Although the hull will only cost me a slab, the hiring of a trailer, the fuel, an overnight stay etc Plus the bogie/wheel set I have purchased will set me back about $1000.
The hilux slurps the fuel.
The bogie/wheel set cost $425.
The hull and bogies are on neighbouring properties a little north of Swan Hill.

Does somebody want to take these over and soon?

Here's a couple of pics of the wheels. Also included are some steering gear.

All it will cost you is $425 (to me) and a slab (to the hull owner) and I'll provide you with the details.

[lynx42]

So Ryan,
Does that mean you'll be at Corowa?
Guess my welcome was a bit premature.
I've passed your info on to a chap in SwanHill.
Regards Rick