Which winch is which...

Bob Carriere · #1 30-10-06, 02:48

From the pictures taken at Angus' Place.

The first picture is from the remains of a cab 11 gun tractor.... which interesting enough had power brakes....but the booster is gone.

Is it true that all the Chebby CGT had this same set up......??

...and that the second set up was exclusive to FGT...???

or were they just too different model interchangeable...???

Bob Carriere · #2 30-10-06, 02:50

... here is a closeup of the same Chev cab 11 frame showing the hooks used for the scotch block????

Is this the same set up as on your C60 with winch??

Bob Carriere · #3 30-10-06, 02:52

Found in the parts bin.... scotch block hooks very visible....

Bob Carriere · #4 30-10-06, 02:53

....is this winch fairlead set up exclusive to FGT or can they be found on CGT.... and C60.....

gjamo · #5 30-10-06, 03:35

Rear shot of my Chev

Keith Orpin · #6 30-10-06, 11:27

Hi Bob,
As far as I am aware,the set up shown in the 1st and 2nd image are typical Chevy set up, however, the hooks for the scotch locks are too far back. Certainly on my C30 they are mounted either side on the chassis rail just forward of the rear axle. The ones shown in your images, I reckon, have been repositioned. Picture 4 is typical Ford set up. Hope this helps
Keith

Keith Webb · #7 30-10-06, 11:50

Is basically the same as seen on most Australian CMPs set up with a winch.

Bob Carriere · #8 30-10-06, 16:16

Keith

I am heart broken....... are you sure the winch leads assembly in the last picture is unique to the Frod gun tractor...???

Can you imagine my embarrassment drive down the road in a Chev cab 11 with a Ford butt showing....???? maybe I should just torch the rear part of the frame and go back to angus' parts bin for Chevy parts.....

On the scotch block hooks......... the rearmost location would no doubt hold the blocks for the rear wheels when winching... there was another hook mounted in front of the rear axle angled towards the rear.

If the location is weird.... it is the same on the cab 11 frame as well as on the part frame in the spare part bin.

.....how will I sleep tonite...... a Ford butt on a Chev.

Bob C.

Phil Waterman · #9 30-10-06, 19:26

Here is the winch on my Pattern 12 Chevy.

Keith Webb · #10 30-10-06, 19:29

Quote:

.....how will I sleep tonite...... a Ford butt on a Chev

But a Ford diff as a winch in the guts of your chassis!

Walde Libera · #11 30-10-06, 20:09

Bob

I have 1944 CGT and your last picture is exactly the same set up, not like Phil Waterman's picture, the hooks you say are for scotches but I think maybe they are for cable anchor points cab 11 and 12's. My Chev cab 13 style winch assembly uses 2 cable hooks on the bottom underneath winch frame attached to1/2" thick plate section. You should see 2 pairs of 2 SAE tapped holes. There is also an angle support off the left side frame rail to this plate to give it extra support.
On another note I have original pics from the Chev cab 13 FAT at Newtonville that clearly shows winch scotch stowed in the rear wheel wells above the tire inside the fender wells. Here are 2 pics from mine.
If you want I will look & post scotch block stowage pics and 2 winch hook locations from Newtonville.
Cheers
Walde in Vancouver

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...b/P1010017.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...b/P1010100.jpg

Keith Orpin · #12 31-10-06, 11:29

Bob,
Don't go gas axing it just yet !
I'm sure the subject of correct location and connection of scotches to the frame of the truck have been covered before. I'll check out my manuals, as I know I have seen a diagram showing how the scotches are attached during heavy winching. Basically, for winching from the rear of the truck, the hooks on the chassis by the back axle are used to attach the strops and scotches, which are placed under the front wheels, and the truck is reversed onto them, thus tightening up the strops, and making the whole assembly virtually immovable. Conversly, you should have two hooks (one either side ) by the front springs, which are used to lock up the rear wheels, when you are winching from the front. The hooks you show in your pictures would in theory acheive the same end result, but instead of placing the scotches under the front wheels, they could be placed under the rear wheels.
Quite why all Chevy's had a Ford diff as a winch is beyond me !
Keith

Phil Waterman · #13 31-10-06, 14:20

Take a look at the 2nd and 3rd photos the hooks are the oposit directions. Also the side plates of my Pattern 12 winch are drilled for the hooks.

So the question is are the rear hook locations ment for towing or as the attachment points for the winching scotchs?

Been looking through my FAT pictures to see if there are 4 or 6 of these hooks no luck yet.

Grant Bowker · #14 31-10-06, 15:28

Here's a link to a thread started about two months ago about how scotches were rigged in use Winch Scotches

Keith Orpin · #15 31-10-06, 23:13

Bob,

Image 1 from MBC2

Image 2 taken from MBF1

Based on the evidence so far it would appear that Chevrolet fitted BOTH types of rear fair leads, so after my initial replies, it would appear that your Chev's butt is correct. As for me, it's a case of live and learn !. Maybe, the trucks fitted with winches, i.e C30 & C60's were fitted with only one type, whereas the gun tractors had either type.
Keith

Pete Ashby · #16 31-10-06, 23:57

Quote:

Originally posted by Keith Orpin
Bob,
Quite why all Chevy's had a Ford diff as a winch is beyond me !
Keith

Vengeance dear Boy.................. pure and simple

Pete PTO&G

Walde Libera · #17 01-11-06, 06:43

Found my pics from Newtonville, the hooks, there are 2, you see one side only are facing correct direction. Plus a support rod to frame rail.

Scotch storage location, rear body wheel wells

Walde

Bob Carriere · #18 02-11-06, 03:54

I am so relieved I could go out and burn a Ford......

Thanks Walde and others for saving my butt...... spent so much time cleaning it up I would hate to refer the case to a proctologist.

In particular.... the pictures are always worth a 1000 words well Walde in your case willmake that 1001..... I have forgotten to install the one inch steel bar brace on my truck..... thanks to your photo for reminding me..... I even know where it is sitting primed up on the shelf in the barn....... which Rob will attest is rather unusual for a person my age......

Now I will have to check the frame and fairlead plates for extra holes that may have been for the hooks.... which may have been removed as for all practical purposes as they would be seen as backwards and useless for towing......

Phil... in your Winter spare time.... any chance of doing some CAD sketches of the hooks and scotches or is it skotches so we can duplicate them....????

Thanks all....

Bob

Bob Carriere · #19 02-11-06, 04:15

.... I just had to see for myself......

10pm walked to the barn to check for bolt holes.....

....just as shown in Walde's pictures..... where he has hooks I have two nice round 1/2 holes....... now I need the hooks....

No wonder our wives think we are nuts......

Now I can sleep......

Bob

RHClarke · #20 02-11-06, 04:45

Quote:

Originally posted by Bob Carriere
.... now I need the hooks....

Bob

Bob,

Get the specs and then we can go visit a blacksmith I know in the Merrickville area. He will bend up some for you, but I am not sure on their strength...but, I'll bet that once you have your baby restored, you won't be pulling out stumps...right? Bob? Right?

Bob Carriere · #21 02-11-06, 21:38

...... but just in case.....

From what I have seen of the originals at Angus' place I can duplicate one using cold rolled steel.... never did see me fire up the old forge yet have you...... and oil quench the hook so it will stay hard........ we might even get the old mechanical blacksmith hammer going for the occasion...

As to pulling stumps...... don't think so.... wouldn't mind hitting a few mud holes in Larose Forest.... very sandy and easy to clean.... and maybe use the winch.... at least once.

Bob

Phil Waterman · #22 02-11-06, 22:22

Quote:

Originally posted by Bob Carriere
Phil... in your Winter spare time.... any chance of doing some CAD sketches of the hooks and scotches or is it skotches so we can duplicate them....????

Glad to do the shop drawings if someone will send be a skotche to measure or failing that how about a couple more of photos with measurement added and I'll work on the drawings.

I've shown the hooks and the pigtail cable guides to a blacksmith and he said they should be no problem. So your right on the mark Rob.

Gunner · #23 21-11-06, 17:06

Boobee:

Ifn ya need to ya c'n borry one of mine from the LAAT to have it copied.

Cheers, Mikey in Kenya well actually in Bristol, UK right now and on my way home to the great white North!

Alex Blair (RIP) · #24 21-11-06, 17:28

Quote:

Originally posted by Gunner
Boobee:

Ifn ya need to ya c'n borry one of mine from the LAAT to have it copied.

Cheers, Mikey in Kenya well actually in Bristol, UK right now and on my way home to the great white North!

Gunner..
Get home here and bring your credit card..It's time to wet that crown down..You been slippin' out of the country and in escape mode since you got 'em..
It's time for a gatherup at Gracies and you da man...
Rob...Bob...Grant....Clive...and anyone else that we can attract will probably be there...
It's time we had a drink to our friend George Blackburn also..He would have wanted it so..
It is possible Uncle Willy from the metropolis of Burton,N.B. may also be in attendance,we hope..
I'll leave the timing and the details up to our social co-ordinator,Rob Clarke to finalizre the arrangements and call the parade timing..
This is a casual dress parade and mess dress is optional..

Bob Carriere · #25 22-11-06, 03:29

HI Mike

Nice to hear from you..... the great frozen North is all soft and mushy mud........ you may want to grow rice around the open ares of the museum. Water is has high as springtime in our area.

...and thanks on the pig tail offer....... may have to wait for the pig to warm up next Spring....... I am pretty sure I can blacksmith my own if I can copy from yours.

Hope to see you at Gracie's...

Bob

Hanno Spoelstra · #26 22-11-06, 09:20

Quote:

Originally posted by Bob Carriere
I am so relieved I could go out and burn a Ford......

Sir, could you please refrain from using offending language on this forum?

Gunner · #27 22-11-06, 13:23

Hi Hanno:

e'll let Boobee have his little prejudices... he is planning on borrowing parts from my FORD LAAT to copy for his Chebby!

Mike

RHClarke · #28 22-11-06, 18:48

Quote:

Originally posted by Alex Blair
...
I'll leave the timing and the details up to our social co-ordinator,Rob Clarke to (sic) finalizre the arrangements and call the parade timing..

Alex, et al,

Thanks for the warning. You of course know of Sunray's desire to rub elbows with Ottawa's elite...on a weekend...

I'll post the date and timings once we get Bwana Mike's and Wild Bill's schedules...

Anyone talk to Clive lately (other than online)?????

Geoff Winnington-Ball (RIP) · #29 22-11-06, 19:03

If you leave it until after the New Year, I can do a Thursday, but until then, I've used up all my vacation time...