MLU FORUM  

Go Back   MLU FORUM > GENERAL WW2 TOPICS > WW2 Military History & Equipment

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 09-04-20, 18:28
Douglas Reid Douglas Reid is offline
douglas reid
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Romford, Essex, UK
Posts: 3
Default General Crerar

Can anyone help with details of the markings of Gen. Crerar's Diamond T caravan/command vehicle? I'm looking for placement of Allied stars, bridge weight marking, 1st Canadian Army badge and also the overall colour. Was it overall olive drab or did it have the "Mickey mouse"scheme? Lastly, was this vehicle preserved and, if so, are there any pictures of it?
Many thanks
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 09-04-20, 19:44
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,517
Default

The truck and map trailer were returned to Canada, and was going to be used for post war events. However, apparently the army felt differently, and the truck languished for several years. The box was sold off, and purchased by a tobacco farmer who was going to use it to house seasonal workers.



The van body was found by Bill Gregg in the 70s, and was part of the collection that went to Shilo in the mid 80s. It was married to a softop Diamond T (Bill Gregg's wrecker) and restoration of the box was sent downtown as a major project. This was in the mid to late 90s.By that time, any markings were lost, and the vehicle painted in the usual post war gloss green. Around 2014, a hardtop Diamond T was purchased and brought up from California, which will eventually have the body transferred onto it. The new truck is still a slightly earlier model, but should present better than the soft top example.



I was just starting to install new tires onto the truck last month before this Covid stuff sent us all home. It was to be part of the temporary exhibit at the museum for VE day. Short of an absolute miracle, that will now be delayed.



The map trailer still exists at the Cdn War Museum. There was discussion about a year back about repatriating the two together.



I know there is a decent wartime photo of the overall truck parked in a group at the museum. There are also some close up shots of the back of the truck, but most of it is blocked by the other Generals or visitors. I have also seen a photo or two of the map trailer from the side. I look forward to see what other responses you get on this query.
Attached Thumbnails
xxtruck00000001.jpg  

Last edited by rob love; 10-04-20 at 07:08.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-04-20, 13:44
Jordan Baker's Avatar
Jordan Baker Jordan Baker is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 4,000
Default

Found these pictures of the inside.
Attached Thumbnails
CB6998B1-DE80-4FB3-BB22-2E85D745EA87.jpeg  
__________________
Jordan Baker
RHLI Museum,
Otter LRC
C15A-Wire3, 1944
Willys MB, 1942
10cwt Canadian trailer
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 22-04-20, 00:39
Alex van de Wetering Alex van de Wetering is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Hoofddorp, The Netherlands
Posts: 2,670
Default

Rob, does the truck have a "CH" prefix in the picture you posted?

Alex
__________________
Chevrolet C8 cab 11 FFW
BSA Folding Bicycle
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 22-04-20, 01:00
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,517
Default

I am pretty sure it is. , The current truck it is sitting on has had the CH number put on it's doors. A link to a short article: https://museums.ca/site/reportsandpu...g2020_artefact
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 22-04-20, 11:00
Alex van de Wetering Alex van de Wetering is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Hoofddorp, The Netherlands
Posts: 2,670
Default

Hi Rob,

I always assumed Crerars Caravan was built on a long wheelbase 975 chassis, but given the "CH" prefix and the fact that the census is close to another 969 Wrecker seen in a period picture.....I now wonder if it could have been built on a stretched 969 wrecker chassis in stead(?)

The caravan will no doubt benefit from the new donor Diamond with the closed cab.

By the way.....Jordan, awesome pictures!

Alex
__________________
Chevrolet C8 cab 11 FFW
BSA Folding Bicycle
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 23-04-20, 00:06
Alex van de Wetering Alex van de Wetering is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Hoofddorp, The Netherlands
Posts: 2,670
Default

Here is a picture of Crerar with a Diamond T in the background....what I presume is his caravan with the closed cab and "CH" prefix to the census number.

source: https://beeldbankwo2.nl/nl/beelden/d...rows=1&page=13

Alex
Attached Thumbnails
Holland Jeep Crerar.jpg  
__________________
Chevrolet C8 cab 11 FFW
BSA Folding Bicycle

Last edited by Alex van de Wetering; 24-04-20 at 14:31. Reason: Source added to picture
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 23-04-20, 01:25
David Dunlop David Dunlop is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Posts: 3,384
Default

Hi Alex.

Might not be the same truck.

Note the census number is right under the window, whereas on the photo Rob has in Post 2, it is nearly mid-door.

David
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 24-04-20, 10:43
Alex van de Wetering Alex van de Wetering is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Hoofddorp, The Netherlands
Posts: 2,670
Default

David,

Good point! I missed that......so it's either another truck or it was repainted at some stage(?)
__________________
Chevrolet C8 cab 11 FFW
BSA Folding Bicycle
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 24-04-20, 12:24
Ed Storey Ed Storey is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 1,426
Default Diamond T

Or perhaps the photograph was taken while the General was visiting another unit which is also equipped with Diamond T trucks.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 24-04-20, 13:57
David Dunlop David Dunlop is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Posts: 3,384
Default

You are probably right, Ed. The General is clearly dressed for travel, and when you look at the driver mirror arms on the two photos of the Diamond T’s, the General’s driver has the mirror head set very high, near the top of the door. The one in the second photo is set very low, about one quarter way up from the sill.

David
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 24-04-20, 14:07
Alex van de Wetering Alex van de Wetering is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Hoofddorp, The Netherlands
Posts: 2,670
Default

Attached is another picture of the Diamond T, from Wheels&Tracks magazine no.7, which has an article on the collection of Bill Gregg.

Quote:
Or perhaps the photograph was taken while the General was visiting another unit which is also equipped with Diamond T trucks.
Sorry Ed; that's what I was meaning to say. Possibly a Diamond that has nothing to do with Crerar.

I do wonder if others can comment on the "CH" prefix.....wouldn't CL be more appropriate if the truck was based on a Diamond T975 chassis?
Attached Thumbnails
Diamond Crerar.jpg  
__________________
Chevrolet C8 cab 11 FFW
BSA Folding Bicycle
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 24-04-20, 14:36
Ed Storey Ed Storey is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 1,426
Default General Crerar's Caravan

Judging by the last image posted, it looks like the truck did get a repaint.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 29-04-20, 03:28
lincwel lincwel is offline
Craig W Smith
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: St Catharines, Canada
Posts: 17
Default not Diamond T

Click image for larger version

Name:	001.jpg
Views:	16
Size:	244.8 KB
ID:	113665 This probably ran in his convoy
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 29-04-20, 03:40
lincwel lincwel is offline
Craig W Smith
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: St Catharines, Canada
Posts: 17
Default tac sign

Just noticed tac signs on rear flaps
First army right rear
Left rear seams to have a 9 in circle over white bar
any thoughts?
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 29-04-20, 04:15
Bruce Parker (RIP) Bruce Parker (RIP) is offline
GM Fox I
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW Ontario, Canada
Posts: 2,606
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lincwel View Post
Just noticed tac signs on rear flaps
First army right rear
Left rear seams to have a 9 in circle over white bar
any thoughts?
No circle, just a white 9 on a black rectangle with a white bar. 9 equals top dog and black is for HQ.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 29-04-20, 04:24
lincwel lincwel is offline
Craig W Smith
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: St Catharines, Canada
Posts: 17
Default thanks

Thanks Bruce I thought it was a niner call sign but couldn't see the rectangle. thought it looked like circle. I knew that ADC in pic
Craig
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 30-04-20, 23:28
Michael R. Michael R. is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,154
Default

Crerar caravan interiors by Lt. Smith, 30 April, 1944.
Photo credits LAC Canada.
Sourced by J. Baker, see previous post.
Attached Images
     
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 30-04-20, 23:41
David Dunlop David Dunlop is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Posts: 3,384
Default

That is a great shot in Post #14 of the rear end of the 3-ton CMP component of Crerar’s office vehicle train. You can just make out the left rear quarter of this truck in the group photo posted earlier.

Is it correct this particular 3-Ton CMP never made it back to Canada? Just the Diamond T and Trailer?

Such a unique set of vehicles!

David
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-05-20, 00:24
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,517
Default

I have seen some photos at work where there are several of the 3 tons converted to office/caravan vehicles. It may have well been a semi-standardized conversion.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Crerar and armoured car - color photos Jack Geratic The Armour Forum 3 02-11-19 20:56
A general request. kevinT The Carrier Forum 0 11-09-09 20:06
General Motors Truck Hanno Spoelstra The Softskin Forum 13 20-12-06 11:49
New Govenor General!! Garry Shipton (RIP) The Sergeants' Mess 15 28-09-05 04:36
PhD in General Motors' history David_Hayward (RIP) WW2 Military History & Equipment 6 24-04-04 00:09


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 17:33.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Maple Leaf Up, 2003-2016