Australian orders for CMPs

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Thanks to Shane, and his very courteous copying of papers from the Australian Archives, we have some idea now about the very first Australian CMP orders.

I am working on the papers now, but at this stage it appears that the very first CMPs, namely 30-cwt, and 3-ton MCPs arrived to UK order in December 1940 in the Mid-East. This would be to Demand [contract] S/M 2003 for C30/F30 and 2004/2005 for 4 x 2 Fords and Chevrolets. That said we know that S/M 2002, for F15/C15 trucks were assembled in Alexandria in early January 1941 at the latest. On a quick reading of the papers, the AIF top echelons seemed very anxious that these Canadian War Department trucks were being delivered to the Brits, and not 'us'. The clamour went out for supplies to Australian forces and June 1941 was the earliest stated delivery of such vehicles I believe at this stage. By then the UK, Canada and INDIA had received trucks. It was apparently autumn 1941 before series production could commence based on discussions in March 1941.

I am conjecting again at this stage that the AIF were 'lent' British War Office vehicles in the Mid-East, as were the NZEF and Indian Army and then in due course they were 'sold' by London. There is no indication, in fact it is to the opposite, that the AIF were issued and sold vehicles from British supply immediately. This dsproves my thought that the AIF that left England by December 1940 had British vehicles given to them to take with them. All shipments to the Mid-East were to British account at British expense. On that basis the troops and equipment were sent by ship seperately from any vehicles and that allocation of vehicles in-theatre was handled by representatives in the area. Then eventually the paperwork chased the vehicles and then payments were made in London. I query why vehicles carried WD census numbers even after allocation of Dominion census numbers? The only suggestion that I have is that the census number indicated the original contract demand to which the vehicle was supplied. As some parts lists referred to vehicles supplied to certain S/M contracts, it made ordering parts for what were British spec trucks easier. Otherwise the numbers would have been of no use and could in fact have been misleading.

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

The Australian papers hint that the C15A and F15A were available for Australian contracts by late spring 1941 but the 8-cwt Fords were available from August. However the requirements for 8-cwt vehicles were for 4 x 2 chassis, with no reference to 4 x4. I have to suggest therefore that the papers indicate that the F8 was being discussed and that there was none in respect of the F8A. To date the only customer appears to have been India! That would make the F8A the rarest CMP?

I should add that 6,000 Chevrolet 4 x 4 as supplied to the US Army of 4 x 2 'Standard Chevrolet American models packed to Australian material specifications and complete with the heavy 4,500 lb front axle' were required. I think that explains the mysterious Aussie Chev 3-ton 4 x 2 that we discussed. Ima no expert but that would be a Chevrolet with Maple Leaf-type front axle or a YS with GMC-type front axle.

[Keith Webb]

Just came across this unusual data plate on a F60L Cab 12.

I've never seen one like this on an Australian cab 12 before.

More pics

There is one other S/M 2019 cab 12 F60L S/N 16816 on my database

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

This is the first time that I have ever seen such a plate, and I have the answer! These are EC018Q trucks, to S/M 2019 [Canadian purchase] plus V.4288 which is the British contract with Dagenham to assemble them!
DOMESTIC UK NUMBERS:

L 773980 to 7741532
L 4538694 to 4541693
Plus
L 4713xxx to L 4713xxx E.g. L 4713093
For Middle East

SM 2019 V 4288
Built by April 1941
Included these trucks destroyed in a railway derailment [car on level crossing] in Canada:
2G-14877-F
/14658-F
/14881-F
/14685-F
/14909-F
/15125-F
/14474-F
/14564-F
/15056-F
/14463-F
/15165-F
/14682-F
/15058-F
/14855-F
/15149-F
/14349-F


These were delivered as Lorry 3 ton 4x4 GS
CHASSIS & CAB; BREAKDOWN WRECKER and WORKSHOP
IWM PHOTO KID 1401?

[Keith Webb]

This is interesting - can you please explain "EC018Q"? It doesn't look like a CMP model.
That apart, I assume this particular truck (and the one Hugh Thompson has the data plate for - engine serial 2G43522F) may have come to Australia via the Western Desert campaign.

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Basically, those Canadian Fords that were assembled in Dagenham to British order, both CMP and MCP, carried 'E' for 'England' prefixes to the Canadian FORD Model Number.

The CMPs so designated were:
EC011Q FAT S/M 2020
EC018Q F60L S/M 2019
EC018Q F60L WRECKER S/M 2037
EC011DF F8 S/M 2030

The same prefix designation applied to the diverted French contracts as well [US sourced].

I am certain that the Aussie trucks arrived by way of North Africa, namely by way of issue and then sale to the AIF etc.