Flags - period correct or not

[Dianaa]

When people display a vehicle what's the protocol about flags.

For example during WWII the US national flag "the Stars & Stripes" had a canton with a blue background with 48 stars representing the 48 continental states of the time.


After WWII when Hawaii and Alaska became states, another 2 stars were added to the canton.

So do people do with WWII US vehicles, display them with the WWII 48 star or the current 50 star flag?

My problem is that the period correct flag for my SADF vehicle is associated with apartheid.


So should I us the 1928 flag or the current less politically sensitive one?

[cliff]

This is a bit hard as it depends on two things.

The first is will many people get really upset over the "CORRECT" flag at the time a vehicle was used by the armed forces of ANY country. For example do we use the WW2 German flag with a WW2 German army vehicle or the current German one so we don't upset those folk who got hurt during WW2 by the German Army. I know the swastika is banned in many parts of Europe so am talking mainly of the black Cross(es) etc placed on vehicles and flags.

The Second is how "TRUE" and "AUTHENTIC" you want your vehicle to be. Are you 100% 'every bolt must be exact' or are you 'A close copy is OK'.

Now if your vehicle is restored to 100% original as used by the SADF at the time depicted then the period flag is the way to go, but I'd be sensitive to where and when I publicly displayed the flag itself.

Hope this helps

[Dianaa]

Use of the swastika flag and arm bands on WWII German vehicles is an excellent example, one which I hadn't considered.

I once posted an image of a swastika flag owned by my house mate, the flag was souvenired by his grandfather AFAIK at the liberation of Manthausen-Gosen Concentration camp. Within 24 hours Photobucket had deleted the image even though it was a historical artefact.

The notion of 100% correct restoration is a good basis for the decision. Looks like I use the current flag.

Diana

BTW: People complaining about the German "Iron cross" are a little obsessive because that was the symbol of German forces before and after both of the World Wars, The British Army has not had to change it's symbols after numerous less than righteous episodes, and nor should the regular German symbols be removed for actions of the NAZIs with their separate swastika symbol. (Politics and atrocities aside, you have to admit the SS had great looking uniforms!)

[Little Jo]

Hi Guys

Interesting discussion regarding polical correct. I agree the swastika should not be used as it would offend too many people, but I see nothing wrong with using the "Maltese Cross" which is still used by German Forces on todays vehicles and planes.

I remember reading something a few years ago that the swastika symbol was used by an American Indian Tribe, I think it was the symbol for the "Thunderbird". Maybe our MLU USA members may be able to advise if this is correct.

I recently returned from Malaysia where I observed the swastika still being used in numerous chinese temples. So I guess that Despot Adolf pinched the swastika from other cultures who were using them.

Cheers

Tony

[cliff]

Originally Posted by Little Jo

Hi Guys

I recently returned from Malaysia where I observed the swastika still being used in numerous chinese temples. So I guess that Despot Adolf pinched the swastika from other cultures who were using them.

Cheers

Tony

They did copy the swastika from other cultures Tony.

[Lynn Eades]

The "Swastika" you saw in Malaysia, Was it not a reversed swastika? A medical symbol, I think.
There was a large white building in Singapore in the mid seventies that had a row of red reversed swastika symbols around the top of it. It may still be there.
I cannot recall the details, but I believe the Swastika symbol had a noble/ honourable meaning for a long time before the Nazi's swiped it.

[universalgrl]

The swaztika is the worlds oldest known symbol about 5000 years, it was thought of as a symbol of life, luck etc. It has appeared on almost every continent, both in straight arm and curved arm configurations, facing right or left, at a 45 degree angle or straight up and down in many different cultures inculding asian, hindu still in use, chinese, north american indian and can be seen in old silent westerns, european, middle east inculding jewish and was the symbol of the american 45th infantry division until the earlly 1930's and was dropped for the thunderbird symbol because of the rise of the third reich.
It was the nazi's 12 year use of the swaztika that has become symbolic with death, destruction and the muder of 6 million jews and countless others inculding the mentally ill, members of the glbt community, sexual deviants, thieves, and political dissidants.

[David DeWeese]

I have a Maxim MG08 display gun with this reversed swastika on the top cover. I thought the part might be Chinese..
Thanks, David

edit: Came across this tonight, and the top cover on my MG08 is definately Chinese...
http://www.chinesefirearms.com/CSA%20Maxim.pdf
Sorry if I hi-jacked Dianaa's thread for a minute, but was very interested when the discussion turned to a reversed swastika....

[Phil Waterman]

Hi All

I have always gone with the period flags on my trucks for parades and display, using a vintage 48 star US flag and the 1937 Canadian Ensign. Both draw comment and questions which is the point of showing the vehicles and the flags.

Flag etiquette here in the State has really gotten rather sloppy during my lifetime with people not standing as the colors pass, not taking off their hats etc. (though in the last few years it seems to be coming back). But the WWII generation seems to spot the period flags more often and comment. One bit of flag etiquette that I have never been able to please everyone on is which flag on the right side of the vehicle. Some say US because that's where I am, other say Canadian because that is what the truck represents.

Flags displayed on vehicles in parades don't draw the salute that those carried by a color guard do. But over the years I seen a number of older men snap to attention and salute when they see the Canadian Ensign on the truck.

Picture below was taken at the Patriots Day Parade in Lexington, Massachusetts.

[Little Jo]

Originally Posted by Lynn Eades

The "Swastika" you saw in Malaysia, Was it not a reversed swastika? A medical symbol, I think.
There was a large white building in Singapore in the mid seventies that had a row of red reversed swastika symbols around the top of it. It may still be there.
I cannot recall the details, but I believe the Swastika symbol had a noble/ honourable meaning for a long time before the Nazi's swiped it.

Lynn Roberta

You are both correct. I actually took some photos in the Temple, but do you think I can find them. There is also a building in Georgetown Penang with a band of reversed swastika accross it, I think it was a Chinese medical place. I also saw them on a Chenese swimming pool.

Cheers

Tony

Tony

[lynx42]

Here is an American motor vehicle made in the USA. The KRIT. It was a small automobile manufacturing company (1909-1916) based in Detroit, Michigan.

Its emblem was the Swastika and was taken from a good luck charm of the native American Indian tribe, the Navajo. (It was also used by other tribes as well.)

regards Rick

[Ken Hughes]

Diana,if you use the correct/period flag you could mount a small disclaimer notice to remove you from any political leanings of the flag.
Just a thought and a possible way around the problem.