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  #841  
Old 17-06-18, 07:17
Andrew Rowe Andrew Rowe is offline
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Default Final Drives

I think the designers must have moved onto the Valentine project after this one , and copied what they had done before! Cheers Andrew.
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  #842  
Old 21-06-18, 10:19
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Hi Andrew, yes they are the same principal and also the clutch in the Stuart.
Getting into a bit of nitty gritty with the adapter plate and obviously they need to line up with little to no deviation.
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  #843  
Old 21-06-18, 10:25
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Fortunately the main pieces are round which does make it a lot easier making blanks. I turned up a bearing and hole plug to align the bell housing and the trans box which in theory should be a fool proof method and from what I have measured, it is good to go.
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  #844  
Old 21-06-18, 10:30
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Everything is drilled and tapped and fits together nicely. I have to say that when I laid it over I found out "ITS BLOODY HEAVY" and I haven't got the gears or accessories in it yet. The poor old tank might have a permanent list to starboard.
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  #845  
Old 21-06-18, 15:10
David Dunlop David Dunlop is offline
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Colin.

As a potential driver of these vehicles are you suggesting you may have to start packing on a few more stone?

David
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  #846  
Old 21-06-18, 15:22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colin jones View Post
Hi Andrew, yes they are the same principal and also the clutch in the Stuart.
Same, too, as many motorcycle clutches. I suppose driving a chain by sprocket and a track by sprocket are similar tasks, so I wonder which concept came first?
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  #847  
Old 21-06-18, 21:48
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The multi disc clutch pack is found everywhere, and apart from hydraulic systems is universal in heavy machinery. (I can't think of anything else)
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  #848  
Old 21-06-18, 22:14
David Herbert David Herbert is offline
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..And as clutches in all automatic gearboxes, machine tools, crawler tractors, and as oil immersed brakes in earthmoving plant axles. They were used as oil immersed clutches in WW1 FWD model B trucks too.

David
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  #849  
Old 22-06-18, 04:21
Bruce Parker Bruce Parker is offline
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Silly question, but does the Chev engine turn the right way to ensure you have 4 forward and one reverse gear instead of the other way around?
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  #850  
Old 22-06-18, 04:36
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Bruce that's a very serious question that I have no idea about. I would have thought they'd just be the same but it is something that never even entered my mind. Perhaps the knowledge dept here can answer that one
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  #851  
Old 22-06-18, 08:08
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Colin have you got crank handle dogs on both engines?
Most engines run clockwise as you look at the front pulley.
So if your V.L.T. crank has / had a crank handle and the dog is also the bolt that locates the front pulley and it is a r.h. thread, then your rotation will be the same for both engines.
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  #852  
Old 22-06-18, 10:01
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You would have thought so but....... Each individual engine of the Chrysler Multibank engine rotates anti clockwise but they still use the standard crank dog which would suggest they rotate the other way! Obviously, they simply used the standard dog to hold the damper hub on as you would be hard pushed to turn the engine over on a hand crank.....

I know it is a special case but I thought worth mentioning. It doesn't alter the validity of Lynns point though!
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  #853  
Old 22-06-18, 11:27
David Herbert David Herbert is offline
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I can imagine a small panic for a moment ! However it should be easy enough to look at the power train and work out which way each shaft turns starting with the drive sprockets and working back to the clutch. There would have been no good reason to have the engine turning the wrong way as the bevel gear set could easily have been designed either way round so I expect that they would have used a standard engine. But it is British !

David
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  #854  
Old 22-06-18, 12:41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Parker View Post
Silly question, but does the Chev engine turn the right way to ensure you have 4 forward and one reverse gear instead of the other way around?
I remember when Hyundai (I think) entered touring car racing. They had to use the same front wheel drive/gearbox system as everyone else, and it was only when their newly-developed 2.0 litre race engine was fitted to their brand spankin' new race car that they discovered.... you guessed it.
Bruce - not a silly question at all. Potential to save a lot of heart ache.
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  #855  
Old 23-06-18, 01:18
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During WW2, when Rolls Royce car engineers were working on adapting the Merlin aero engine to use in tanks, they had change the rotation to Clockwise because that is how auto engines were and this entailed making new camshafts. This is not a myth, it came from the RR Historical book on the development of Meteor.
Just looked at the Light Tanks manual and the valve timing diagram for the Meadows (and Rolls on earlier Marks), appear to be clockwise.
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  #856  
Old 23-06-18, 02:32
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Most certainly an interesting factor I'm surprised that the direction of travel isn't a general standard. Anyway, I put the Meadows ring gear along side the Chev and they appear to head the in same direction which looking from the front to the rear is anti clockwise. Interesting point is the Chev starter pushes to the ring gear and the Meadows pulls into the ring gear but the starter is on the same side on both engines.
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  #857  
Old 23-06-18, 11:40
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If they are both belt driven -why not just look at the fans? (My luck one will be a pusher, and the other a puller)

Failing that, put a big wrench on your input shaft and spin the works in the direction that the new engine spins
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  #858  
Old 24-06-18, 10:41
Dave Mills Dave Mills is offline
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Default Vickers (Light Tank) at Puckapunyal

Hello Colin, have been watching your restoration with admiration of your skills. We had a chance to get into the Tank Museum at Pucka with our local car club today. Grabbed a few photos of their Vickers with you in mind, unsure if they are of any use? Our club has a few ex 1st armoured personal, a case of not what you know but who you know to get such a comprehensive tour.

#1 - Spent cartridge case catcher. No way a this can jam or be fowled once you see it.
#2 - Same as #1
#3 - Looking through drivers hatch.
#4 - As above looking at turrent basket.
#5 - operating mechanism for drivers hatch.

More to follow.

Cheers,

Dave.
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Vickers #1.jpg   Vickers #2.jpg   Vickers #3.jpg   Vickers #4.jpg   Vickers #5.jpg  

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Last edited by Dave Mills; 24-06-18 at 12:18.
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  #859  
Old 24-06-18, 10:46
Dave Mills Dave Mills is offline
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Some more.

#1 - Mirror mount
#2 - Rear lights
#3 - Looking through turrent hatches
#4 - Turrent hatch vent lever
#5 - Smoke discharger with trigger wire.
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Vickers #6.jpg   Vickers #7.jpg   Vickers #8.jpg   Vickers #9.jpg   Vickers #10.jpg  

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  #860  
Old 24-06-18, 10:56
Dave Mills Dave Mills is offline
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And more.

#1 - Data Plates
#2 - Front track guard (Thick Rubber)
#3 - Rear tow hook, fitted to both sides.
#4 - Muffler with heat shield.
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Vickers #11.jpg   Vickers #12.jpg   Vickers #13.jpg   Vickers #14.jpg  
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  #861  
Old 24-06-18, 11:01
Dave Mills Dave Mills is offline
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Last lot, hope they assist.

#1 - Side view of rubber track guards
#2 - Side CES storage.

The Museum is now open from 10am to 4pm Tuesday to Friday weekly as well as the third weekend of every month. Entry through the entrance gate security is photo ID and a smile.

I am more than happy to take more photos if you wish just point in the right direction.

Hope these assist.

Cheers,

Dave.
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Vickersn #15.jpg   Vickersn #16.jpg  
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  #862  
Old 26-06-18, 11:23
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Excellent photos Dave. The engine is running the correct way
I have been working on the drive the last few days including making gaskets and bits and peices
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  #863  
Old 26-06-18, 11:29
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I know it's not the right colour for the Chev engine but it would be right for the Meadows so I made a corporate decision. I will be doing a test fit in the next day or two to work out what type of mounts I will make without modifying the hull at all. What ever I make will be bolt on.
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  #864  
Old 26-06-18, 14:51
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Just stunning
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  #865  
Old 01-07-18, 10:59
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Thank you Andy
I put the drive train in today for a test but it failed I just wasn't paying attention. The cross tube cover is in the way so some modification is in order. Lucky it's not a big job but I should have measured it before. Once I modify the sump I can then make the engine mounts.
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  #866  
Old 01-07-18, 11:24
David Herbert David Herbert is offline
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Colin,
Could I suggest that you make the new sump much wider and with as large a capacity as possible. The oil will get much hotter than it would in a truck as the engine will be working much harder and there is almost no air flow around it. If there is a section of sump with no access to the oil pump it doesn't matter as the oil trapped in it will still slowly mix with the oil 'in use' and will still radiate heat. A few fins welded on the outside would help too.

A great thing with the Chevy engine is that the distributor, plugs, starter and fuel pump are on the side you can get to and the carb should be accessable fairly easily.

A great job as always.

David
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  #867  
Old 01-07-18, 12:29
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Hi Colin,
The Chev sump looks like it is from a 4x4 truck shaped to clear the front diff. A normal sump from a 4x2 truck will be the same capacity but equal depth throughout its length and likely not so deep overall. I am sure someone on here could give you the measurement.
Changing the sump would also entail changing the oil pick up to suit.
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  #868  
Old 02-07-18, 03:10
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David, I am fortunate that all the parts that need accessing are on the right side and the carb wont be a problem for access either. I certainly had a plan to increase the area of the sump and therefore the oil volume as well. I have come across a problem which I need some help . After cutting the bottom of the sump I realized that the oil pickup is right where the cross tube is and could not be in a worse possible location. In the photos you can see where the pickup is and it must go right to the bottom of the sump. My question is !
Can I move the pick up?
Can I reduce the depth of the pickup?
If it is reduced what problem could result from that?
Could I just use a flexible pickup and relocate to another lower point?
Could I cut the pickup off and just put a new pipe straight from the pump with a small filter on the end?
Does the pickup need to be vertical?
Could it be external as in a remote style?
How is the pick up secured at the top and does it just unscrew?
This is a bit out of my comfort zone so I need some expert advice.
Richard, it is out of a 4x4 blitz and the oil pickup just changed it from a easy mod to a What do I do
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  #869  
Old 02-07-18, 03:26
Grant Bowker Grant Bowker is offline
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Unless I'm mistaken, the blitz oil pan (and pump) were a taller profile than most civilian cars and trucks using the 216 engine. It may be as simple as changing pump, pan and dipstick as a unit from a donor engine onto your engine. I haven't done this modification so advise confirming my suggestion before accepting it as gospel.

For what it's worth the C8 and modified conventional pattern Chevs used one part number for the oil pan and C8A to C60 used another that is noted in the 1929-1948 Master parts book as being "extra deep pan for 45% grade". Since all blitz are listed as using the same cylinder block, this suggests that the deep and shallow pans probably interchange as long as the pump matches. Unfortunately, I have no idea how much clearance this might gain you.

Perhaps there's a blitz owner out there who has a shallow pan and would like to exchange?

Last edited by Grant Bowker; 02-07-18 at 04:13.
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  #870  
Old 02-07-18, 05:05
David Dunlop David Dunlop is offline
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Colin.

Maybe playing with a little mathematics might solve the problem.

The 216 requires a certain amount of oil in quarts or litres. When the engine is cold, that oil sits in the sump, occupying a certain volume that should be able to be determined in cubic inches or centimetres.

For the normal vehicular installation, the sump shape is determined by any objects it must clear when the engine is mounted in the vehicle. If that results in a portion of the sump being deeper than the rest, typically the pickup would be located in that area.

If I remember correctly, the sump on the Meadows looked very evenly rectangular.

Is it possible for you to determine exactly where the bottom of the 216 block should sit for the power plant assembly to line up correctly for mounting? Then see how much clearance that gives you to mount a simple rectangular sump that will clear what it needs to underneath. Donít forget gaskets. With that dimension, you should be able to calculate capacity for a rectangular sump to see it it will hold the amount of oil the 216 requires. If those numbers come out positively for you, then the next step would be to see if the existing pickup can be shortened, where it is, to fit the new sump, and where to place any drain plug to meet existing requirements.

Not sure if that makes sense, but thought I would put if to you for review.

David
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