No. 19 set CONSULTING WANTED - installation of No 19 set in Staghound Armoured Car

[daninnm]

HELP WANTED – some consulting please on No. 19 wireless connections

I am installing a functional No. 19 set in a Staghound amoured car that is shipping to the Netherlands in a few weeks. Heed some assistance with wiring up the commander and driver’s boxes to the communication junction box just below the radio. I have the wiring diagram for the “U.S. Medium tank M-4” but that is different form the comm boxes in the staghound.
As I see it the COMMANDER is the only phone with the radio box tat controls the No. 19 set controls. The gunner and loader are in the turret but only have commander “Call” buttons of the single box their headset and mic leads come out of. The driver and bow gunner have s single box on the roof of the hull that is fed through the commutator to the Comm Box below the No, 19 set in the turret bustle and it too is a “commander Call” button box with no radio controls.
I have a cable from the Commander’s box that plugs into the radio itself – no problem there – it has a plug on each end and plugs to the radio and the box…… Problem arises where I have ‘free wires’ coming into the Comm Box below the No. 19 set from the TWO ‘Commander Call’ button boxes…. HOW ARE THOSE CONNECTED IN THE COMM BOX and HOW IS THE COMM BOX CONNECTED TO THE RADIO??????
I need some consulting. I AM A Ham raid operator so I can easily understand the circuit diagram for the M-4, but it is totally different set up from the staghound……need a phone call….
Thanks for looking.
Dan in NM
Fyv-5 tew-69 205-syx

[David Dunlop]

Dan.

Have you been in touch with Reg Hodgson in Edmonton? He has the 19-Set installed and running in his Staghound for crew communications when on the road. He probably has all the original information.

Also try Marco in Holland, his knowledge of the Staghound is not to be ignored either.

David

[daninnm]

I'm calling Reg - but don't think he is a radio expert. Hoping to see if here is a am operator knowledgeable.... but I do have a call in to him....

This is what I have traced so far:::::

Studied the wiring diagram for the M-4 US TANK CIRCUIT in the No 19 set wireless book…. see if I am correct. Trying to use that as a basis for the Staghound wiring.
1. The Commander’s box controls the radio though the 12-pin cable that connects from his headphone ox to the radio itself.
2. The “Commander Call” button boxes (owned by the driver and bow gunner) and the two other guys in the turret is connected to
SPEECH – Terminal 2 in the Comm box
12 v+ Terminal 45 in the Comm box
SIGNAL Terminal 4 in the Comm box
MIC + Terminal 3 in the Comm box
MIC - Terminal 4 in the Comm box
Big Question: are the wires in the cable out of the No.1 and No.2 Mk II call boxes all the same color coding? I see six wires and a ground/shield around the entire 6-wire bundle.

On the M-4 diagram there is also a table that shows the wiring color from the headgear cords – is that color scheme follows through from the cords that come out of the boxes……?????
I have a large WHITE and LARGE BLACK
Large Black SIGNAL
Larage White Terminal between SIGNAL and SPEECH
Smaller: Blue GND’ed at box
Green GND Between MIC and EARTH
Red MIC
Yellow SPEECH
Pink between SIGNAL & MIC wires on No. 1 box terminal strip

Am I missing anything?????

[Chris Suslowicz]

On early AFVs there were a limited number of connections through the rotary base junction between hull and turret wiring. The Driver Intercom boxes (Junction, Distribution No 1 and No.2) had to make do with power and ground connections from the hull and the "Speech" (Intercom amplifier output) and "Signal" (buzzer call from J.D.1 to the Commander headset drop-lead).

There will be a cable from Control Unit No.1 (the commander's box) to the turret junction box to carry the Speech and Signal lines (I think) - unless they are passed through the WS19 supply unit on a 6-core cable, in which case the connections are Pin 2 for "Speech" and Pin 5 for "Signal".

The absolute minimum for an AFV is a single control unit No.1 (which must have the fuse removed) and a Junction Distribution No.1 (if required for Driver Intercom). Normally you find Control Unit 1 (Commander + Gunner) and Control Unit 2 (for the Wireless Operator) plus Junction Distribution No.1.

You will need the headsets with the gray "Tannoy" microphones for the Junction Distribution boxes. (They have carbon microphones and a 12V feed to the transformer in the J.D. to provide a high-level output on the "Speech" line.)

I hope this is some help. (I don't have any detail on the M-H armoured car.)

Chris.

[daninnm]

Awesome info.....I may send some pictures and a wiring diagram to see if I am getting it right!!! Thanks a ton!!!!!
I have the Commander Call box located in the hull between the driver and the bow gunner. I kow that is correct and the wiring goes through the commutator to the COMM BOX below the radio shelf.
From there I am connecting the COMMANDER's box to the No. 19 set with the cord that has the big 12-pin connector on it....12-pin on the BOX (I presume the two 12 pin sockets on the COMMANDER's BOX are the same internally and that can plug the cable into each) to 12-pin socket on the radio (lower left corner of the radio looking at it from the front). The other box on opposite side of the turret is for the gunner and veh. captain and it wires to the COMM BOX terminals (1 thru 6) and connects up the 1-6 connections on the driver co-driver cable.
I did not know abut the fuse - I will remove that tomorrow. I will post some photos of the set up and a block diagram I will make up to see if you can discern any problems with my wiring 'ideas'????
thanks!!!!!

[daninnm]

I have attached a DRAWING of my wiring diagram for the No. 19 set…. Comments welcome. I have two questions posed the bottom of the summary:
The system as it is currently wired; see the diagram too.
1. The DRIVER & BOW GUNNER box in the HULL (between them) comes into the turret basket underneath the COMMUTATOR and goes up a cable to the side of the COMM BOX just below the No. 19 RADIO.
2. The GUNNER controls the RADIO from his box with a rotary switch that says A B and A-B etc. and he sits on the RIGHT SIDE OF THE 37mm GUN. His box has TWO 12 pin sockets on it – one of top and one on side…. (I PRESUME THEY ARE parallel sockets and either could connect to the radio???? BIG ???)
3. The GUNNER control box connects via the Big 12-pin cable to the lower left-hand corner of the No. 19 set – Long cable with 12-pin sockets on each end. The socket must COME DOWN FROM THE TOP OF THE RADIO because it will not align with the socket’s notch unless it comes down from the top----cannot go in the bottom of the radio socket (wrong cable? Right cable: both ends are same ‘sense’!) – cable hits the radio tray so will not allow cable plug to go on the socket.
4. The DRIVER – BOW GUNNER box cable (coming up through commutator in turret basket) goes into the COMM BOX from below and is a 6-wire plus ground that attached to the COMM BOX terminals inside the box – no plug on that end.
5. The COMMANDER-LOADER BOX on left side of turret (does not control the radio) connects to the COMM BOX below the radio via a cable with 6-wires and ground. That cable has an Appleton connector into the commander call box and connects to appropriate terminals in the COMM BOX.
6. No other cable runs to the radio EXCEPT for the cable from the RADIO CONTROL BOX on right side of turret near the 37mm gun. The RADIO CONTROL BOX uses a 12-pin to 12-pin connector (see diagram attached)
QUESTIONS:
a. Is there another cable I am missing? COMM BOX to Radio? Or COMM BOX to the RADIO CONTROL BOX (one with the two 12-pin sockets?)
b. Is the notch on the cable I am using to the lower right of the No. 19 set the WRONG cable and I need one with a notch in another position?
c. COMMENTS GREATLY APPRECIATED!!!????

D NM
505-269-2056