#31
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Lang,
To be fair, the AWM were not the originator of the furphy about the shape being for gas decontamination, but made the error of quoting an otherwise reputable source without checking or thinking about it. The origin, as far as I can make out, was as indicated by this post in another MLU thread: "Reference to the design shape is contained in a Mechanisation Board minute featured in Ventham and Fletcher’s Moving the Guns : the Mechanisation of the Royal Artillery, 1854-1939, p81...." And I agree with you: just because an individual is in the employ of the AWM (or any other military oriented museum) does not mean he or she has a sound knowledge of military matters or history. Mike |
#32
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Quote:
Thanks for bringing that source up again, Mike. HTH, Hanno
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Regards, Hanno -------------------------- |
#33
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Reading that link, I would say it is a mis-interpretation by the author. Here I have copied the relevant part:
Quote:
"To permit decontamination, an all metal body to the Chief Superintendent of Design's was fitted, involving an increase of weight of 17cwts" My un-learned view of that line was that they previously had wood in the Chief Superintendent's design of the body, or that the Chief Superintendent of Design has changed the design to get rid of the wood. Note that in the photo of an early Guy Ant on the previous page, the body was made of wood. Wood, being porous, does not lend itself well to decontamination, so they instead changed the design to all metal, which made the bodies heavier. The author of that book, I believe, has made a mistake in his interpretation, and that interpretation has been blindly repeated and accepted for fact. Using the word "thus" in his leap does not make it fact. Last edited by rob love; 30-09-18 at 14:16. |
#34
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Quote:
H.
__________________
Regards, Hanno -------------------------- |
#35
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Further to my last, note the excerpt mentions an increase of weight of 17cwt (roughly 1904 pounds in today's measurement). Sloping the back of a box would reduce weight, not increase it. Changing a wooden box to steel , however, could well increase the weight. Thus , ( ) this supports my reading of the sentence as to mean it was referring to the conversion of the previous wood design over to an all-metal design.
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#36
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Quote:
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#37
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Well done that man!
Well done Rob, I think your interpretation is spot on: a mis-reading of the original intent of the quote.
I cannot say every fact in my books is 100% correct, either (or any technical history book, for that matter): blunders like that by authors are bound to occur, but we all do our best to bring other enthusiasts the fruits of our original research. I did a book review for SMH recently about the Aust WW1 Centennial History, and felt I had to point out a significant error by a well-respected historian, so it can happen to the best researchers/authors as well. Thanks Hanno - my ability with cross linking etc is non-existent! Mike |
#38
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Tail fins or Iconic Design
Hi All
Personally, I think the sloped rear of the Gun Tractor was one of the following reason:
__________________
Phil Waterman `41 C60L Pattern 12 `42 C60S Radio Pattern 13 `45 HUP http://canadianmilitarypattern.com/ New e-mail Philip@canadianmilitarypattern.com |
#39
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Phil,
You didn't add: the designer just wanted to keep generations of vehicle enthusiasts puzzling over/debating the matter!! Mike |
#40
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Quote:
It's funny how you read things. The description for Chev HUW's is that they had steel panels in the rear windows. For years I thought this meant steel panels in the rear door windows which puzzled me as I'd only ever seen glass. Then I figured out what they were talking about. It refers to having steel panels replace the upper rear body plastic windows on HUPs which is 100% correct. Last edited by Bruce Parker (RIP); 30-09-18 at 23:50. |
#41
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Hello guys,
Just a thought from a tank designer’s perspective, the sloping back would have given the gun No1 (the commander who stands out of the top hatch) a good view over the back of the gun tractor and allowed him to see the top of the limber, which may have helped the driver in maneuvering the awkward combination, particularly reversing. In the later Morris gun tractors the roof is squared off. Much better for stowing kit, but the rear view is obscured. |
#42
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I stumbled across this statement today will discussing Morris FAT designs:” while early Quads had the distinctive "beetle-back" shape, from 1944, the final model, the Mark 5, moved away from this characteristic shape as it was realised that it was too readily recognisable from the air, and therefore instantly indicated the position of an artillery unit. The Mark 5 was therefore given a more square body with a canvas-covered cargo space at the rear which made the vehicle resemble an ordinary cargo truck.”
From https://m.ww2db.com/vehicle_spec.php?q=O515 , Has anyone heard of this before
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1941 Chevrolet, Cab 12 CGT, 7A2 body 1944 Ariel W/NG 1944 Scammell Pioneer SV/2S x 2 1955 Austin Champ, 04BF45 |
#43
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Hi Niels
I have not heard that before, but it can be an answer as simple as it is effective. Sometimes we tend to complicate the answers.
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Mariano Paz Buenos Aires, ARGENTINA 1944 Ariel W/NG 1945 FGT FAT |
#44
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Quote:
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Mariano Paz Buenos Aires, ARGENTINA 1944 Ariel W/NG 1945 FGT FAT |
#45
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The real pity is that they all seem to have been exported and few to none remain in Canada.
Also odd that being this late in the war, they used POW cans in the racks instead of the 5 gallon jerry-can. |
#46
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Hi Rob
It is true, that in Canada there is none. Here in Argentina 2 survive in very good running condition and another 10 with many missing, according to my records. Those racks are prepared to mount 3 pow or one Jerrycan. Very well designed.
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Mariano Paz Buenos Aires, ARGENTINA 1944 Ariel W/NG 1945 FGT FAT |
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