Horrific air crash

[Jordan Baker]

Sadly there was a horrific mid air collision today at an airshow in Texas between a P63 King Cobra and a B17. No survivors and 7 killed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5CgCDR_ufU

[maple_leaf_eh]

P-63 not P-36. The FAA registry shows 19 airworthy B-17s in the US. The Commemorative Air Force's website shows 2 B-17s.

The lesson for the military vehicle community is to only take safe vehicles on the public roads, and be mature enough to acknowledge when your pride and joy has deteriorated or has not be maintained to be roadworthy.

[rob love]

Wow, that was quick and definite. Two to 3 seconds from collision to ground impact. At least the crews likely did not suffer.

Appeared as though most of the planes were flying the same direction with the exception of the Cobra. Definitely a lack of control of the airspace.


Sympathy to the families of the crew, as well as the spectators who had to watch that.

[Jordan Baker]

Agreed Rob, most like the B17 crew had no idea and then it was over for them.

In one of the shots the falling B17 just missed another warbird taxing on the runway.

This was a photo I found on Twitter. It’s just so surreal. The red squares are just autofocus points. It reminds me of a scene from the movie Memphis Bell when the one B17 gets sliced in half. Except sadly we know this isn’t a movie.

[Tim Bell]

Originally Posted by rob love

Wow, that was quick and definite. Two to 3 seconds from collision to ground impact. At least the crews likely did not suffer.

Appeared as though most of the planes were flying the same direction with the exception of the Cobra. Definitely a lack of control of the airspace.


Sympathy to the families of the crew, as well as the spectators who had to watch that.

Absolutely, looks like an horrific and tragic accident... sadly I think completely avoidable... no way the Cobra pilot should have been allowed to fly across the traffic stream.

My sincere condolences to the friends and families of the victims.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Very sad indeed! B17 Texas Raiders has been in operation by the CAF since the late 1960's(!)

Originally Posted by rob love

Appeared as though most of the planes were flying the same direction with the exception of the Cobra. Definitely a lack of control of the airspace.

Pierre Olivier said "Maybe we should stop using pre-1945 aircrafts in air shows and preserve them in museums? I keep thinking that all the flying warbirds will crash one day, if they keep being used in air shows."

I think flying them is one thing, using them in air shows in crowded airspace and stunts is another. See this video to see how crowded the airspace is https://fb.watch/gMINd1qX3G/

RIP aircrew

[maple_leaf_eh]

I suspect the P-63 flew into the B-17 completely unaware it was in his path. Banking, power on, speed rising to join a formation, no downward visibility, and another aircraft closing underneath. A lot of attention will be paid to the location of the show line, and the pre-show briefs.

In a very sad way of saying, perhaps it was for the best that the incident aircraft broke apart and all concerned died suddenly. No one for the lawyers to sue.

Vintage aircraft are a complicated subject in US civil aviation circles. Another B-17 operated by the Collings Foundation crashed a few years ago that was mechanically unsafe, it had half a dozen passengers along for an experience flight, and the aircrew weren't talking to each other very well. The pilot really wanted to get flying, and the maintainers weren't going to cross him or each other to say, 'that airplane can't fly on three engines no matter how much we want it to'. But, the public clamours to see them and the owners want to show their airplanes. The FAA can't easily order everything made before XXXX date to be grounded.

[Lang]

Accidents happen, that is life.

Why do people who do not own or fly the aircraft want them grounded and deprive millions from seeing them in their proper environment.

Very rarely do airshow accidents involve public casualties, probably far less a proportion than car race/rally accidents. One member of the public killed in an airshow accident is headline news, five people killed in a car rally accident is on page 5. Are we to ban motor racing?

If the public is not involved it is nobody's business but the willing participants.

An aircraft in a museum is just a dead lump of metal - even collections in hangars and museums have been destroyed by fire.

In the air it is living history

Just on that particular accident. It was not crowded airspace, they were all going in the same direction, well spaced, on a briefed course with very little danger. I have no idea where the P63 was supposed to be but I suspect the fighters may have had a stream of their own joining the bombers in front of the crowd 500 feet higher. Either the B17 was too high or the fighter too low but the bomber was certainly in his blind spot underneath. Human error like 99% of the 200,000 car accidents around the world every day.

Here is a clip showing amateur private pilots not only in formation which is practiced and controlled but everyone doing their own thing landing in crowded conditions far closer and more risky than a flyover - and nobody died.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3o51KWkTpSY

[Lang]

Here is a nicely colourised B17 movie of them at work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tc4bLpU5mf0