19 set vs. SCR 508 antenna mounts mystery...

[Don Dingwall]

All:
I've run into a conundrum while researching installation of 19 sets in the M4A3E8 Shermans we got from the US while in Korea.

Problem is this:
-LdSH, RC Sigs and 25 Brigade diaries mention nothing about switching to 19 sets from US SCR series.
-I stumble across a one line entry in the diary of 191 Workshop for July 7 1951 stating that Lt. So and So and his team have just returned from a week-long visit to LdSH installing 19 sets in all the C Sqn Shermans.
-Problem now is that I only see US style radio aerial bases and antennas even two years later.
-Some photos show clearly a short 2 foot antenna a/la 19 set, but also with several other antennas over 6 feet high.Some tanks have as many as five antennas showing at once.

We did use 300 (later #31 sets) to comm with infantry and arty, but the antenna bases still appear to be US. Can a 19 set be hooked up to the antenna base and wiring of an SCR 508?

In the first attached photo (SF 1668) from May 1951, only days after arrival, it clearly shows the commander using an H16U headset, indicating an SCR 508 radio set up, which makes sense as this would be prior to 19 set installation.
Second photo (SF 4258), in February 1952, shows a short antenna and two long, with what appear to be SCR antenna bases.

Third photo (SF 5491) from November 1952 also has what appear to be SCR and 19 set antennas and bases.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Don

[Bruce MacMillan]

Hi Don,

Here's a paragraph from the "History of the Royal Canadian Corps of Signals" about Canadian comms in Korea.

"Wireless sets most commonly used had been British, U.S. and Canadian origin. For normal brigade communications the workhorse radio of the Second World War, the No. 19 set, had been found reliable as ever, and a No. 52 set link had kept the brigade in touch with the Canadian base in Hiro, Japan. The infantry had found the No. 88 set reliable up to one mile and the American SCR-300 had a maximum range of 10 miles, although both had their individual peculiarities and limitations in hilly country. "C" Squadron, Lord Strathcona's Horse, had found it expedient to exchange the F.M.radio equipment in their American tanks for the No. 19 sets."

Also in that conflict RC Sigs used #1 sets and WS62.

[David Dunlop]

Don.

It would make sense that you are seeing B-Set aerials installed on these Shermans, but not necessarily the 'correct' 19-Set A-Set aerial systems. The B-Set communications between tanks is VERY sensitive to the correct aerial length (which must take into consideration the aerial length and the length of the lead from the set to the base of the aerial. Too long or too short overall and the set it pretty much useless.

The A-Set on the other hand, relies to a great extent on the Variometer being able to tune the A-Set aerial to the optimum resonance and can handle anything from a simple 6 - 8 foot whip to a horizontal aerial over 200 feet in length.

Simply put, there would be no real need to change to the A-Set aerials from the Shermans running US Wireless equipment. What was already in place would work just fine as long as you had a feeder cable to connect between the variometer and the base of the aerial. If it wasn't 'broke' they didn't need to fix it.


David

[Don Dingwall]

Gentlemen:
Thank you for the quick responses.
It so happens that on the very day I get an email MLU post notifying me of your replies, I stumble across two clear wireless diagrams in the war diaries from 1953 of the Straths that confirm your information, and also confirm this set up as described in the summer of 1951. Many thanks. I always like to have more than one source.

Much appreciated.

Don

[Chris Suslowicz]

The sensible approach would be to use the existing US HF aerial bases, since I think they were four bolt fixing while the British bases were either 6-hole or a central tube mount.

The WS19 would fit in the turret bustle on the usual mounting, and the variometer would probably be fixed to the supply unit, with an insulated feeder (possibly coaxial, depending which installation kit was available or what was on hand) to the internal connection for the aerial base.

The "B" set base would have to be fitted specially, by drilling holes in the turret roof.
(Four bolts and a central hole for the coaxial feeder.)

In the photographs:

Photo 1 - the radio headset is _not_ for the WS19, it's either a WS38 Mk.III or WS31 type, and it's possible that the set is mounted on the outside of the turret (judging by the aerial and bottom right that looks like the WS31 variety and the cables going in all directions).

Photo 2 & 3 definitely show Aerial Base No.9 fitted to the turret roof - on the tall mounting (No.2) - for the WS19 'B' set, but the 'A' set aerials are the US type. The "halo" (Protector, Aerial Base No.9) is not fitted to the mounting pillar - maybe trees were not a problem?

Chris.