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#1
04-11-08, 17:18
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M38a1Cdn2, M38A1Cdn3 and M151A2 CFR range
I have often wondered where the CFR cutoffs were for the 3 jeep fleets from the late 60s to mid 70s. I happened on a source for the info, so here it is:
The M38A1Cdn2 (1967/68 model) ran from 67-07700 to 68-08499, which coincides with the production numbers commonly acepted for the Cdn2 of 800 units. The M38A1Cdn3 (1970/71 model) ran from 70-08500 to 71-09095, which would account for a purchase of 596 units. This also matches the figure given in Andrew Iarocci's recent pamphlet on the M38A1 iin Cdn service. Lastly is the M151A2 (1974/possibly 75?) range which runs from 74-09096 until 09860. This only accounts for 764 units, and differs significantly from the 935 quantity given in the M151a2 data summary. If anyone has evidence of a different block of CFR numbers used on the M151s, let me know and I can verify it. I am currently in a position to look up the applicable CFR to serial number, or vice versa I can supply a serial number to go with a CFR in case anyone needs this info for their Jeep restoration. I could take the time to manually write down all 2000 or so numbers, but I may skip the M151s since 98% ended up as scrap. See the things a guy will look up when he gets bored. 
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#2
08-11-08, 04:27
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Quote:
Rob, I could put up a page at RamTank.ca for the M38A1CDNx and this information could be held there. It would save you having to do individual look-ups and may lead to a Canadian registry of the beast. Clive
__________________
Those who live by the sword will be shot by those of us who have progressed. - M38A1, 67-07800, ex LETE
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#3
10-11-08, 00:29
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Quote:
The Serial Number is: 46065 Thanks for your time in advance Scotty
__________________
Gone but never forgotten: Sgt Shane Stachnik, Killed in Action on 3 Sept 2006, Panjwaii Afghanistan Last edited by Scott Bentley; 10-11-08 at 03:27.
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#5
10-11-08, 21:51
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Quote:
It would mean alot to me to be able to give it, its well earned Number when it comes time for paint. Thanks Scotty Last edited by Scott Bentley; 10-11-08 at 22:01.
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#6
27-11-08, 17:58
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Scotty
Your truck was CFR 74-09782. It had the standard ECC of 121401 and the ERN was 30105 which was also standard M151A2. It was aquired on 1 Jan 1974 (likely the contract date for the fleet as all of the mutts show the same date) and the last unit listed for it was ASU Gagetown. It was listed on a VMO for disposal on 27 Aug 86 and was listed as disposed of on the 14 Jan 87. I thought that I had posted this earlier, but the internet here is very dodgy so I guess my response ended up in cyberspace.
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#7
27-11-08, 21:35
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Quote:
Scotty B
__________________
Gone but never forgotten: Sgt Shane Stachnik, Killed in Action on 3 Sept 2006, Panjwaii Afghanistan
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#8
28-11-08, 01:11
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.....apon disposal, it ended up at simpsons truck and tractor parts at five fathom hole, n.b. was then rewelded and sold to a chap at lake utopia, n.b. where it served as a snow plow. then it was sold to a gentleman from grand bay, n.b. where it was used as "outback transportation". when it went forsale the next time, i bought it, and floated it home to maces bay with the intention of restoring it. four years here and off to live with scotty in trenton. this completes the history of this well traveled m151a2.......the littlest hobo of military jeeps, so to speak!
 mike
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#9
28-11-08, 02:43
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Quote:
Sent the $5.00 to DND ATIP and have already had a telephone conversation with them. I am waiting to see what they send. I also did a second request for the service and usage history of my M38A1 67-07800. Don't forget to duck. Clive
__________________
Those who live by the sword will be shot by those of us who have progressed. - M38A1, 67-07800, ex LETE
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#10
28-11-08, 18:50
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Thats great news Clive.
I actually couldn't believe it when I accidently found that the Jeep CFRs were still protected and the data available on a DND website. Should make a lot of future collectors happy when they ask: What unit did my vehicle serve and what would have been it's original number?
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#11
20-12-08, 19:09
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M151 a2 sn
My M151 A2 is CFR 74-09235, sn 44004 uncut
It was used in Calgary 1974- 1985 1 CMBG HQ Sigs Sqn & CFB Calgary 1985 CFB Suffield 1985-1987 CFB Petawawa It still retains its original three patter camouflage. Eric
__________________
Collecting data on the WW2 Canadian jeep and trailer. Serial, WD Numbers etc.
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#12
20-12-08, 21:03
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Quote:
Scotty
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#13
28-12-08, 22:03
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Tom Lodge's CDN3
Rob
My buddy Tom Lodge has an M38A1CDN3 for which he would like to know the correct hood number - if you still have time to research it. The details he has are: NATO Stock no. 2320 21-856-9412 Ordnance stock no 121301 Mfr No MD 99994 Del 12-70 Jeep Corp Toledo Contract No 2MEO 0058 Engine No D143273 The current restored hood no is 70-99994 but this must be wrong? Should it have been 70-08994? Could you also give further details of the book by Iarocci - where it can be obtained. Thanks David Moore Kingston
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#14
28-12-08, 22:26
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Andrew's book on the Canadian Jeep is sold by Servicepub. It is on epay regularly, and I bought my copy at HobbyHouse on Montreal Rd in Ottawa. It does not break down CFR numbers, or 'hood' numbers as you ask.
To find out more, do a $5 Access to Information Request to Department of National Defence. I knew the CFR for my M38A1 CDN3 (70-08876), and some vehicle history thanks to a sympathetic civilian employee at Base Transport in Ottawa. For confirmation, I requested VMO information and maintenance records. The second was a long shot, and not available. My request asked for "Copies of VMO messages for: CFR 70-08876 (Truck 1/4 Ton SMP M38A1 CDN3) Serial number 100xxx, ECC 121301, ERN 30104, previously held by UIC -124 CFB Tonton; acquired 01 Jan 1970, disposed 22 Oct 87, HN 22 Aug 88." In due time a copy of a message form arrived giving my Jeep's last official ties to the CF. There were 7 older and 21 newer Jeeps sold on that message in May '87. A 1967 pattern Jeep would be ECC121201; a 1970 is ECC 121301. Here is a little teaser for you, if the CFR is 08994, then the year will be 1971 not 1970. A vehicle 71-08993 was listed on the same VMO as mine.
__________________
Terry Warner - 74-????? M151A2 - 70-08876 M38A1 - 53-71233 M100CDN trailer Beware! The Green Disease walks among us! Last edited by maple_leaf_eh; 28-12-08 at 22:32.
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#15
29-12-08, 04:16
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Quote:
Scotty B
__________________
Gone but never forgotten: Sgt Shane Stachnik, Killed in Action on 3 Sept 2006, Panjwaii Afghanistan
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#16
29-12-08, 13:39
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Thanks
Thanks, Scotty. Appreciate your help.
David M
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#17
29-12-08, 16:19
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Quote:
The ECC is the standard 121301 = TRUCK,UTILITY,1/4 TON,4X4,M38A1CDN3 The other records indicate that it was disposed at CFB Petawawa on 17 Nov 1986 = DISPOSAL THROUGH VEHICLE FLEET REMARKETING SERVICES. Just a side note. As Rob had noted somewhere on MLU, when it comes to M151A2 and the M38A1CDN3 (maybe others too), the Mfg Ser Numbers and the CFR that they were issued have no alignment whatsoever. An example is that the Serial Number right before his has 66 other CFRs separating the two. Mfr No MD 99993 = CFR 70-08718 Enjoy Scotty
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#18
30-12-08, 14:01
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Tom's Jeep
Many thanks for the info, Scotty, I'll pass it on to the owner.
David
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#19
30-12-08, 17:00
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Between some 12 hour days and the internet being down in the tent for most of the week, I seem to have missed out on the conversation here. One thing I might add to the "Cdn 3 hood number" query, is that hood numbers were more of an American thing, and while they did occasionally end up on the hood with the older Cdn 50s Jeeps, it was very in-frequent that they would be found there on a Cdn2 or a Cdn3. The "as issued" location was beneath the doors, and later not at all once the vehicles got their camoflauge brushed on.
Clive has, I believe, requested the complete CFR/Serial number data for all the Jeep fleets. Currently, the site we use to draw up the CFR/Serial can only be queried by the CFR. Hopefully, once Clive has the data, he will host it on a page somewhere showing both, or else list the data by serial to CFR, and CFR to serial.
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#20
12-03-09, 22:43
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CFR data
Just heard from home and it appears that DND came through with a CD. I have no idea of the scope of the response but I had asked for a list of all reently-released vehicles by serial number and their corresponding CFR numbers. My daughter is going to pack this up and mail to me so that I will have something to do in the evenings.
__________________
Those who live by the sword will be shot by those of us who have progressed. - M38A1, 67-07800, ex LETE
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#21
13-03-09, 19:05
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Well that ahould be $5 well spent Clive. How far back was "recent"? You may well have all the Iltis, 5/4 ton, and the various trailer data as well, including the bulk of the Cdn M100 1/4 ton trailers.
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#22
25-04-09, 05:39
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Finally came home for a week's leave and found the CD which my daughter forgot to mail to me!
It contains 442 pages of vehicle CFR and related VIN, all in a single pdf file. Included 5/4 ton, Deuce-and-a-half, M151, M38A1, M37, Ferret, Iltis, etc..., - even two Sherman tanks! I don't have the time right now to convert this stuff into editable text and then into HTML but this is my intent. Oh joy.  
__________________
Those who live by the sword will be shot by those of us who have progressed. - M38A1, 67-07800, ex LETE
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#23
25-04-09, 18:51
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Wow, 442 pages. Too much for one of your standard pamphlets. Maybe if you reduce the print down to a 2 font and include a free magnifying glass you can get it condensed enough.
How far back does it go? To the M38 and M38A1 Cdn? We will certainly be envied by the USA collectors that we have this data available to us. Welcome back from your Island vacation. If the prosperous side of that island is any indication of how things are, then your side must have been terrible.
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#24
25-04-09, 21:07
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I am on one weeks leave and return to my island paradise on Tuesday. 3 months down, 6 to go. 
__________________
Those who live by the sword will be shot by those of us who have progressed. - M38A1, 67-07800, ex LETE
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#25
26-04-09, 07:12
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Only a week or so for me. Contract end dates seem to be somewhat ambiguous with the company I am with, but a couple days on the end won't make or break me.
I would be in for one of those copies when you get a chance. A national database of the SMPs for Canada is certainly a collectors must have. Now if they only had such records in WW2, imagine all the happy guys on this board.
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#26
26-04-09, 19:02
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I would be very interested in a copy as well
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#27
20-05-09, 01:40
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Hi,
I'm new to this forum, my first post, so please bear with me. I too own a M38A1Cdn2. Here are the specs on it: M38A1Cdn2, Serial number: 7105 96879, CFR 67-07832. I have owned this jeep since November 2005. It was in poor shape when I got it, but it has been rebuilt about 85-90%. I do have some questions.... I would love to know what military unit it was assigned to? Did it ever make it to cyprus like many other jeeps did? Also the engine block heater, on the front top,of the engine head got broke when working on the engine. Does anyone know where I can get a replacement? Thanks Richard
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#28
20-05-09, 02:36
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Hi Richard
I no longer have access to the database, so one of the other guys will have to look it up for you. The best they will find for info is the releasing base before it was sold. Between that and any tac signs on the vehicle, it should be possible to figure out what unit had it. Odds are it was not in Cypress. Is there any sign of it having been painted completely white at one time? When I was in Cypress many years back, there was still evidence of the M38A1s which served there: they had been cut up several times until there was nothing useable left on them. The turks were still using Willys at the time, and I guess we did not want to appear to be favoring one side by providing a source of parts to them. There were no block heaters on the Jeeps. Is the block heater you are talking about one of those types which went in place of a head bolt? Or are you talking about the tap that allows coolant to the heater. My personal preference for a block heater in the Willys has always been the type you spliced into the lower rad hose.
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#29
20-05-09, 04:31
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Quote:
I have one of the spliced Heater Hose Units on my M151A2. What are the chances that it was installed while it was in service? It looks like it is as old as the MUTT. Scotty
__________________
Gone but never forgotten: Sgt Shane Stachnik, Killed in Action on 3 Sept 2006, Panjwaii Afghanistan
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#30
20-05-09, 06:38
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Rob,
The block heater that I'm refering to is one of the ones that screws down into the top of the engine through a headbolt hole. I had to replace the headgasket and all 4 valves. The engine block heater broke as we were trying to unscrew it. but the rest of it came out when we pulled the head off. If the block heater was original to the vehicle as put on by the canadian army, then I want to put another on it. My vehicle compartment heater, which is the type used on a 2 1/2 ton army truck, still works great. I have a brand new,still in the box, spare compartment heater system, a gift from my local army national guard unit, they have been a great help to me. Hopefully some will have info on my jeeps military service history. Richard 1967 M38A1Cdn2 7105 96879 67-07832
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Linear Mode
