Ford flathead V8 faulty distributor points

[Tony Wheeler]

Has anyone ever seen broken springs on distributor points? I've driven old cars all my life and I've never known these springs to fail, but lately I've seen it on three different flatheads. The first example is seen in pic 1, but when I first saw these springs I assumed they had simply rusted away and snapped under their own tension. The second example is seen in pic 2, and I assumed this to be an extremely rare failure which had occurred in service long before I bought the truck, which had not run since the 1960s. The third example is seen in pics 3 & 4, and this occurred today when I went to start my road vehicle, which was running perfectly when I last drove it 3 months ago. It failed to fire at all, so presumably the critical spring broke as soon as I hit the starter button. These motors will run perfectly on one set of points, provided it's the set which fires the plugs. The other set merely increases dwell slightly and can be dispensed with entirely, as Ford did after 1949. Of course, if the dwell set is fitted and the spring breaks in service it will spring back onto the distributor body, as seen in these pics, and if it makes sufficient electrical contact the coil will receive constant current. That would suggest both springs may have broken today, although I can't imagine what would cause them to break at the same time, unless perhaps it's temperature related.

Irrespective of precisely when these springs broke it's clear there's a problem with these particular points, which are NOS replacement parts installed by me last year. I can't recall where I bought them but they're stamped "F. Claudet Ltd England" and I've found an old company poster from the 1950s. It's possible the other two trucks were fitted with the same brand of points, as they have certain distinctive features in common. Certainly they're of the same vintage and they're bound to be English make, because that's all we received in Australia under the old Commonwealth arrangements. In any case I'm now convinced they all failed in service and neither vehicle was repaired. It's a difficult fault to diagnose so perhaps the owners lost interest and gave up. You simply don't suspect the distributor when a motor suddenly stops working, especially if you've recently fitted new points like I had. Besides, no one relishes the idea of working on flathead distributors!

Anyway I'd be interested to know if anyone else has encountered spring failure in distributor points, and if not, why it should occur in these particular points. Of course, it's yet another reason to fit an electronic breaker plate, which I should have done when I first put this truck on the road.

[Private_collector]

Yes, sure have seen that. The distributor I pulled apart had the exact same problem, on both pieces.

Doesn't bother me now. Converted to electronic ignition. No breaker points.

I recall seeing that problem on someone elses old Ford distributor as well.

[jack neville]

Originally Posted by Private_collector

Yes, sure have seen that. The distributor I pulled apart had the exact same problem, on both pieces.

Doesn't bother me now. Converted to electronic ignition. No breaker points.

I recall seeing that problem on someone elses old Ford distributor as well.

What system did you use for the conversion?

[John Mackie]

I would have at least 20 SV V8 disys and at least half of them have broken springs. some use just the spring, others have a copper stripl to carry the point current . Bothh types are poine to this fault.

[Tony Wheeler]

Well, I must confess I'm astounded by this news. In all my life I've never encountered broken points springs until now. For 30 years I drove around happily on points, in BMC 4-cyl motors, Holden red and grey motors, Leyland P76 V8 motors, a Valiant slant 6 motor, and in all those hundreds of thousands of miles, many of them off the beaten track in the Australian outback, it never once occurred to me I should carry spare points! Nor did I ever see broken points springs on any other motor I worked on, including in numerous servos, a Mazda dealership, a Renault/Peugeot dealership, nor any of the numerous vehicle makes my friends drove over the years.

With all these broken flathead points springs in Australia I can only assume we received dodgy English replacement parts after the war. I find it impossible to believe the original flathead points failed during the war, and if they'd failed at the rate we're seeing in this thread, the Allies would have lost the war!

The pommie NOS replacement points which failed on me last week cost around $30 from memory. I notice Macs list two different repro sets, a US made set for $28 and a foreign made set for $20. I bought a set from the Australian distributor recently and they cost $42 with the mark up. I don't know if they were US or foreign made. I bought a condenser last week for $14, which Macs list for $8, and being mistrustful of non-genuine parts I put the meter on it when I got home. Sure enough it was faulty and immediately became airborne. It took me less than a millisecond to dismiss the idea of returning it and trying to explain to the counter lady how a capacitor works and demonstrate with my test meter why this one was faulty. I then tested the 8BA condenser I bought a while back and haven't yet fitted. Fortunately for my state of mind it wasn't faulty.

Quite apart from being pissed of at wasting $30 on crap pommie points and $14 on a junk Chinese condenser, and having my vehicle break down on me, and having to crawl around under it on wet grass with a crook back to remove the distributor, thereby losing the precise ignition timing I spent several hours setting up, I've now lost all faith in reproduction and replacement flathead points and condensers. I vow and declare I'll never waste another red cent on them as long as I draw breath. I consider myself fortunate the points failed at home and not out on the road.

I've now ordered three Pertronix kits from the US for a total of $420 including postage. That's $140 each, compared to $56 for points and condenser, or close to $70 with postage, unless I drive 100 km to pick them up. In other words, break even occurs at the first change of points. Plus I get a free distributor shaft bushing, list price $3.55 at Macs! Of course, if I get a 2% improvement in fuel efficiency it will pay for itself in 5000 km!

However, there's one thing you can't put a price on, and that's never having to crawl under a blitz and pull the distributor off to adjust the points or re-time the motor.

[jack neville]

I've had all my three flatheads on electronic ignition for ages. Set em and forget em.

[Tony Wheeler]

Jack, my ignition points should have been "set and forget" too. They were NOS and the vehicle only does a few hundred miles a year. It's little more than a yard truck. I had a right to expect never to touch the points again in my life.

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by jack neville

I've had all my three flatheads on electronic ignition for ages. Set em and forget em.

Jack, what plug leads are you running? Pertronix stipulate suppression leads with the Ignitor II and Ignitor III kits, however I've been told the copper core leads can even cause problems with the Ignitor I kit.