Early CMP Van? - Car, Heavy Utility, 4x2 (Ford C011DF-F8)

[Steve Guthrie]

Hello there

Here's a photo of a USAAF B-24 D 'somewhere in England'"

It's from the cover of Air Combat 1939.1945 Volume 5 No.1

Is the CMP one of those chassis/cabs fitted with a British Body?

Seems the USAAF had at least one on strength.

Steve

[Keith Webb]

Steve -this looks like the F8 with a body built by Duple (sp?) in England mostly for the RAF



This picture comes from a driver training film.

Don't think any have survived - in Australia we built something similar on the F15 chassis:




Lots more pics of the F8 here

[Steve Guthrie]

Hello there

Ah, yes, that would be it.

The USAAF also had a number of Austin K-2 Amubulances on strength so they must have come by the F8 the same way.

Interesting to see the differences in the Olive Drab paintwork. It would appear the truck has been painted much later than the Liberator.

Steve

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

I believe that the CMP is in fact to Contract S/M 2029:
there were three batches of UK deliveries, and one at least for the Mid-East. See photo from Imperial War Museum KID 2094. These were # 11 and #12 Cabs, with Duple bodies. Also to S/M 2029: DODGE, TRUCK, 8-CWT, PERSONNEL W.D. NUMBERS Z 4613111 – Z 4613593.

The C.8 Personnel in the film has a fictitious census number. but the CGT is to S/M 2028: H 4593648 to H 4594497, the same contract that covered the 2-pounder Anti-tank Portees.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Steve Guthrie
Is the CMP one of those chassis/cabs fitted with a British Body?

Yes, it's Ford's forerunner of Chevrolet's C8 Heavy Utility. Could you get a larger scan of that photo?

Details from Vanderveen's Fighting Vehicles Directory World War II (p.199):
Car, Heavy Utility, 4x2 (Ford C011DF-F8)
V-8-cyl., 95 bhp, 4F1R, wb 101 in, 162x78x78 in, 4032 lb. 9.00-13 tyres. Crew six incl. driver. British built body on 8-cwt CMP chassis. Used mainly by RAF. Rear seats folding to provide cargo space.

Speaking of early CMP vans, what about this "CMP woodie"?!?

[gordon]

Originally posted by Steve Guthrie
The USAAF also had a number of Austin K-2 Amubulances on strength so they must have come by the F8 the same way.

The plane serial number is 1941 ( first numeral is a '1') so it probably ins't that early an image.

The reason they (the USAAF) had K2 ambulances is that they were issued with Dodge 4 x 4 Ambulances which someone realised they wouldn't need (airfields being traditionally sort of flat) so they were swopped with British K2's so the 4 x 4 Dodges could be released for front line work. Later in the war the supply situation was such that there were Dodges to spare, and the USAAF was the traditional home of the Command Car and Carryall which were considered too obviously officer transport for use at the sharp end.

Gordon

[Steve Guthrie]

Hello there

I'd always wondered about why the Yanks had K-2s!

Thanks Gordon!

Here's a little closer view of the truck

[Pete Ashby]

Two other body manufactures also did conversions, Mulliner and Sewart & Ardern, strange that all the early conversions were on Fords but the HUP which was a direct result of this conversion was exclusivly a GM product.

Pete

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

I believe that we have here a Model not C011DF but EC011DF, to Contract V 4699 / S/M 2030. They were assembled in Dagenham and then issued to "various bodybuilders". Because of the "E" for "England" prefix these must have been assembled in Dagenham or Ripple Way, Barking and NOT the CMD at Slough. They were officially chassis-cab units bodied as "Wireless Trucks", G/S etc. S/M 2029 was for Chevrolets "for Egypt and England", and Contract S/M 2031 was for C.15s. A photo of a F8 G/S to S/M 2030 is IWM reference KID 1964. KID 2088 was for a C.8 "for Egypt" with sand tyres by the way.

The Census numbers for the "Utility" versions of the S/M 2030 contract for EC011DF trucks are:

M 1164621 to 1165081
M 1165123 to 1165319
M 1166320 to 1166415

The reference to Model EC011DF is from Ford's Dagenham pictorial listing from 1942, which states that they were Code VOC.

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Hanno, Pearson's Garage in Liverpool built Woodie conversions of CMPs including 4 x 4 chassis postwar. These were based on chassis rebuilt by GM Limited in Southampton, and used Pearson's experience with bus and coach bodybuilding.

[Keith Webb]

Just happened across this interesting picture while looking for something else... One of those F8s in use at a US airfield. What an eye-catcher that would be as a restoration!

http://361fg.com/Main/Enlarge/JamesD/1.htm

Caption: "376th Squadron pilot Lt. James D. Smith poses for the camera on duty shift as Assistant Operations Officer for his unit at Bottisham. Providing localised control of aircraft and usually positioned near an active runway, the high-visibility vehicle is the 361st Fighter Group’s Chevrolet Control Truck."

Source: 361st FG website.

[moderator's note: links edited]

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Keith Webb
Just happened across this interesting picture while looking for something else... One of those F8s in use at a US airfield. What an eye-catcher that would be as a restoration!

Great find, Keith! Yes, it would make a real eye catcher at HMV shows (and a potential money maker, too - imagine the number of people who would actually think it's an icecream van )

H.

[Tony Smith]

Something wrong with my browser, truck came out in Black and White:

[Keith Webb]

Originally posted by Tony Smith
Something wrong with my browser, truck came out in Black and White:

Sort of brown and white?

[gordon]

Look for the odd vehicle on these USAAF photos....





I wonder how many CMP trucks were used in this sort of application. I'll bet the Yanks had problems with RHD and that friendly throttle position.

[Phil Waterman]

Wonder what the story is on the body work? Is that British coach work on a CMP nose and chassie?

[cliff]

Looks like a HUP (heavy personell) body to me rather then special bodywork.

Cheers
Cliff

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

I have given this serious thought as I had mistakenly thought that I had never seen such a truck before! It appeared at first glance to be a C8 HUP, but evidently it is a Ford F8 HUP, # 12 Cab, the bumper only has one leaf support and it has the louvred air intakes. May I suggest British body, and that this is a British -order F8 assembled in Dagenham and bodied in England and subsequently sold under reverse Lend-Lease in 1942-3 to the USAAF?

This was previously acquired under British contract S/M 2030, and assembled under Contract 274/V/4699, 'Car 4 Str 4x2 Utility', and as it was assembled in Dagenham was a Model EC011DF and not as Bart suggested.

[Keith Webb]

It is indeed an F8 and these have appeared here before.



They were bodied by the British firms Mulliner and Steward & Arden and among other things used on airfields for crew transportation.



These images come from a training film called vehicle mastership which I have reviewed on my site.

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

Hanno, this photo and similar ones will appear in a forthcoming book! It is in fact of course a 8-cwt 4 x 2 Chevrolet C8 with Number 12 Cab, rebuilt with new bumper and completely new wooden frame Station Wagon style body with new doors by Pearsons of Liverpool. Note the gloss black painted road tyres replacing the military style, and the lack of a radiator guard. This was sold to the Earl of Strathmore as an ‘estate car’. Lord Strathmore, Scottish peer, was the father of HM Queen Elizabeth, the Queen Mother.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Keith Webb
They were bodied by the British firms Mulliner and Steward & Arden and among other things used on airfields for crew transportation.

For the sake of completeness, here's the scan of the Car, Heavy Utility, 4x2 (Ford C011DF-F8) from Vanderveen.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Rolf S. Ask in VE Day
Best wishes on the 60th anniversary of VE-day.

I'll second that!

"VE-Day crowds near Houses of Parliament, London, England, 8 May 1945.
Credit: National Archives of Canada/DND RCAF PL-43994"


See VAC Year of the Veteran > VE Day for the full picture.

[Keith Webb]

I'll third it! The truck looks like a Ford F8.
Generous of them to supply such a nice large scan isn't it.

Here's one from the Vehicle Mastership film:

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Keith Webb
The truck looks like a Ford F8.

That was my thought, too. A 2 ton bridging plate, RCAF photo credit ... it must be a Car, Heavy Utility, 4x2 (Ford C011DF-F8)!

H.

[T. Metsovitis]

I would like to build a model of this vehicle, namely the Car, Heavy Utility, 4x2 Ford C011DF-F8. I have never found a drawing of it in any scale and all I have to go on are some photographs and its dimensions.







It was based on the 8cwt chassis and the body was built in Britain. My question is this: were the mudguards the same size as the 15cwt?

Fyll

[cliff]

Front mudguards are exactly the same size and shape as the standart truck ones. The rear guards would have the same radious as original but may have been narrower to suit the body.

Cheers
Cliff

[T. Metsovitis]

Ok, great!

Many thanks Cliff.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by T. Metsovitis
I would like to build a model of this vehicle, namely the Car, Heavy Utility, 4x2 Ford C011DF-F8. I have never found a drawing of it in any scale and all I have to go on are some photographs and its dimensions.

If you make a model make sure to add the B-17G plexiglass nose dome!

HTH,
Hanno

[Alex van de Wetering]

Last week I came across another pictures of the F8 with British body:



source: http://www.303rdbg.com/

Alex

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Alex van de Wetering
Last week I came across another pictures of the F8 with British body:

You came across them here: [theads merged, links deleted]

And yes, there are some more to be found in [theads merged, links deleted].

Anyway, well spotted Alex - please find us some more!

H.