MLU FORUM  

Go Back   MLU FORUM > BUY, TRADE or SELL > Auction and Classified Ad Site Heads Up

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-01-19, 16:36
Robin Craig's Avatar
Robin Craig Robin Craig is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Near Kingston, ON, Canada
Posts: 2,153
Default Diesel Snow Mobiles for sale

Not related etc etc

https://www.gcsurplus.ca/mn-eng.cfm?...1&sf=ferm-clos
__________________
Robin Craig

Home of the Maple Leaf Adapter
2 Canadian Mk1 Ferrets
Kawasaki KLR250 CFR 95-10908 ex PPCLI
Canadair CL70 CFR 58-91588
Armstrong MT500 serial CFR 86-78530
Two Canam 250s
Land Rover S3 Commanders Caravan Carawagon 16 GN 07
Trailer Cargo 3/4 T 2WHD 38 GJ 62
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 13-01-19, 02:16
Michael R. Michael R. is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,154
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Craig View Post
Location: Yellowknife, NT
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 13-01-19, 15:12
Robert Bergeron's Avatar
Robert Bergeron Robert Bergeron is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: East Central Canada
Posts: 1,483
Default

Yellowknife is the headquarters for the Northern military region. It is both a dreaded and a highly sought after posting. If you like snowmobiling and ice fishing , well you can do it 6 months straight ! I have friends who were posted there saying it was the best times in their lives. Others, whom i suspect of not enjoying winter have said it is not fun . In summer there are the bugs. I have always enjoyed shorter stints in those more remote Northern areas and enjoyed every minute before going back South. Anyway , a diesel snowmobile ? Who the hell would want that ? Any insight ?
__________________
44 GPW / 44 C-15-A Cab 13 Wireless 5 with 2K1 box X 2 /
44 U.C. No-2 MKII* /
10 Cwt Cdn Brantford Coach & Body trailer X 2 /
94 LSVW
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 13-01-19, 15:50
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,517
Default

A limited production diesel snowmobile in arctic conditions....what could be wrong with that?


I would suggest the snowmobiles themselves are problematic. I can't think of any fleet of machinery that DND has sold (with operating hours only in the double digits) that is only 3 or 4 years old. Mind you, I can think of a couple fleets that should have been sold off after that time period.



I have a friend posted up there. I'll contact him and see what the story is on these machines.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 13-01-19, 18:48
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,517
Default

My own experience in the arctic (as a mechanic....I was up in Alert for a boxtop about 36 years ago, and also up to whitehorse for an ex a few years after that) was just over 20 years ago when the battery I was tasked to went to repulse bay. We brought up a fleet of the Bombardier Alpine snowmobiles. While the locals appreciated the hauling capacity of these machines, they were not in local use. All the machines up there were primarily Yamaha or Kawasaki, which had no problems starting. For the Canadian machines, it required removing the carb at night and bringing it into the tent. In the morning, you warmed it up, quickly re-installed it, and used the pull start to get things going. Forget about the electric start.....that was a fantasy.



As a mechanic, I had brought one of those trigger propane torches along. When they could not get a machine going, I would bring the torch into the tent, warm up the cylinder over the coleman stove, place it in my parka and head out to the machine. By preheating the intake manifold and carb with the propane torch, good results were achieved. The reason for putting the torch on the coleman stove? Propane does not vaporize at -30 and we were way way below those temps.



If you google Dew D900 Snowmobile there seems to be a lot of reading available for them. From DEW:



https://www.dewengineering.com/case-...900-snowmobile




I would think that these diesel machines would be very reliant on glowplugs. The army went to a one fuel concept back in the 90s, which meant diesel. There were exceptions, and this would appear to be an attempt to meet that concept, along with the availability of JP as Robert mentions. . Note the ads for the machines state they were pulled from service in 2017, so most likely they have one season of operation, but possibly up to three.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 13-01-19, 18:54
David Dunlop David Dunlop is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Posts: 3,384
Default

Robert.

It was not that long ago diesel fuel at the local gas station was selling 20 cents or more per litre below regular gasoline, but it is now close to 20 cents above premium gas in some locations.

Perhaps when the diesel snowmobile was first thought of, it was still a cheaper fuel and that factored into the decision to build them as well. But you are right, preheat for ignition at minus 40??? Yikes!!!

David
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 13-01-19, 19:12
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,517
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Dunlop View Post
Robert.

It was not that long ago diesel fuel at the local gas station was selling 20 cents or more per litre below regular gasoline, but it is now close to 20 cents above premium gas in some locations.

Perhaps when the diesel snowmobile was first thought of, it was still a cheaper fuel and that factored into the decision to build them as well. But you are right, preheat for ignition at minus 40??? Yikes!!!

David

I don't think the cost of the fuel is much of a consideration, but rather the logistics (diesel uses a lot less fuel than a gasoline vehicle) and the safety.


A good read on the trials of these machines: http://cradpdf.drdc-rddc.gc.ca/PDFS/...804709_A1b.pdf


It may well be that these machines were used for the trial ex and then disposed of. Canada bought 20 and there are currently 11 listed on CADC.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 13-01-19, 23:15
Tony Smith's Avatar
Tony Smith Tony Smith is offline
No1, Mk 2** (I'm back!)
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Lithgow, NSW, Australia
Posts: 5,042
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob love View Post
While the locals appreciated the hauling capacity of these machines, .........
Over here, the experience of Snowmobiles is quite limited...

Looking at the Dew Engineering brochure, it looks like a towbar-like device on the rear of the snowmobiles that might be capable of attaching a pintle hook. Is this correct? And would they tow a wheeled trailer, or sleds?
Attached Thumbnails
D900-pintle.jpg  
__________________
You can help Keep Mapleleafup Up! See Here how you can help, and why you should!
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 14-01-19, 00:31
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,517
Default

The DND has special purpose built sleds for behind snow machines. When up North, however, the Inuit's qamutiik are much longer so have a greater cargo capacity over the DND ones.



There is mention that the nose of the diesel machines are quite heavy. As such, they are more likely to get stuck in softer snow. My limited arctic experience was that the snow in the arctic is not the same snow we have in the South. The ground ranges from very thin cover of snow with rocks peeking out, and where there are drifts, they are generally quite hard packed.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 14-01-19, 00:46
Bruce Parker (RIP) Bruce Parker (RIP) is offline
GM Fox I
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW Ontario, Canada
Posts: 2,606
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob love View Post
The DND has special purpose built sleds for behind snow machines. When up North, however, the Inuit's qamutiik are much longer so have a greater cargo capacity over the DND ones.



There is mention that the nose of the diesel machines are quite heavy. As such, they are more likely to get stuck in softer snow. My limited arctic experience was that the snow in the arctic is not the same snow we have in the South. The ground ranges from very thin cover of snow with rocks peeking out, and where there are drifts, they are generally quite hard packed.
The Inuit have something like 30 different names for snow depending on its characteristics.

I found that warm snow crunches, cold snow squeaks, but in the arctic really really cold snow chirps. The oddest snow I saw was the layered variety. There would be a blizzard, followed by wind which picked up exposed dirt, blizzard, dirt, blizzard dirt...the end result being snow with the consistency of dense styrofoam but really cool (sorry for the pun) layers of white and chocolate milk brown. Then there was the June snowstorms accompanied with 80 km/hr winds yet the 3/4" long mosquitos could still land on exposed skin, bite and blow away.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 14-01-19, 04:18
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,517
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Parker View Post
The Inuit have something like 30 different names for snow depending on its characteristics.

I found that warm snow crunches, cold snow squeaks, but in the arctic really really cold snow chirps. The oddest snow I saw was the layered variety. There would be a blizzard, followed by wind which picked up exposed dirt, blizzard, dirt, blizzard dirt...the end result being snow with the consistency of dense styrofoam but really cool (sorry for the pun) layers of white and chocolate milk brown. Then there was the June snowstorms accompanied with 80 km/hr winds yet the 3/4" long mosquitos could still land on exposed skin, bite and blow away.

Yes Bruce, things are especially different in the arctic, where you hear the echoes of the ice cracking.


We were in our tent at a new location when one of the Bombers (artillery speak for a Corporal) came in to relate to us something new he had discovered about the arctic. It was extremely cold outside, but he had to relieve himself. That meant removing your arctic snot-mitts, lifting the parka somewhat, and fumbling around blindly with two layers of zippers in order to urinate. Whilst urinating, he realized he could not hear the yellow liquid hitting the ground. "Just another unique anomaly of the arctic" he thought to himself. As he redressed himself, he discovered that one of his arctic mitts, dangling from the dummy strings, was the cause of the lack of noise....he had filled his right mitt.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 14-01-19, 04:35
Bruce Parker (RIP) Bruce Parker (RIP) is offline
GM Fox I
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW Ontario, Canada
Posts: 2,606
Default

Great story. What I found was that the need to pee was well constrained by either the difficulty in getting to it (god damn layers) or the shrivelled size (because of the cold) making it difficult. Contrary to public perception, the stream does survive unfrozen to the ground even at 40 below.

What I did take seriously was the idea that you could walk 20 feet in a blizzard and get turned around and freeze to death. Sometimes putting the garbage out was a life threatening adventure.

For a construction job we were using grease. The blizzard was impregnating it with snow at such a rate that it went pale green and resembled the consistency of cake icing. I think on that job I got both mosquito bites and frostbite.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob love View Post
Yes Bruce, things are especially different in the arctic, where you hear the echoes of the ice cracking.


We were in our tent at a new location when one of the Bombers (artillery speak for a Corporal) came in to relate to us something new he had discovered about the arctic. It was extremely cold outside, but he had to relieve himself. That meant removing your arctic snot-mitts, lifting the parka somewhat, and fumbling around blindly with two layers of zippers in order to urinate. Whilst urinating, he realized he could not hear the yellow liquid hitting the ground. "Just another unique anomaly of the arctic" he thought to himself. As he redressed himself, he discovered that one of his arctic mitts, dangling from the dummy strings, was the cause of the lack of noise....he had filled his right mitt.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wanted: GM Diesel Division brochure Robin Craig For Sale Or Wanted 3 22-01-14 10:25
Lister Diesel Mike Kelly WW2 Military History & Equipment 0 18-05-12 03:05
CMP Diesel Conversions??? BEN-RIPPINGHAM The Softskin Forum 21 16-04-08 16:12
diesel update for C60L hairbear The Restoration Forum 3 21-12-04 10:22
Diesel Repower JD Baillie Post-war Military Vehicles 3 02-07-04 06:25


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 19:03.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Maple Leaf Up, 2003-2016