CMP Diesel Conversions???

BEN-RIPPINGHAM · #1 18-02-08, 11:53

I've decieded that with Fuel rocketing in price here in the uk that its pretty much a pointless exercise throwing money at putting the original V8 motor back in my F60S if i want to make into a useable truck (taking it to france etc).
Therefore its going to be dieselified, but clearly the following are a priority for me with this conversion:
* As little modifying to the original truck it's self
* Needs to be able to cruise at 50+Mph
* As economical and quiet as poss' e.g. no old clunkers!

I've had various suggestions on engine/gearbox combo's that would work from bedford 330s to Toyota Landcruiser Motors? Anyone who has actually done a sucessfull conversion please let me Know.

regards

ben.

malcolm erik bogaert · #2 18-02-08, 12:12

Ben Ive been down this road myself...if you are going to use the truck everyday then yes it makes sense to change the unit however for the odd trip and odd weekend its cheaper to leave well alone as you never get back what youve spent..I spent £4000.00 fitting a Cummins into a Zil 157K and yes it ran well but for all the times I used it..Id have been better spending the 4K on another truck!regards from a very cold North-Northumberland.malcolm

Hanno Spoelstra · #3 18-02-08, 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by BEN-RIPPINGHAM

Anyone who has actually done a sucessfull conversion please let me Know

Ben,

Years back, Brian Kitcher in the UK fitted a Ford 4-cyl (Trader? Don´t know exact type) in his F60S-LAAT. While it was a succesfull conversion, he has since converted it back to Ford V8 (admittedly, a post-war French Flathead).

Have you considered fitting an LPG system?

Cheers,
Hanno

malcolm erik bogaert · #4 18-02-08, 18:27

Ben come to think off it my old mate Tom Bewick up in Aberdeen fitted a 4D into his truck which ran very well...now he has fitted a Ford Cargo Diesel...if you are detirmined to go down this road I can give you his number regards malcolm

#5 19-02-08, 00:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hanno Spoelstra

Years back, Brian Kitcher in the UK fitted a Ford 4-cyl (Trader? Don´t know exact type) in his F60S-LAAT. While it was a succesfull conversion, he has since converted it back to Ford V8 (admittedly, a post-war French Flathead).

Have you considered fitting an LPG system?

Yes he did McSpool and a huge job it was as I recall for the Ford D Series lump. There was an amount of new fabrication needed including the engine sump (oil pan) and I made up a 6V solid state regulator for the instruments.

Whilst it ran well, you needed two pairs of ear defenders in series aiding. . . . . . . . . . .

The French flathead proves to be a far "nicer" engine than the original and reports suggest the increased power and torque to be very apparent.

As for LPG, there is not such a huge advantage here since the UK Govt taxes it almost as heavily as petrol (gas); by law you have to fit an approved pressure tank and very few garages dispense the stuff.

I can say that my friends LR101 goes well on propane and it represents a saving, however, the tank is a fairly huge cylinder and affords surprisingly little mileage, probably a half or even less than that compared to the same volume of petrol.

R.

Barry Churcher · #6 19-02-08, 03:32

Preston Isaac has a diesel in his Bofors truck. It seemed to work real well. You could contact him for info. He is in Devon.
Barry

BEN-RIPPINGHAM · #7 19-02-08, 11:55

thanks for all your replies!

I don't want to modify the existing truck or get involved in loads of expense enginnering a unit to fit this truck.
So i could go with a Simca sumb unit i suppose which would be a good compromise as they are plentyfull, does anyone know if both the engine and gearbox will fit in the space of the original unit????

cheers

ben.

cmperry4 · #8 24-02-08, 22:30

I spoke with a restorer here in Canada who told me he was equipping a C60X he had with a modern diesel engine. Cummings or such, and furnishing the workshop body as a camper van so he could drive it to shows. No idea how far he got with that. Other Canadians here may know who I mean, and may know more about it.

Lang · #9 24-02-08, 23:37

I have seen three CMP's fitted with 6354 Perkins. These are a cheap, readily obtainable engine of 120hp. Standard SAE bell housings which will fit the original CMP gearbox are easily obtainable but a box out of a Bedford, Commer etc that comes with the engine would be better.

Good boost in HP and rev matching to the CMP axle ratios is also good for a few more mph.

BEN-RIPPINGHAM · #10 25-02-08, 10:31

Thanks for that Lang, i think the engine you've mentioned perkins 6354 is the same motor as the perkins phazor which is used in dodge/renault 50s? You can pick up these dodge/renault 50s very cheap so this looks like the way forward. Have you any pics of the trucks you've mentioned so i can see how they've done this engine/box conversion with regards to mounting and coupling to the transfer box?

regards

ben.

Lang · #11 25-02-08, 11:06

Ben,

Sorry but I don't have any images of the conversion or the various owners names. The vehicles I saw were owned by farmers and commercial people, not collectors. There was a C-15A radio van with a Perkins all done up like a motorhome going around Australia a few years back. I don't know what became of that.

Even a P6 which was the forerunner to the 6354 would be OK. You might get one out of an old tractor but I think they were only 100hp. Ford and Leyland made very similar size 120hp diesel engines but I think the Perkins is the pick of the bunch for reliability, parts availability and cost.

I am a bit of a fan of them having one in my first truck when I was 18 back in the 60's - a Commer semi-trailer. You would be laughed off the highway now with 120hp and 45mph. If you don't have a minimum of 400hp dragging a B-Double and able to maintain 60mph on all but the steepest hills you are not in the game. Have also had several 6354's in boats since.

malcolm erik bogaert · #12 26-02-08, 20:53

Ben there is a guy advertising some CMP spares on Milweb at the moment he has a P6 bellhousing for CMP which may be usefull regards malcolm

Hanno Spoelstra · #13 08-03-08, 22:32

Here's a C60L with Perkins diesel engine, might be worthwile for you to check out:
Chevrolet CMP 4X4 WW 2 Truck. Item number: 280205826673

Quote:

Chevrolet CMP 4x4 1942 ?. This Truck Needs Total Restoration ( But Not For The Faint Hearted ) or would be useful for spares . Also it is fitted with a Perkins P6 Diesel Engine. I Do Not Have The Original Petrol Engine.

There is a Old Type Log Book, (V5). Reg No. LPH 302, date of first registration is 1947 when it was sold in Auction after the war. The wheels fitted on the truck at the moment are not the correct ones, The Correct ones are on a pallet shown in the pictures.

As far as i can work out the truck is about 1942.

Please Phone 01264 323629 or mail me if you have any questions. Thanks John.

Please Note. This is Cash On Collection

james walker · #14 12-03-08, 13:11

I met a guy in Alice Springs in 1996 who was working as a mobile diesel mechanic. He had a Chevy Blitz as his workshop with an Isuzu diesel conversion in it. I think it had the Isuzu gear box attatched as well.

Nice vehicle, painted white, complete with winch. no more info to hand.

James

BEN-RIPPINGHAM · #15 12-03-08, 13:54

Well i've narrowed it down to either:

* Perkins 4236 + 5 speed box
* Perkins 6247 + 5 speed box

Both engines were fitted to dodge 50's so are cheap and readily available. I've heard that the 6247 has less torque than the 4236 and has a non-to-reliable pump as well as hard to find parts? So perhaps better off with the slighty less smooth but more relable 4 cylinder (Phazor) 4236 engine.

Any further thoughts folks???

malcolm erik bogaert · #16 12-03-08, 21:47

Ben a few years back I fitted a 4 cylinder perkins(Phaser) from an ex electric board Dodge into a 1956 Volvo Sugga...its still running well !regards malcolm

gjamo · #17 12-03-08, 22:23

Have a look at Nissan's TD42 ,5 speed box and the transfer case from a Patrol or Safari.

BEN-RIPPINGHAM · #18 13-03-08, 16:27

thats reasuring then, looks as though the phasor engine through buying a cheap dodge 50 is the way forward.

Hanno Spoelstra · #19 14-04-08, 23:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hanno Spoelstra

Here's a C60L with Perkins diesel engine, might be worthwile for you to check out:
Chevrolet CMP 4X4 WW 2 Truck. Item number: 280205826673

Sold for £350.00 to "amacck".

H.

sth65pac · #20 16-04-08, 12:13

Ben

Here in good old Oz we have a LOT of 1970's Landcruisers. They have a very suitable diesel engine for CMPS. A history lesson shows that Toyota 'borrowed' many ideas from the Chev in Line 6.

You might consider a 70's Landcruiser engine. I am fairly sure that the bellhousing is the same (surprise, surprise) as a CMP. In fact I know of a member who had a Petrol Landy engine in a C60S, & it was a powerful beasty!

They (landcruisers) were available here in both Diesel and Petrol depending on your taste.
A bit cheaper than a Nissan TD42. So Ben you are on the right track!

Ian

Keith Webb · #21 16-04-08, 12:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by sth65pac

You might consider a 70's Landcruiser engine. I am fairly sure that the bellhousing is the same (surprise, surprise) as a CMP. In fact I know of a member who had a Petrol Landy engine in a C60S, & it was a powerful beasty!

Not only that, but it's available if anyone is interested in a 'powerful' C60S with winch.

Give me a PM for details.

BEN-RIPPINGHAM · #22 16-04-08, 16:12

Thanks Ian,

I've already decieded to go with a perkins phasor/5-speed box straight from a dodge 50 as both cheap and plentyfull just like 70s landcruisers over there in oz by the sounds of it.

After a brief 'measure up' it looks as though this set up will fit straight in place of the original lump and enable me to have a reasonably original and un-butchered truck which is twice as reliable and economical!!!

regards

ben.