MLU FORUM  

Go Back   MLU FORUM > MILITARY VEHICLES > The Softskin Forum

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 20-01-22, 15:48
m606paz m606paz is offline
Mariano Paz
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina
Posts: 603
Default CMP towing chain and wire rope

I need your help! Can tell me the length of the chain a wire section?
Thanks in advance!
Attached Thumbnails
carrier tow cable.jpg  
__________________
Mariano Paz
Buenos Aires, ARGENTINA
1966 M606 Jeep
1957 M100 Trailer
1944 Ariel WNG
1945 FGT FAT

Last edited by m606paz; 20-01-22 at 16:42.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 21-01-22, 15:24
Michael R. Michael R. is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,118
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by m606paz View Post
I need your help! Can tell me the length of the chain a wire section?
Thanks in advance!
I cannot tell you the lengths at the moment, but suggest the fourteen standard links within the chain assembly was issued with Canadian production universal carriers.

Dominion Cable.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 21-01-22, 21:25
Mike Gurr Mike Gurr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 162
Default

I will be at my Carrier tomorrow, if no one else beats me to it I will measure mine.
__________________
Mike Gurr

1944 Matchless G3L
1944 No2 MK2* UC
10 CWT trailer
1944 BSA M20
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 21-01-22, 22:43
m606paz m606paz is offline
Mariano Paz
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina
Posts: 603
Default

Thank you Mike for your help!
Attached Images
 
__________________
Mariano Paz
Buenos Aires, ARGENTINA
1966 M606 Jeep
1957 M100 Trailer
1944 Ariel WNG
1945 FGT FAT
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 22-01-22, 17:18
Michael R. Michael R. is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,118
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by m606paz View Post
Thank you Mike for your help!
The number of small links assists identifying if it was issued for Canadian production universal carriers or CMP series vehicles.
Is the wire rope for u. c.’s a larger diameter ? I believe it is.

.
Attached Images
 
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 22-01-22, 17:49
David Dunlop David Dunlop is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Posts: 3,097
Default

Hi Michael.

I notice another variation in the photos in this thread.

The ‘rope’ end of the chains in the initial photo end with a single heavy duty link. In the photos of the vehicle kit, these ends have an additional, heavy duty circular link added.

Would this be a manufacturers variation, or perhaps reflect what type of vehicle for which the chain was intended?

David
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 22-01-22, 18:16
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,159
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael R. View Post
The number of small links assists identifying if it was issued for Canadian production universal carriers or CMP series vehicles.
Is the wire rope for u. c.’s a larger diameter ? I believe it is.

.

The wire ropes are the same lengths, but the carrier rope is a larger diameter. I have seen some lighter rings and D rings as well, but the part manuals ought to cover if they are the same items or not.

I have examples of the rope for both the carrier and the CMP. I am hoping to be in the shed for a few minutes tomorrow to rescue the snowblower, but no promises.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 22-01-22, 20:06
Mike Gurr Mike Gurr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 162
Default

Hi Mariano, My tow rope/chain is the same as in the picture from Michael R with the large round ring on the end of the chain. From the top of the hook to the far end of the ring is 41", the wire rope from the tip of each eye is 97" and each shackle joining the rope to the chain is 5" long. Hope this helps.
__________________
Mike Gurr

1944 Matchless G3L
1944 No2 MK2* UC
10 CWT trailer
1944 BSA M20
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 23-01-22, 06:54
Michael R. Michael R. is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,118
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Dunlop View Post
Hi Michael.

I notice another variation in the photos in this thread.

The ‘rope’ end of the chains in the initial photo end with a single heavy duty link. In the photos of the vehicle kit, these ends have an additional, heavy duty circular link added.

Would this be a manufacturers variation, or perhaps reflect what type of vehicle for which the chain was intended?

David
Hallo David
I cannot answer your question regards manufacture variation. If you are referring to the image in post #1, I suspect it is post-war modified. It appears sections are missing, and two alternate shape clevis introduced.

The wire rope/clevis/chain/hook assemblies on the universal carrier are found with fourteen (14) small links, and that large ring you perhaps reference? The clevis are straight side “U” shape: unlike the “horseshoe” shape shown in Post #1.

.
Attached Thumbnails
5F43FD4A-3304-4A80-B8B1-B91F8EC1E364.jpg  
Attached Images
 

Last edited by Michael R.; 23-01-22 at 07:00.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 23-01-22, 13:22
m606paz m606paz is offline
Mariano Paz
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina
Posts: 603
Default

Mike
The lengths that you indicate me are of great help, since I can identify some ropes that a surplus dealer has for sale nearby.
According to this seller they are from Carrier T16E2 or CMP.
They are with some wear, but to hang from the bumper, it will be enough.
Thanks again for your help, I'll keep you posted on what I find at this surplus dealer.
Regards
__________________
Mariano Paz
Buenos Aires, ARGENTINA
1966 M606 Jeep
1957 M100 Trailer
1944 Ariel WNG
1945 FGT FAT
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 23-01-22, 19:10
Mike Gurr Mike Gurr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 162
Default

How I wish we still had surplus dealers where we could find this sort of stuff!!
__________________
Mike Gurr

1944 Matchless G3L
1944 No2 MK2* UC
10 CWT trailer
1944 BSA M20
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 23-01-22, 21:33
Lynn Eades's Avatar
Lynn Eades Lynn Eades is offline
Bluebell
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tauranga, New Zealand
Posts: 5,380
Default

I agree with Michael R's statement that Mariano's tow rope (first post) shows a post war assembly based on the shackles. I don't think the British military were issued with what I believe are called "Bow" shackles, rather they were issued with "D" shackles. Also the "D" shackles used were likely rated at 2.0 ton swl or 40 Cwt. swl.(also 2 ton) This would imply to me that it was originally issued as a tow rope for a wheeled vehicle as the load rating of the shackles would require both hooks to be connected to the carrier to extract it (4 tons of carrier equals 2 x 2 ton shackles in parallel for a 4 ton pull. Bellied in mud with suction would require double this!) The wire rope is well capable while the hooks, chain and shackles are the weak parts.
In the photo, the two hooks have "D" shackles rated at 2 ton. The center Bow shackle is 3.5 ton rating (high tensile) Generally speaking "D" shackles are not high tensile, while Bow shackles are.
Attached Thumbnails
2022-01-24 09.07.19.jpg  
__________________
Bluebell

Carrier Armoured O.P. No1 Mk3 W. T84991
Carrier Bren No2.Mk.I. NewZealand Railways. NZR.6.
Dodge WC55. 37mm Gun Motor Carriage M6
Jeep Mb #135668
So many questions....
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 28-01-22, 16:48
m606paz m606paz is offline
Mariano Paz
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina
Posts: 603
Default

Many thanks for your helps! This the tow parts i found
Attached Thumbnails
IMG-20220128-WA0038.jpg  
__________________
Mariano Paz
Buenos Aires, ARGENTINA
1966 M606 Jeep
1957 M100 Trailer
1944 Ariel WNG
1945 FGT FAT
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 28-01-22, 18:38
Mike Gurr Mike Gurr is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Surrey, United Kingdom
Posts: 162
Default

Great find Mariano
__________________
Mike Gurr

1944 Matchless G3L
1944 No2 MK2* UC
10 CWT trailer
1944 BSA M20
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 28-01-22, 22:44
m606paz m606paz is offline
Mariano Paz
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina
Posts: 603
Default

Hi Mike
There wasn't much to choose from... and it matches the measurements you gave me.
Attached Thumbnails
IMG-20220128-WA0036.jpg  
__________________
Mariano Paz
Buenos Aires, ARGENTINA
1966 M606 Jeep
1957 M100 Trailer
1944 Ariel WNG
1945 FGT FAT
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 29-01-22, 14:27
m606paz m606paz is offline
Mariano Paz
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina
Posts: 603
Default

Hook marking X-1142-2
DC 1944
Attached Thumbnails
20220129_102044.jpg   20220129_102033.jpg   20220129_102023.jpg  
__________________
Mariano Paz
Buenos Aires, ARGENTINA
1966 M606 Jeep
1957 M100 Trailer
1944 Ariel WNG
1945 FGT FAT
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 29-01-22, 14:37
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,159
Default

The elusive X1142-2 hooks are one of the harder parts to find., I believe they were also used on the end of the winch cable for the FAT.... I have found examples there.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 29-01-22, 15:40
Bruce Parker Bruce Parker is offline
GM Fox I
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW Ontario, Canada
Posts: 2,496
Default

The correct U shackles are the hard part to find for me. Need four...

And while we're on the topic, did these assemblies come in two sizes? I have an all correct one as illustrated and if I try to stow it on the rear of my carrier it's almost impossible to wind and secure on the original brackets. The single web strap is woefully insufficient and would break very quickly. Was there a smaller, lighter cable?
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 29-01-22, 17:02
m606paz m606paz is offline
Mariano Paz
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Buenos Aires,Argentina
Posts: 603
Default

Install on Bumper
Attached Thumbnails
20220129_125849.jpg  
__________________
Mariano Paz
Buenos Aires, ARGENTINA
1966 M606 Jeep
1957 M100 Trailer
1944 Ariel WNG
1945 FGT FAT
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 29-01-22, 17:03
Grant Bowker Grant Bowker is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 2,145
Default Information from parts books

From the Chevrolet parts book No. 175 that covers the range of Chevrolet CMT trucks from C8 to C60L and CGT, Tow rope assembly 1798795 (DND #1136) 3/8" diamenter was originally supplied for C8 and C15. Tow rope assembly 5802867 1/2" diameter was later supplied for C8, C15 and C15A and tow rope assembly 1798796 (DND #1135) 5/8" diameter was supplied for C30, C60S, C60l and CGT. no lengths are given.
From parts book C15A-04 for the Chevrolet 15cwt 4x4 - the tow rope 5802867 is stated to be 1/2" cable (no length stated) and the later hooks are part DND#1185 (they also have a Chevrolet part # 5268915).
From parts book C60S-03 for the Chevrolet 3 ton 143"WB the tow rope assembly 1798796 is stated to be 5/8" cable - no length given. Same hooks used as on C15A.
From parts book CGT-03 for the Chevrolet Gun Tractor the tow rope assembly is the same as for the C60S.
From parts book C60X-04 for the Chevrolet 3 ton 6x6 the tow rope assembly is the same as for the C60S.
From the Ford parts book S.E.-39-42 which covers the full range of Ford CMP trucks 8cwt to 60cwt and FGT - tow ropes C011D-17186A and C011D-17186B are 3/8" diameter, unspecified length - used on F8, F15 and F15A. Tow Rope C01Q-17186 is 5/8 diameter, used on F30, F60S, F60L, F60H and FGT, no length given.
From parts book FSC2-01 for the Ford lynx II Scout Car the steel tow rope C011D-17186B is stated 15' long, no diameter given.
From the parts book FUC-02 for the Universal Carrier Mk I* the tow rope assembly has part number C01Q-17187 (U.K. #25485) but no diameter or length is given.
Conclusion:The Ford tow rope assembly C011D-17186B uses 3/8" diameter cable and is 15' long for 8 and 15 cwt trucks. Confirmed by parts book F15A-01.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 29-01-22, 17:05
rob love rob love is offline
carrier mech
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Shilo MB, the armpit of Canada
Posts: 7,159
Default

The carrier used the heavier cable. The cmps had a lighter cable. I believe the chain rings and D rings were also smaller for the CMP.
Ribtors (now closed) in Calgary had a pallet of the chainends for the carriers, although there were a few smaller ones in the mix. They also had a pile of the D rings form that era, again a bit smaller than the ones on my carrier cables. And they had lots and lots of the smaller diameter tow cables. Same length as the carrier, but smaller diameter.
My carrier cables came from Brian Asbury. Pretty sure he would have had the part number on some of the examples.



I have picked up some of the hooks in the strangest of places. Besides the surplus yard, I have found them at farm auctions and garage sales. But they are one of those items you can never find enough of.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Chain tensioner tool m606paz The Softskin Forum 0 25-03-21 03:05
For Sale: 1/2 ton chain fall Perry Kitson For Sale Or Wanted 0 25-02-16 01:38
Wanted: carrier tow chain assy. Lynn Eades For Sale Or Wanted 0 13-02-16 21:54
For Sale: One ton chain hoist peter simundson For Sale Or Wanted 0 15-09-15 21:29
Carrier tow chain and wire assembly andrew honychurch The Carrier Forum 4 17-06-12 08:51


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 07:21.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Maple Leaf Up, 2003-2016