LPG fuel around the world...

[David_Hayward (RIP)]

We have an increasing number of LPG stations here. However sometimes buyers are put off by the rigmarole of fueling. We also have/had CNG or Compressed Natural Gas used by local buses. This is just ordinary gas from the network compressed and stored in a vehicle tank. LPG is taxed much lower than petrol or diesel but has less calorific value so a car that does say 35 miles per gallon (Imperial) may just do 20 or so. Of course you also need petrol to start the engine, although combuned the range increases dramatically as you can switch from on fuel to the other on the road.

Regrettably all gas-tank equipped vehicles are banned from the Channel Tunnel so that means going by ferry. However gas-powereds are I think exempt from the London Congestion Charge.

Our local Supermarket has just started offering Biodiesel which is good news.

[rob love]

The Cdn Department of national Defense tried using it in the 80s, and it was finally dropped as the overall cost of the project was exorbitant, and the reliability in our cold climate was poor. I used to have to go recover cars which a pilot would park for 2 hours while he took a flight, and we would finally have to tow them indoors and leave them to get them to start. Temps were in the -25 range, but that is the fact of life here on the prairies.

While the fuel is basically a salvage from the refining processes, it did not take long for the cost of that fuel to reach, and even exceed, gasoline.

[Phil Waterman]

Don't know about the rest of the world but I suspect that LPG may become the only practical answer for antique cars in the US. Though I can find no documentation for it I suspect that gasoline in the US is moving toward a blend that will only work with fuel injection. There have been a number of attempts over the years to get all the old POLUTING cars off the road, regulatory attempts such as requiring all vehicles (regardless of age) to pass the pollution test etc.

If you think that they would just change the blend so that it will not work in a carburetor just think about. The change the blend taking out lead as a valve lubricant, started adding alcohol to the point where it will eat fuel system rubber parts, change the characteristic so that gas burns hotter. All of these things have been done without care for the effect on antique cars.

I was going to ask what the outcome of the Canadian Military experiment was, so thanks Rob for that information. Rob do you know of any detail information about that effort that is available to the public.

So looking at LPG as an alternative is very logical. At one point Toyota had a LPG system for their industrial engines similar to the Chevy 6, so I think there are alternatives the question is going to be matching the RPM and Torque Curves along with the CFM flows.

[Phil Waterman]

Question- How far can you go on one of the barbecue tanks?

[rob love]

You'll have to change the BBQ tank from pounds to gallons. The LPG generally got about 5% to 10% less mileage than gasoline, with the exception of the Ford inline 6, which got terrible results.

I don't have any data re the total cost to the forces, but it is regarded as an expensive failed experiment. I have seen some total cost of it all somewhere, but don't recall where.

[Mike K]

LPG has taken off in a big way here .... it came into use around 20 or more years ago. Most of the older Fords like Howard has .. Falcons and LTD's , F100's and so on, are on LPG . I think You can even buy brand new Falcons already converted at the factory .

A friend here has a F100 on LPG , it is an old backyard conversion thats really on the margin of being safe. The car always smells of gas .. it's very strong and I hate getting in it... you wouldnt be a smoker and be safe !

The LPG auto gas bottles by law , have to have a 10 year check , they are date stamped . There have been nasty cases of cars exploding , so they updated the laws and you need 2 cutoff relays now .. one each end of the feed pipe from the tank. The stuff is a by-product of the refineries .. so i've been told.

[cletrac (RIP)]

We had a 1988 Dodge V8 pickup that ran on propane and it got 20% less mileage than on gas. You couldn't always count on being able to buy propane when you needed it and if you ran out you couldn't get a can and dump it in the tank. We tried the BBQ bottle but couldn't get the liquid to flow into the tank. I hooked a tiger torch onto the bottle then removed the torch from the hose and poked the hose into the aircleaner. I regulated the gas flow with the bottle tap and we made it to town for more. All in all it was more of a pain in the ass than it was worth so we threw it in the junk and went back to gasoline.