Aussie Sentinel tanks

[Ryan]

Have a look here luke, I've already started the hunt:

http://www.mapleleafup.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=11517


Maybe a mod needs to merg these threads now.

[Luke R]

Originally Posted by Ryan

Maybe a mod needs to merg these threads now.

Good idea.

[Mike Cecil]

Gents,

The AC3 at the AWM is the original and ONLY wartime AC3 produced: John's was cobbled together several years ago from a few original parts (and lots of other bits and bobs).

The original and only AC3 was gifted to the RAACA Association (NSW Branch) by the then-Director of Armour in the early 1960s and mounted on a plinth on a small hill overlooking Canberra near Duntroon (can't remember the hills name). When that area was redevloped, it was transferred to the AWM, where it stayed on outside display for some years until moved to the Mitchell storage annex. Here it was carefully opened (it had been welded shut in the early 1960s) to reveal very intact and nearly complete internals. It is equipped with a Perrier-Cadillac triple V8.

The most original and complete AC1 is that at the RAC Tank Museum at Bovington.

Mike C

[Ryan]

Hi Mike,
Thanks for the info. We should tell the poms to give us our AC1 back then.
Hopefully the AC3 at the AWM will be on display one day. That Perrier-Cadillac triple V8 would be lovely to see.
As in regards to the x-Belfield AC3, do we have any details on it? It looked to be an original hull. Was the turret original? From memory I don't think it had an engine. And I don't think the gun was original. Still, I like to think of it as an AC3.
Ryan

[JackM]

Originally Posted by Mike Cecil

The original and only AC3 was gifted to the RAACA Association (NSW Branch) by the then-Director of Armour in the early 1960s and mounted on a plinth on a small hill overlooking Canberra near Duntroon (can't remember the hills name).

Mike C

Mike,

Mt Pleasant - as you say, it's on the Duntroon perimeter. I remember seeing it there, when I was at RMC in the early 80s.

Jack

[Mike Cecil]

Thanks Jack: of course .....Mt Pleasant! Fancy me forgetting that : now the site of the National RAA Memorial, me thinks.

Mike C

[Mike Cecil]

Hi Matt,

Oberon warming up yet after the winter chill???

The AC1 plate: number should be in the range 8001 to 8065 (but it sure does look like a '7', I agree!). The AC3 was 8066.

The Bellfield AC3 was built on one of the many AC3 hulls cast for the project, but never used. Most were scrapped. John recovered his from the Holsworthy Range where it had been used for anti-armour training. As a consequence, a whole lower side panel had to be replaced: no mean effort on a cast tank hull!

As a consequence (of the hull never actually having been built as a 'tank'), I'm not sure I would include it in the list of 'survivors'.

Mike C

[Ryan]

8072?? even though the 8 looks like a 3. Or is the 7 an upside down 4?...with a bit missing.

[Luke R]

Originally Posted by Mike Cecil

The Bellfield AC3 was built on one of the many AC3 hulls cast for the project, but never used. Most were scrapped. John recovered his from the Holsworthy Range where it had been used for anti-armour training. As a consequence, a whole lower side panel had to be replaced: no mean effort on a cast tank hull!

As a consequence (of the hull never actually having been built as a 'tank'), I'm not sure I would include it in the list of 'survivors'.

Mike C

I disagree Mike,
It would be one thing if John made a replica hull or modified the hull of a AC1 to look like the AC3, but it still was cast a AC3 hull during the 40's like every other AC hull.
Its like if i built a Spitfire out of NOS.
Is it a Spitfire? yes
Did it serve or have any history? no

Luke

[rmgill]

Hey lads, Coldsteel over at Tank-net says:

The Serial number is usually stamped into each of the three major armour castings. On the top of the Axel Housing at the centre just forward of the join to the hull. On the left hand side of the hull just above the hull-gunner's view port. On the left hand side of the turret just above the armoured cover for the spotlight power lead penetration. It's likely to be of the form:

A.C.I. NO. 8030.
HULL. NO. B.K.H. 38.
A.H. NO. B.K.A.H. 31.
TURRET. NO. B.K.T 35.

The ex-Belfield AC1 no in the US at the MVTF probably has a mismatched turret and the only photos online aren't clear enough to be sure but there appear to be markings on the hull and turret with the hull possibly reading:

ACI 800#
NOT AHT TURRET

Which might indicate it was fitted with a turret that was suitable for training only. The armour of the first dozen or so tanks didn't go through the full heat treatment process. Although it is very faint and might be something else.

[Ryan]

Reading Peter Beale's book 'Fallen Sentinel', which is about Australian tanks during WW2. It is stated during the May 1943 review of Australian production that, ' in regards to the AC3, 200 were on order, 146 hulls and 106 turrets had been cast'.

[Ian Fawbert]

Hi Ryan,

I doubt the one Matt posted is the same one i know of/know the guy who has one. So, add another to your list in NSW! As to what type it is, i am not sure, nor have i seen the guy again since first posting- but am sure to run into him one day!

Cheers,
Ian.

[Ryan]

Hi Ian, thank you. Chances are it is the remains of an AC1.

So we have 8 then.
AC1 in the UK
AC1 in the USA
AC1 at Puka
AC3 at AWM
2 x AC1 in NSW private hands
AC3 in QLD private hands
E2 hull in VIC private hands

[Ryan]

I went to a property today that has the cut down remains of a Sentinel.
Nothing above the tracks, no original engines and shortened. But it is a sentinel. Owner will remain anonymous. I believe it is no 8028.

[ron]

I asked this question some time ago but it seems it was to minor to answer

[matilda IIA]

Actualy they are just near the drivers perescope !
, Pitty to see that ARV standing in the weather, it was a bloody good vehicle....I guess sometimes you can have to much money.
Kind regards

[Mike Cecil]

Is that the ex-JB 'AC3' and Cent ARV in that image??

That is, I seem to remember, 169111: ex-SVN, had a really good history. Not nice to see it 'weathering'.....

Matt: I thought the AC tanks had the hull number stamped on the left side of the hull, on the vertical face of that little 'hump' in the hull adjacent to the drivers/hull gunners positions. Hull number = registration number, with tank type/mark as well, such as 'AC1 8042', or similar.

Mike C