Mystery "Carrier" drive hub

[Tony Smith]

Originally posted by Bob Moseley
Tim Tam - apart from the scripting, it appears to be similar to the mystery hub that Ian had and you photographed. Can you shed any further light?

Bob

At the Swap meet at Corowa, Bob and I were discussing the merits of this cast Hub/Brake Drum that was for sale. Australian LP1/LP2/LP2A Carriers use a standard Ford Truck rear axle hub with 5 wheel studs. The Axle uses the normal 1940 brake drum with a special "Wheel Disc" to mount the drive sprocket.
This piece is marked "Part No 533B 1941", and we were at a loss to ID it. At first glance, it might appear to be a different method to mount a drive sprocket to a Ford Truck Axle hub (which in fact is what it was removed from) on a carrier. The number 533B could be in the range of Aust carrier numbers, and is not used in the published parts lists. Of course, LP1 production had already commenced in 1940, so this could not be said to be a part from the development stage.

[Tony Smith]

This pic shows the form of standard brake drum and drive sprocket that was adopted in production. It would no doubt be lighter than the one piece casting.

[Tony Smith]

The cast drum has some similar features to the production drum.
The overall diameter is 18", with the lip on the flange for the drive sprocket being 16". The drive sprocket is mounted with 18 bolts.

[Tony Smith]

Despite the similarities, there are some differences that mean this drum is not a direct replacement.

The offset distance from the mounting face of the brake drum on the truck hub to the mounting face of the drive sprocket is 2 1/2", much more than that on the production set up. If this hub were used on an LP1/LP2, the drive sprocket would not be centred in the track, but would be meshed with the outer edge of the track.

[Tony Smith]

Still no-one recognise this hub? How about Oxford, Loyd, Windsor, Vicker Light Tank? Some Farm implement?

ANYTHING????

[Lynn Eades]

What hub does the carrier with the offset engine and two speed diff use?
Wasn't there an Aust. half track experimental?
It would be too early for Oxford and Windsor, woundn't it?

[Tony Smith]

Lynn, the "Carrier with the offset engine" you refer to is either/both the Aust 3"Mortar carrier and the 2pdr carrier, bothof which use the standard LP2/2A rear diff.
The Tracked Truck (a kind of utility carrier) Used the type of wheel shown in this thread, where you can aslo see the Aust Half-track version.

[Tony Smith]

Bob Dimer of WA has contacted me to suggest the drum/sprocket is from a Loyd Carrier. Pic of Loyd wheels attached, all agree?

[Tony Smith]

It's definately not an LP2/2A hub:

[Richard Farrant]

Originally posted by Tony Smith
Still no-one recognise this hub? How about Oxford, Loyd, Windsor, Vicker Light Tank? Some Farm implement?

ANYTHING????

Tony,

Not Vickers Light Tank, just checked out the manual.

[Alex Blair (RIP)]

Originally posted by Richard Farrant
Tony,

Not Vickers Light Tank, just checked out the manual.

Tony...
Not off a T-16,Oxford carrier or Half track either..
Checked the manuals also..

[Pedr]

Tony

I Agree...definately Loyd Carrier to me.

Pedr

[Pedr]

I am now wondering if the front and rear are the same rim?
Anyone...Stefan / Dirk, Pascal?

Pedr

Pic one is Dirks drive hub
Pic two is Loyd in NZ

Both pics from this place.

[Stefan Leegwater]

Yes, front and rear are the same as are the sprockets,

Cheers,

Stefan

[ajmac]

100% a Loyd carrier drum. Wow, I wish they popped up at sales in the UK, I need one more for a full undamaged set! 2007, now that is an old post to resurrect

[Peter Walsh]

Just had a quick look through a couple of books, "Fallen Sentinel" and "The Vital Factor", and they mention that the Loyd Slave Battery Carriers were used in the armoured regiments, one per squadron. I assume that means there were more than 30 of them in Australia. Were they the only Loyds used in Australia and what happened to them i.e were they sold off like the LP2a's?

Curious,

Peter

[kevin powles]

Originally Posted by Tony Smith

At the Swap meet at Corowa, Bob and I were discussing the merits of this cast Hub/Brake Drum that was for sale. Australian LP1/LP2/LP2A Carriers use a standard Ford Truck rear axle hub with 5 wheel studs. The Axle uses the normal 1940 brake drum with a special "Wheel Disc" to mount the drive sprocket.
This piece is marked "Part No 533B 1941", and we were at a loss to ID it. At first glance, it might appear to be a different method to mount a drive sprocket to a Ford Truck Axle hub (which in fact is what it was removed from) on a carrier. The number 533B could be in the range of Aust carrier numbers, and is not used in the published parts lists. Of course, LP1 production had already commenced in 1940, so this could not be said to be a part from the development stage.

I was recently given a drive sprocket which still had the "The Axle uses the normal 1940 brake drum with a special "Wheel Disc" to mount the drive sprocket".

I have removed the sprocket as these can be used on British/Canadian Carriers, the special 'Wheel disc' is up for trade if anyone wants it, I am located in the uk.

kevin.

[Richard Farrant]

Originally Posted by Peter Walsh

Just had a quick look through a couple of books, "Fallen Sentinel" and "The Vital Factor", and they mention that the Loyd Slave Battery Carriers were used in the armoured regiments, one per squadron. I assume that means there were more than 30 of them in Australia. Were they the only Loyds used in Australia and what happened to them i.e were they sold off like the LP2a's?

Curious,

Peter

Peter,
According to an old guide book from Pucka' Tank museum, "about 50 were used in Australia", this was the Starting and Charging version. No mention of other versions.

regards, Richard

[shaun]

Yeah spot on guys , definitely Loyd - I have just checked it against the axle I gave in the yard. Point to not they are no good for carriers . But the sprockets are .

[ajmac]

Originally Posted by shaun

Point to not they are no good for carriers . But the sprockets are .

Good point, Loyd Drums and back plates are unique to Loyds, that was the 'big mod' that brought about the MK2. I have read a wartime report concerning the early Loyds which criticises them for terrible brake fade (steering was no longer possible) after a very short period of driving. Those early ones had the truck braking system similar in performance to a Universal Carrier drum setup. It was that bad that all MK1s were retrofited with the Girling uprated system from the MK2 in the field.

[Lynn Eades]

Alastair, just to clarify, you are talking MkI and MkII Loyds. Nothing to do with a difference between Mki and MkII U.C. brakes correct?

[ajmac]

Originally Posted by Lynn Eades

Alastair, just to clarify, you are talking MkI and MkII Loyds. Nothing to do with a difference between Mki and MkII U.C. brakes correct?

Thats right Lynn, MK1 and MK2 Loyd Carriers, I don't think UC brakes had any major changes through the Mks did they? Loyds have another rather important set of improvements but that doesn't appear to have been captured officially. Early & Late MK2s is the best way to describe them, however, I don't know what year early changed to late.

[Bob McNeill]

This is where some of the bits went, spotted at Dubbo Truck and Tractor display.

[Mike Cecil]

Richard,

'About 50' is 'about right': there were 50 Lloyd's delivered to Australia. Not too successful. In 1945, the 'guts' of the starting and charging circuitry were transferred to jeeps - much nippier and more reliable.

Mike C

[Richard Farrant]

Originally Posted by Mike Cecil

Richard,

'About 50' is 'about right': there were 50 Lloyd's delivered to Australia. Not too successful. In 1945, the 'guts' of the starting and charging circuitry were transferred to jeeps - much nippier and more reliable.

Mike C

Thanks Mike. Interesting note about the jeeps.

[easo]

This is a close as I have for a Lyyod hub.
Front






Regards Easo