WTB: FN Cdn EX1 items

[mike mckinley]

that sir is one beautiful piece of history!! personally, with no hope of ever finding a c1, opted for an indian 1a1 model which has been tastefully deactivated. i have been slowly collecting the pieces to "canadianize" it. this is not for the purpose of passing it off as a c1, but rather to try, as close as possible, to represent what one would have looked like. so far i have managed to get the canadian bayonet, blank firing device, bolt cover, speed loader, sling, cleaning kit, and the simfire device. kudos for trying to preserve a very important, and rare piece of canadian military history

[rob love]

Collector's source was selling the C1A1s for $750, but that was almost 8 years back...they are long out of stock now. However, there are hundreds of the C1s in private hands here in Canada. The market for these prohibited guns is ever dwindling as the gun control hassles along with the aging owners diminishes the potential buyers.

Prices on the C1s has gone up in the last few years, but I predict that will again spiral downward in a few more years unless some advance is made in the gun restrictions. Currently, owners of these guns are not allowed to take them to a range to shoot them.

[Lynn Eades]

I take it that these are semi auto as apposed to full auto.

[rob love]

The EX series of rifles were originally selective fire. The army pinned the change levers after user trials and the steering committee decided that the guns were not good as full auto. The C1 rifles were all semi automatic. There was a variation on that with the C1D (later C1A1D) which was intended for naval boarding parties. It had the automatic change lever and was selective fire. There was also the C2 rifle, which was the LMG for the section. It featured a heavier barrel, bipod, 30 round magazine, and selective fire change lever. Seems like everyone ended up burning their hand on those naked barrels at one point.

Here in Canada the gun has to be grandfathered (in this case, registered back around 92) and the owner must be also grandfathered (in this case continuously owned a converted auto in this classs since 92). I do not fall into that class, and as well this gun had not been registered, so it is now deactivated.

The guys who do own the full auto and semi auto guns here in Canada cannot get the permits to take them to the range to shoot anymore.

[Lynn Eades]

Your C1 looks like our L1A1(made in Lithgow Australia for N.Z.) your fore wood is the same pattern as the first L1A1's. the difference looks to be that our L1A1's have a more up and down pistol grip, whereas the C1 appears to have the more sloping style of a FAL.
It is highly illegal for anyone in New Zealand (other than the military) to fire a full auto, but some people have licences to own them as collectors items, (under strict conditions)
The N.Z. army also had a heavy barrelled version in selective fire as a section LMG. Sounds very similar to the Canadian version.

[rob love]

Both those photos are actually of the EX1. Here are some photos of my C1A1 and C2A1:





I have seen a number of the NZ marked Sterlings make it onto the Cdn market, along with NZ no8 rifles and, of course, NZ marked no4s. But for some reason the NZ FNs did not make it into our market. When were they phased out of service? It may well be that they got released after the FNs became prohibited in this country.

The Canadian and the Australian FNs are very similar. There are rumours that the Canadian Arsenals Limited made some of the barrels and parts for the Australian Heavy Barrel FN, although I think I saw somewhere that this was not true. Our early C2 top covers ended up going to Australia and (with some modification) used on the Australian HB FN.
I need one of those top covers for my collection, and of course, since they were almost all exported, they are very hard to find here.

[Rob Beale]

I think they were phased out about 1990 or so. We hardly ever saw the heavy barrelled version, as they seemed to be used by units like RNZE. We had GPMG as section auto till the mid 80's when there was a problem and they were withdrawn from Infantry sections, to be replaced by Bren LMG in .303! I used to haul the ammo crates out of the rubbish trailer after shoots.

When the SLR went, we used M16A1 exclusively for a while, till the trials for a replacement selected the Steyr AUG. Made in OZ, but different to theirs in the safety catch arrangement. I recall the NZ safety catch stuck out towards your belly while you walked, and would often get knocked from Safe to semi while you walked!

I exercised with a platoon from Townsville and looked at their steyrs, but don't recall the differences now.

Incidentally, we heard from School of Infantry staff who conducted the trialls that many preferred the Canadian M16A2, which had a longer barrel life than the US version they trialled. Politics ruled and they went with the Steyr.

Back to topic...I still prefer the feel of the SLR, so well done on your preservation of important history.
Rob
ex RNZIR

[Jon Skagfeld]

Originally Posted by rob love

The EX series of rifles were originally selective fire. The army pinned the change levers after user trials and the steering committee decided that the guns were not good as full auto. The C1 rifles were all semi automatic. There was a variation on that with the C1D (later C1A1D) which was intended for naval boarding parties. It had the automatic change lever and was selective fire. There was also the C2 rifle, which was the LMG for the section. It featured a heavier barrel, bipod, 30 round magazine, and selective fire change lever. Seems like everyone ended up burning their hand on those naked barrels at one point.

Here in Canada the gun has to be grandfathered (in this case, registered back around 92) and the owner must be also grandfathered (in this case continuously owned a converted auto in this classs since 92). I do not fall into that class, and as well this gun had not been registered, so it is now deactivated.

The guys who do own the full auto and semi auto guns here in Canada cannot get the permits to take them to the range to shoot anymore.

Rob:

You didn't make mention of the FN C1A2...the 8L series, last of production, which had three mods which CAL suggested to DND that it have its own separate NSN. Didn't happen of course...lots of confusion with Wpns Tech and Bin Rats.

I've traced mine from manufacture to OPP in Englehart, to UK for FTR, then back to Canada.

Lovely piece of kit!

[rob love]

C1A2 nomenclature was not adopted. The nickname "8L" series is usually applied to those rifles, o fwhich around 5000 were made. My C1A1 is also from the OPP lot, which collectors source brought in to the country. If I recall, my rifle was from the Missauga detachment. I have been keeping my eyes open for a non-8L C1.

[EDDIE]

HELLO, ANYONE KNOW THE VALUE OF AN ISHAPORE FN RIFLE HERE IN CANADA? THANKS. EDDIE.