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#1
30-01-09, 22:54
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Color of QOR 60th Co. Vehicle Marking
Mark,
Thanks for the additional reference on the placement of the markings. I'll change the position of the ones on the front of my truck to match the regulations. As for the background color for the "60", I did contact the curator at the QOR museum before having the markings made and was advised that the dark green was the proper shade. I used as a reference the green background on their opening page and was advised that it needed to be a bit darker. See http://www.qor.com/ Are you saying that there were two shades of green, one for the vehicle marking and the one I used which was for something else other than a vehicle? I appreciate very much your interest in helping me get this right! Thanks! Jim 
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#2
31-01-09, 01:02
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Yes, the shade of green as per my earlier posting was the correct one for the background colour of a vehicle Arm of Service marking for the Queen's Own Rifles and all other component units of the 8th Canadian Infantry Brigade. The same holds true for the 2nd Canadian Infantry Brigade and the 5th Canadian Infantry Brigade and not to confuse you, but this same green was used by the 10th Canadian Infantry Brigade (of the 4th Cdn Armd Div) and the 11th Canadian Infantry Brigade (of the 5th Cdn Armd Div). An Arm of Service marking with a green background when seen on a vehicle in conjunction with either of the 1st, 2nd or 3rd Canadian Infantry Division formation sign would identify that vehicle as belonging to the intermediate (or second) brigade of the infantry division whose formation sign the vehicle bore. In the case of the 10th and 11th Canadian Infantry Brigades, the green background colour of the Arm of Service marking on their vehicles, in conjunction with either of the 4th or 5th Canadian Armoured Division formation sign would identify that vehicle as belonging to the infantry brigade of the armoured division whose formation sign the vehicle bore. I fear that when you contacted the QOR Museum curator, he may have misunderstood your question/request, because the answer he gave of dark green (or rifle green) being the proper shade, is correct for the identifying colour of the Regiment (used for unit signs, company signs, etc., within the unit lines), but was not the correct colour used for the background colour of the Queen's Own Rifles AoS marking while they served as a component part of the 8th Canadian Infantry Brigade of the 3rd Canadian Infantry Division. I'll give you another example, the background colour of the Arm of Service marking of The Royal Canadian Regiment during the period of the Second World War was red, but the identifying colours of the Regiment were then (as now) blue, amber, black. What I'm trying to explain, is that, YES, the background colour used on a unit's Arm of Service marking was something totally different and separate from the identifying colour(s) of a unit(/regiment) - one had nothing to do with the other. I hope this helps. Cheers Jim, I forgot to mention that the two other 'Rifle' regiments that served in the 3rd Canadian Infantry Division, The Royal Winnipeg Rifles and The Regina Rifle Regiment, even though they were both 'Rifle' regiments, both had red as the background colour of their respective Arm of Service marking - both were component units of the 7th Canadian Infantry Brigade - the senior (or first brigade) of the 3rd Canadian Infantry Division.
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Mark Last edited by Mark W. Tonner; 31-01-09 at 01:35. Reason: Additional information
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#3
31-01-09, 02:26
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Mark,
Thanks so much for your very well written response to my question regarding the shades of green. I'll certainly have new markings using the shade of green you identified as correct made up for the front and back of my truck! Best regards, Jim
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#4
31-01-09, 02:56
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Glad I could help. I also just wanted to show you three photos of vehicles of the 3rd Canadian Infantry Division from 1944-45 in NWE. Although they are black & white, you can see how the french grey background of the formation sign (circled in red) shows up as a light background to the maple leaf. Attachements 1 & 2: The Cameron Highlanders of Ottawa (M.G.) - the divisional Machine Gun Battalion Credit: Lieut. H. Gordon Aikman / Canada Dept. of National Defence / Library and Archives Canada / PA-140192 Credit: Lieut. Donald I. Grant / Canada Dept. of National Defence / Library and Archives Canada / PA-138372 Attachment 3: 4th Light Anti-Aircraft Regiment, R.C.A. - the divisional Light Anti-Aircraft Regiment Credit: Lieut. Ken Bell / Canada Dept. of National Defence / Library and Archives Canada / PA-162434 Cheers
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Mark
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#5
01-02-09, 02:53
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3rd Division Vehicle Marking
Mark,
Thanks for the photos of the three vehicles with the 3rd Division markings. Below is a better photo of the 3rd Division marking I used on my truck. It's affixed to the side of my Toyota truck which is a pewter gray. By the way, I took this picture in some good sunlight. Let me know what you think of the color now. Regards, Jim
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#6
01-02-09, 18:12
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Quote:
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Mark
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#7
01-02-09, 21:09
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Lets stir this up.
When Jim marked his truck I gave him copies of ORIGINAL marking instructions for the truck. This clearly showed where they went front and back and what size they were.
The drawing he submitted is the original drawing! The file name is "Canadian Corps vehicle Serial Numbers and Colour Markings, Copy 17, Secret" It shows Div. Sign on the right and Unit side on the left. You will note it is reversed on the back of the vehicle, so they are on the same side front to back. . Next. No QOR marked vehicle ever had the leaf green colour under the 60 The Unit background was a dark geen, the same dark green that backed up the badge on their beret. Bill Beardmore (anybody remember him?) had an original decal tac sign and Unit sign and the colour was French Grey under the yellow maple leaf (so who the hell had gold paint?) It was dark Green under the 60. This was verified by Stan Biggs (WW2 Carrier Commander), Jack Martin, Mortar Crew commander, and Clay Bell who painted these signs on in WW2. Used these details to mark my 15 cwt truck when I did it 10 years ago.
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