Richie's Mk1 Restoration - Page 7

RichardT10829 · #**181** 02-05-11, 10:45

no lip on the top this may have been machined off at some point perhaps ?

Richard Farrant · #**182** 02-05-11, 11:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardT10829

yes that would be a stud box where i am from dude hahahahahaha there are propper ones on the market but doing the nut method is what i usually do

Richie,

To be correct, a stud box is for fitting studs. It is usually made from a piece of hex bar threaded all the way through with a set screw in one end, when the hex is screwed on to a stud, the set screw or bolt is tightened down and stud wound in. They do not work in a unscrewing motion, for that you need one of the different types of stud remover, or as Tony says, two nuts locked together, which works well in the absence of a tool.

RichardT10829 · #**183** 02-05-11, 15:03

DAMMIT Rich......i looked on the forum and thought you had ID'd my engine........

shaun · #**184** 02-05-11, 17:12

Richie i will ID your engine for you "ITS A V8 Ford !!!! " he he he he

RichardT10829 · #**185** 02-05-11, 18:05

i am wondering if it is a merc ?

anyways i have extracted all the studs now and anything else that bolts into the block.... all went well except one stud which i have sheered off in the block... guess iam stronger than i thought ! on a positive note at least it pulled now before i had gone through countless gaskets and frustration !

GIT !!!!

next step is to get it chemically cleaned and the cam bearings pressed out (and new ones put in)

get the block drilled out now darnit....

bring home, paint and pollish the faces etc prior to rebuild.

Richard Farrant · #**186** 02-05-11, 18:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardT10829

... all went well except one stud which i have sheered off in the block...

get the block drilled out now darnit....

You can often get the broken part out by welding a nut on the stud, the heat will expand the stud then when it cools may break its hold on the thread and unscrew, nothing to loose really.

eddy8men · #**187** 02-05-11, 20:23

i sheared a bolt trying to get a brake drum off a churchill gearbox today and ended up using the tried and tested nut and weld trick, trouble is everytime i tried to undo it the weld broke and the nut just came off the stud, i'll try again tomorrow when i've more time.

eddy

RichardT10829 · #**188** 02-05-11, 20:32

my only concerns with this method in this case is the amount of heat i would need to put into the metal to make it work may cause issues with the casting.

I am going to pop up to a local engineering firm where i used to get my race stuff done so i am sure they can remove it for me before honing and cleaning the block

i was gobsmacked that the engine only has 3 mains !!!! my mini had three mains and the crank was half the length of the V8... under load the engines were prone to crank flex which funnily enough used to blow out the center and furthest main away from the clutch !!! and i even had an end cap let go on the rolling road... we used to fix this issue by milling the center main and putting a strap and ARP bolts on. although overkill i may do this with this engine too. i have seen the strap mods for the V8's before and when it comes to these things i am a bit of a belt and braces kinda geek.

Ron Pier · #**189** 02-05-11, 23:06

What about 'Spark Erosion' to remove the stud? There must be someone up norf! Ron

Richard Farrant · #**190** 02-05-11, 23:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichardT10829

my only concerns with this method in this case is the amount of heat i would need to put into the metal to make it work may cause issues with the casting

The amount of heat from arc welding a nut on the stud is unlikely to harm the block, but will be enough to release the stud.

hrpearce · #**191** 03-05-11, 00:52

Where there is swing room like you have I drill a length of flat and weld it onto the stud, it's easier to get a good weld, then use a light hammer to tap the strap this also helps gently break the hold after the heat has done it's part.

RichardT10829 · #**192** 03-05-11, 09:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Pier

What about 'Spark Erosion' to remove the stud? There must be someone up norf! Ron

Smiles, Rosalind Rebores, British engines, to name but a few... the block has to go in for honing and steam clean anyways so will get them to drill out the stud

The Bedford Boys · #**193** 03-05-11, 12:04

A turbo twinky mini engine can get over 250bhp richie (yes I'm a fellow mini nut

).... Lets see what you can get out of this bad boy

ajmac · #**194** 03-05-11, 12:24

Richie,
Are you fitting new pistons during the rebuild? If so what type are you using...I have to buy a set for mine, it's a 3.9L rather than the eariler spec 3.6L Flathead so requires the 3 3/16th pistons. I've spoken to a company in the US who do new sets with rings, just saving up to by them now!
Are you going to fit electronic ignition? I've got a little kit I built to use the points to drive a transister so that they never wear out, made quite a difference on a TR6, Spitfire and 3.5RV8 I tried it on. The plus side being that you don't have to damage any of the original parts and by just moving one wire can return the points to there original operation....I am going to have to solder up a new one as I just remembered that I lent it to a mate and he left it on his Series 3 when he sold it :-)

RichardT10829 · #**195** 03-05-11, 17:17

using stock pistons i have got new rings for them iam thinking about elec ignition... i vernier'd my crank and pots and found the following

mains: 2.481

B/ends: 2.134

Bores: 3.210

the data plate shows it to be 010 on the mains and b/ends and 030 on the pistons so what that means in old money i dont know hahahaha i think its an early ford unit.

i will be putting ARP head studs in for sure having sheared another two today.... luckily my pals easy outs seem to have done the trick but make no bones about it the head studs in mine are like toffee !!!! further enforces in my mind why they should be changed or upgraded when building an engine....

RichardT10829 · #**196** 03-05-11, 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Bedford Boys

A turbo twinky mini engine can get over 250bhp richie (yes I'm a fellow mini nut

).... Lets see what you can get out of this bad boy

ahh yes the K series twinky heads are good... Tom Fenton got excelent results with his.....that said Benross got some massive BHP out of the A series setup i beleive circa 240 was the count on the rollers running 28cc heads, phase 2 cam and a truck load of boost (circa 20psi)

great fun !

Lynn Eades · #**197** 03-05-11, 21:28

Your motor is 3 3/16 (Merc 3 3/16 = 3.1875") and about .030" os. You can get os pistons out to about .080" os. state side. apparently they will normally go out to about this oversize.

RichardT10829 · #**198** 03-05-11, 23:48

cheers so with this being an early one (with the drain holes in the base where it bolts to the sump) does that mean its the 100hp unit ?

ajmac · #**199** 04-05-11, 10:28

Going by your bore dimensions it's the post 1939 24 stud '100hp' that's the 239CI 3.9Litre also known as the 'Merc'. According to the parts books Ford US and possibly Canada manufactured the 24 stud as an 85Bhp (3.6Litre) and also as the 100Bhp (3.9Litre), the 3.9 being introduced in 1939 for the Mercury car range hence the 'Merc' tag. From what I gather there was a tweek on the CR at some point which had the names changed from 85Bhp to 90Bhp and the 95Bhp to 100Bhp. That was for US, I'm not sure what happened in the UK or Canada. I've got a nice period engineering journal report on the 'all new' 24 stud of 1939 which I picked up in the US, I'll get is scanned in and posted.

RichardT10829 · #**200** 04-05-11, 11:41

Thanks Alistair it is appreciated..... got the block totally stripped out now but iam going to need 3 helicoils done for snapped studs i cannot beleive the studs go through the deck into the water jacket !!! i highly recomend folks replace the head studs on a rebuild unless it is known that the ones in the block are ok.... the threads were pulled on most of mine and i know i keep saying this, but the studs themselves are like toffee !!!!

George McKenzie · #**201** 04-05-11, 17:13

If you have the Mecury engine you won't be disapointed .The extra horse power makes it a different carrier to drive .Jim DeBock told me that the way to tell if it is a Murcury is that there is a small knob on the crank through . I have the factory parts manual for these engines if you need some pictures . Trivia ?? How many carriers can you restore in a liftime ? It would be interesting to keep a record of the time one spends doing one .

RichardT10829 · #**202** 05-05-11, 08:54

George if you could post up pics it would be appreciated... looking at other Merc blocks of the era they seem to have a triangle hole and two circle holes in the block where as mine is a triangle, a circle, and a trapezoid.... this is so confusing ! is it possible to use a merc crank and rods in a ford block and vise versa ?

Lynn Eades · #**203** 05-05-11, 11:32

Yes you can use the Mercury crank in the ford block. The Merc. has a 4.0" throw, so the piston height is different. If you have one you are lucky. Ford throw is 3 3/4"
The water holes at the centre of the blocks changed shape at times and is a way of identifying the year of production.
Alistair, I have heard (not substantiated) that the "increase in the H.p. was to do more with the increased octane rating of the available fuel, than any particular improvement of any engine component.
The merc crank has a circle cast into the front counterweight, and has a larger gallery plug in the front big end drilling ( Merc=5/8" plug. Ford= 3/8" plug)
There is a lot of info available on the web.

RichardT10829 · #**204** 08-05-11, 12:46

right guys whoever called it being the 239 lump got it right... but to be precise it is the 1939 Merc 239ci unit and is identified as such from the core plugs in the sump rails and the triangle / circle / trapezoid shape in the face of the block there is a raised 99 on the block which denotes this as a 1939 engine.

i have registered on a v8 forum.... these chaps are to v8's what you guys are to carriers!

here is a link to my query thread

http://flatheadv8.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2171

George McKenzie · #**205** 10-05-11, 00:43

Richie I tried to post from my scanner but can't make it work so I sent you an em but it came back Do you know about the site flathead specs-85 to 100mid.htm It shows all the flathead engines the water jacket holes that identify the year of the moter .em me at geomck@wispernet.ca

RichardT10829 · #**206** 18-09-11, 13:58

well I have finally got a roof over my head, just putting the electrics back in then i want my air lines with plug in points along the walls too.... after that the carrier can go back in and the work can once again commence. i have my tracked test in November so i am looking forward to that, all be it slightly nervous.

and a comparison of what i started with to now.... gone from a 10ft x 16ft garage to 30sq meters

D Ellery · #**207** 19-09-11, 07:41

Has your neighbour noticed that their lawn seems a tad bit smaller

You'll want to protect the concrete threshold into the garage as the tracks love to niggle away at the edge.

RichardT10829 · #**208** 19-09-11, 12:26

I have yet to put the driveway in... the gravel you see is going to get smashed into the ground as hardcore, then the concrete base will go down

Ben · #**209** 19-09-11, 21:16

Nice work. I've just moved from a garage that was just about big enough to fit the hull, to a much bigger workshop. It makes life much easier.

Ben

RichardT10829 · #**210** 29-11-11, 16:35

well she finally came home Sunday afternoon... rolled her into the garage popped her back onto axle stands and whipped the bogeys back off ! now i can crack on... i managed to get the air ducts offered up but they will need to come off to be restored (they are originals in a bad way)... had an interesting chat with Jim on facepoop about my dash... i was going to leave the pitting in but Jim was of the opinion it should be smoothed out with some bondo and made new again.... whats your thoughts peeps ?

loaded her on with a cherry picker this time rather than using a hand winch !

home safe and sound