"Indian Pattern odd job"

[nuyt]

Bad quality. From Stabelan Magazine, vehicle of the Gadja Merah or Red (=Horny) Elefant Battalion KNIL, Bali, 1946.

Nuyt

Overvalwagens!

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Nuyt, bad quality, but still a great photo of an Indian Pattern FAT! This is the variant with the so-called armoured cab, but I don't know if it was actually a Cab 13 clad in armour, or whether it was a makeshift Indian cab.

Thanks!
Hanno

[Stellan Bojerud (RIP)]

Was not the entire Y-Brigade called "Gadjah Merah"? Anyhow the unit was formed in Siam of KNIL ex-POWs. It landed on Bali March 2nd 1946 and left for Sumatra in Dec 1946 leaving 12th Inf Bn on Bali.

Stellan

[Les Freathy]

Heres one to ponder over the hol,s a 15cwt 200 gall tanker but why the crude front end, normallyif the original cab was so badly damaged it would be replaced. I await the comments with interest
cheers

Les

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Les Freathy
Heres one to ponder over...but why the crude front end

Les,

Could you please let me know where/when this pic was taken?

In the meantime, compare it with these trucks:



Cheers,
H.

[Les Freathy]

Hanno
Sorry old mate i have no details at all on the photo obviously the far east, i would say both shots are from the same fabrication shop yours being the GS version. a quick glance says Bedford but there not, it will be interesting to see how this one develops

[Keith Webb]

Short wheelbase, 20" wheels... looks like cab 11/12 doghouse... and the rear wheel arch looks suspiciously gun tractor. At a guess I'd say it could've started out as a 7A2 or something similar. Even the fuel tank has the filler in the right place.

It's facing the opposite way, but have a look...

http://imagecontrol.com.au/oldcmp/Im...act/cgt11b.jpg

Only thing is it looks like the sheet metal has been replaced around it - the piece between where the passenger door is a bit longer, and also the door above is missing.

[Don Birnie]

Keith, I think your on the right track but I think it may be a cab 13. The back body was similair to the 7A2 but the door was pushed back towards the rear wheel well so the cab 13 could be used.

Don

[Richard Farrant]

I have theory on this one. The pictures appear to be in the Far East. Is it possible that CMP FAT's were shipped in CKD form and only the chassis running gear arrived, the body work was lost in shipping, ie ship sunk or something like that. In order to make something out of a rolling chassis, local body work was made as simple as possible, note no curved panels.

Richard

[cliff]

Richard I tend to agree with you on the CKD bodies not arriving and local bodywork being made up for the chassis.

cheers
Cliff

[Keith Webb]

Originally posted by Don Birnie
Keith, I think your on the right track but I think it may be a cab 13. The back body was similair to the 7A2 but the door was pushed back towards the rear wheel well so the cab 13 could be used.

Yes, I think that would explain the difference... and it would also mean the bodies were shipped with the vehicles - and it was found they were impractical for anything other than their original use so they were heavily modded.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally posted by Richard Farrant
I have theory on this one.

Good one - see http://www.mapleleafup.nl/cmpvehicles/fat_i_pat.html

H.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Re. the "Indian Pattern odd job".

As far as I know, this an Indian Pattern FAT with the so-called armoured cab. However, I don't know if it was actually an armoured cab, or simply a makeshift Indian cab because of a lack of Cab 13 sheet metal?

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Another picture of the "odd job" was posted by Nuyt on the Overvalwagen forum:


http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s...redcmpskit.jpg

[Keith Webb]

This is also weird and looks to have cab 12 components, from the same forum:


http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s...redtruckbp.jpg

[nuyt]

One of the reasons I think this truck was armoured is the type of mudguards used, They are sort of similar in concept to several armoured car mudguard types, even the Humber a/c and the car Keith posted.
All other FAT variants have the normal mudguards....

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by nuyt

One of the reasons I think this truck was armoured is the type of mudguards used, They are sort of similar in concept to several armoured car mudguard types, even the Humber a/c and the car Keith posted.
All other FAT variants have the normal mudguards....

But that is because most likely India was supplied with chassis only, and had to make up all the sheet metal parts like mudguards, cab, etc. in relatively simple workshops. The cab parts are most likely made of sheet metal because it looks too thin for armour plating. Also, in those days, they would most likely have bolted or riveted the armour. And there is no armour in front of the radiator.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Another one of those "odd job" tractors serving with Dutch troops in Indonesia shortly after WW2. Photo via fellow KTR member Arjan van den Hoek.

[Frantisek Nachlinger]

..does anybody know how many indian pattern FAT survived?

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Frantisek Nachlinger

..does anybody know how many indian pattern FAT survived?

...none - that I know of?

[Hanno Spoelstra]

More pictures of one of the oddball trucks based on the C291QH 4x4 FAT chassis.

These two pictures show the same truck in service with Dutch armed forces who are repairing electricity cables somewhere along the route Soerabaja - Modjokerto, Indonesia, March 1947.


Source: http://proxy.handle.net/10648/15d30a...3-fd46fec9d7d2 | http://proxy.handle.net/10648/c62751...f-b8d8b0dc2cd0

[Alex van de Wetering]

Originally Posted by Les Freathy

Heres one to ponder over the hol,s a 15cwt 200 gall tanker but why the crude front end, normallyif the original cab was so badly damaged it would be replaced. I await the comments with interest
cheers
Les

Comparing the rear body shape and spare wheel to the picture Les posted, I think this is another Tanker... in Dutch service in the East Indies.
And another odd job Indian Pattern in Dutch service during a funeral service for a soldier.



source: https://nimh-beeldbank.defensie.nl

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Nice find. I recall you posted the last picture in the since-lost Indian Pattern FAT thread.

I think I found the reasoning about these Odd Jobs - see http://www.mapleleafup.net/forums/sh...564#post203564

[Hanno Spoelstra]

This picture shows the rear body of an Indian pattern FAT with makeshift cab (note angular mudguard and cab), again in French Indochina:

"The ambushes nourished a permanent feeling of insecurity, immobilizing scores of troops in the sector, undermining the morale by their murderous repetition and permitting the recuperation of weapons and material (Photo CMIDOM)". From: René Bail and Jean-Pierre Bernier, Indochine 1945-1954. 1.La Reconquête. Editions Heimdal, p.42.

Source: http://www.mapleleafup.nl/cmpvehicles/fat_i_pat.html

PS: I have moved some pictures of this type of truck I posted in Another Indian Pattern odd job: "C291QH 4x4 FAT for Royal Engineers" to this thread.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Dutch troops on Bali, 1948.

Slightly better version of one of the above pictures.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Now with updated links:

Originally Posted by Alex van de Wetering

Comparing the rear body shape and spare wheel to the picture Les posted, I think this is another Tanker... in Dutch service in the East Indies.

Objectnummer: 2002-319-1
Titel: Verblijf van het 8e (4e) Bataljon Regiment Stoottroepen op Malakka. Het tentenkamp te Chaah.
Datering: 1946-01-08

https://nimh-beeldbank.defensie.nl/f...f-23e5dbadb0c6

And:

Originally Posted by Alex van de Wetering

And another odd job Indian Pattern in Dutch service during a funeral service for a soldier.

Objectnummer: 2002-288-1
Titel: Verblijf en optreden van het 7e (3e) Bataljon Regiment Stoottroepen in Nederlands-Indië. Begrafenis van een militair.
Datering van 1946 tot 1948

https://nimh-beeldbank.defensie.nl/f...a-4a981fef9fee

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Frantisek Nachlinger

..does anybody know how many indian pattern FAT survived?

Could this be one?!? It is located in the Far North (South Australia) of all places!



Harley Liebelt wrote (https://www.facebook.com/groups/9458...63715576988438):

Hey guys, have an old Blitz here just putting the feelers out to see if anyone is interested in her?
Been told it has a Commer Knocker motor which does run on the back with a post hole drill and a ford side valve v8 upfront.
Located in far North SA but we have the means to transport it within reason.

[Hanno Spoelstra]

See how the radiator hoses run horizontal. But the radiator cap doesn't sit in the same place as the original one, though...




Have asked the owner if the radiator is set low in the chassis and has a hole in the radiator core to pass the hand crank through.

[Alex van de Wetering]

Could this be one?!? It is located in the Far North (South Australia) of all places!

Hanno, I'd say it's either a very rare original.....or a replica that someone did based on pictures. There are too many similarities for it to be just a coincidence ....slope of the nose, rounded edges, position of the headlights shape of fenders, cutout for the steering box. Than again, there are also differences.....headlights mounted ON of the panel, in stead of behind, edge along the fenders, slight difference in grille.

I hope the owner is able to share some more info on the history of the truck and some pictures...Radiator as you say, but maybe also have a look if there is any other paint left under the orange.....data plates? ....


it's definately just as ugly as the original

[Hanno Spoelstra]

The owner shared a picture of the radiator “in fact it has a hole for a hand crank to pass through the radiator!”