140 Crated Spitfires buried in Burma (Myanmar)?

[Wayne McGee]

Being no expert in the field, I would think that ground penetrating radars would work best in a medium that was as dense as possible, then refelct from any voids present. Mine shafts thru bedrock sounds ideal, however wooden crates in rotting organic topsoil seems less so. Eh?

Cheers

Wayne

[Lang]

I think you could bet the farm that the guys involved did not have any fancy equipment hanging from helicopters in Burma.

The most common form of Ground Penetrating Radar and the most likely to be used, IF it ever was, is the push trolley style widely used by archeologists to seek out ancient structures. The same style equipment is used by companies looking for power and pipe lines, various rock strata, voids such as sink-holes or old mines and wells.

The display is highly subject to professional interpretation - there is no "picture" like airborne radar or underwater sonar and the average person would have no chance of identifying anything.

Interesting subject to Google if you have a spare moment.

Lang

[Lang]

Here is a photo of a Spitfire in a crate being unloaded at Cocos Island about the same period our mystery Spitfires were being unloaded in Burma.

We are not looking for a hole dug by pick and shovel, it must have taken some serious equipment to bury 20 ( or 140) of these.

Just the dirt pile would be huge. Quite apart from the dirt required to put back on top of the buried box they would have to remove about 100 cubic metres (the rough box volume). Let's say we overload a CMP tipper with 5 metres of dirt that is 20 loads per box to take it "somewhere" - 400 truck loads for 20 boxes or 2,800 truck loads for 140 boxes. If they just pushed the spoil up in a pile, Everest would only be the second highest mountain in the world and we would not need ground penetrating radar to find them.

[Mrs Vampire]

to my mind I don't understand the burial story. If they had a bull dozer capable of digging a huge hole and burying them . I presume they would get crushed in the process. Why not just doze over them or even easier throw some petrol over em and strike a match.

The notion that in 1945 they would be coming back for them or waned the Burmese govt to have them eventually just doesn't make sense.

If there was a need for Spits there were a hundred or so of em sitting in Australia . if the need was to simply disable them take the props off and dump them at sea . In Australia the props were taken of the Mozies and Spits to prevent anyone using them after a wag took a spit for a taxi.

if they were in boxes disassembled it seems it would be an easier task just to destroy all of the port wings or somehing rather than dig a huge hole tediously place all the boxes in the hole then bury them.

So I am giving odds on this being a Hoax along the lines of the 1990's hoax about fishing up sunken aircraft of the Qld coast that was so enthusiastically supported by Joh Bejelkie .

I dont doubt there are still treasures to be found...theP-40 found in the desert the FW 190 still in the black Forrest and the amazing junk turning up in the former Soviet union Guy Blacks Demons out of Afghanistan . but this story just don't do it.

[Keith Webb]

When I interviewed Tony Gaze, one of our top scoring aces he told me in Germany he went into a recently liberated airfield hoping for a Fw190 and found most had the port oleo partly cut with a hacksaw.

He had better luck at the factory where he took one straight from the production line (possibly it's first flight) after swapping an earlier model so their numbers still matched. It flew badly, one wing low.

[Frank v R]

burying aircraft was not a new concept at the end of the war , the Americans disposed of a large number of aircraft just outside Flagstaff AR by digging 2 one mile trenches and taxing the aircraft into these and then dozing the dirt over top , all that remained were the tails sticking out of the dirt, C-47, C-46, B-24 and B-17 aircraft, now knowing how well items were crated during the war a dozer moving dirt over these crates would not bother them much , remember that these crates would have been made to multi stack in the hold of a Liberty ship , the last thing the allies wanted at that point was more aircraft, remember Kingman AZ , B-24 aircraft in India being chopped up and left and when India gained independence they put a good number back together and flew them for years, this is where all the B-24's flying today came from including the one in Ottawa, here in Canada the RCAF sold P-40's out of Pat Bay BC for $75.00 ea.and most of the flying P-40's in the US have CDN history, look up photos for Chino CA at the end of the war and see what happened to the P-40, P-39, P-38's ,stacked like cordwood,it would also depend on who paid for these aircraft ,lendlease money?and the allies did not want just anyone to have these weapons.

[Bruce MacMillan]

Here's the latest info. Dig to begin in January.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20515659

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Pictures - finally!

They found the crates and are not wasting any time to get them back in the air!

Captions:
"Civilian workers running the wing of a Supermarine Spitfire Mark VIII out of its crate prior to assembly"
"RAF mechanics, assisted by civilian workers, lift a Supermarine Spitfire Mark VIII onto twin supports during assembly of the aircraft"

[Phil Waterman]

Hi Hanno

Good one, but you should have left of the captions, would have been interesting to see how fast that would have gone around the world in the aircraft community, might even have made the evening news.

Cheers Phil

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Phil Waterman

Good one, but you should have left of the captions, would have been interesting to see how fast that would have gone around the world in the aircraft community, might even have made the evening news.

Hi Phil,

Talking about a good one, how about this one?!?!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/history/w...irmingham.html (thanks to Henk Minne)

H.

[Bruce MacMillan]

so we should know something in 6 weeks??

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-humber-20910980

[Little Jo]

Hi All

I know a lot of us MLU guys have been following this story since it first broke last year. It has been an interesting topic to follow, though a lot of us can't see that these crates, if genuine, could still be intact after so many years in the ground in tropical wet conditions. But I would love for it to be true and there seem too many people, including the prime minister of Great Britain being involved so suggest there were actual planes buried at the end of WW2.

Today in our state newspaper, the Adelaide Advertiser, there was a small article stating that a team from the UK had arrived in Burma. So I will continue to follow this thread with interest as it is just the sort of thing I would have loved to be part of.

Cheers

Tony

[Keith Webb]

Yes it's hit the Melbourne press too. Does that mean it's all true?

Originally Posted by Little Jo

Hi All

I know a lot of us MLU guys have been following this story since it first broke last year. It has been an interesting topic to follow, though a lot of us can't see that these crates, if genuine, could still be intact after so many years in the ground in tropical wet conditions. But I would love for it to be true and there seem too many people, including the prime minister of Great Britain being involved so suggest there were actual planes buried at the end of WW2.

Today in our state newspaper, the Adelaide Advertiser, there was a small article stating that a team from the UK had arrived in Burma. So I will continue to follow this thread with interest as it is just the sort of thing I would have loved to be part of.

Cheers

Tony

[Little Jo]

Originally Posted by Keith Webb

Yes it's hit the Melbourne press too. Does that mean it's all true?

Hi Keith
Gees mate, I sure hope they find something as it would be a great anti climax after all the thread time we have given it since the news of the "alleged" find was announced. Anyway it will, or should be an interesting dig. Probably end up like "Time Team " and find nothing but an old shoe or something.

Cheers

Tony

[Keith Webb]

Originally Posted by Little Jo

Hi Keith
Gees mate, I sure hope they find something as it would be a great anti climax after all the thread time we have given it since the news of the "alleged" find was announced. Anyway it will, or should be an interesting dig. Probably end up like "Time Team " and find nothing but an old shoe or something.

Cheers

Tony

I enjoy Time Team but I can just see it now: "Geophys let us down AGAIN!"

[Private_collector]

Yes, but will they only have three days to do the dig, and be lead by Baldrick?

[Little Jo]

Hey Guys

That's what I love about the MLU fraternity we can aways find fun in all we do, right or wrong. I am sure we will hear more from the dig site to keep us in suspense.

Cheers

Tony

[Richard Farrant]

Originally Posted by Private_collector

Yes, but will they only have three days to do the dig, and be lead by Baldrick?

............as he runs around waving his arms and saying, "we will dig here ........here ........... and here"

[Lang]

Latest report in today's paper. "We have dug a hole and found waterlogged wood which we believe is a Spitfire case. As soon as we pump the water out we expect to find the aircraft in excellent condition"

Good luck!

[Little Jo]

Originally Posted by Lang

Latest report in today's paper. "We have dug a hole and found waterlogged wood which we believe is a Spitfire case. As soon as we pump the water out we expect to find the aircraft in excellent condition"

Good luck!

Hi Lang

Lookslike they may have hit the jackpot, starting to get interesting, I hope they release constant reports and post photos. Looking forward to the next installment.

Cheers

Tony

[motto]

Waterlogged wood huh? Don't expect to see them flying any time soon then.

Aircraft disposal at the end of the war was generally accompanied by wholesale butchery. I well remember visiting a pile of aircraft debris the size of a house at Malahang beach just outside Lae, PNG back in the '70s. This was all that remained of an unknown number of aircraft that were reputed to have been chopped up and fed into a smelter brought in for the purpose. The pile was made up of the non aluminium stuff the scrappies didn't want such as armour plate, stainless steel heat shielding, ammunition feed ducting etc.

It's probably been cleaned up by a later generation of scrappies but at the time provided good pickings for the aircraft restoration fraternity.

There was another site just outside Finchaven where numerous P40's had been disposed of. There were remains scattered through the jungle and walking down the creek there were wings and fuselages sticking out of the bank from the ones that were buried.

David

[Marc van Aalderen]

Originally Posted by Lang

Latest report in today's paper. "We have dug a hole and found waterlogged wood which we believe is a Spitfire case. As soon as we pump the water out we expect to find the aircraft in excellent condition"

Good luck!

So they might turn out to be Seafires then? Of the ditched variety..

[Mrs Vampire]

well as something to look at until the spits turn up . That's Laverton ....Gordons Yard. He wrecked the one and only Hurricane that came to Australia a photo of which I have in this series.

[easo]

Originally Posted by Gina Vampire

to my mind I don't understand the burial story. If they had a bull dozer capable of digging a huge hole and burying them . I presume they would get crushed in the process. Why not just doze over them or even easier throw some petrol over em and strike a match.

.

They still bury them today! http://www.couriermail.com.au/questn...-1226204896564

Admittedly with a few less parts.

Regards Easo

[Keith Webb]

Originally Posted by Gina Vampire

well as something to look at until the spits turn up . That's Laverton ....Gordons Yard. He wrecked the one and only Hurricane that came to Australia a photo of which I have in this series.

Really interesting images, Gina! Really sad to see these beautiful aircraft destroyed.

[Lang]

When I was doing my flying training at Point Cook in 1967 there were 4 Wirraways and 2 P-40's in the fire pit for the firies to practice on. The P-40's must have come from the Laverton group.

Lang

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Stop press: SPITFIRE EXCAVATED!

See attached picture courtesy of HMVF

[hrpearce]

Originally Posted by Hanno Spoelstra

Stop press: SPITFIRE EXCAVATED!

See attached picture courtesy of HMVF

Some people have way to much spare time.

[Phil Waterman]

Hi Hanno

Great photo, knowing the vagaries of internet search wonder how many people out side of MLU will find it and wonder what's up.

Good chuckle

Cheers Phil

[motto]

Looks as though the cap is still on. She's fuelled up and ready to go!

David